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Picture of pulicords
posted
When police recruits are trained to hate themselves, hate their history, and hate their sworn responsibility to provide necessary (law enforcement) services, what could possibly go wrong? What a tragedy in the making, when cops don't get the type of "training" those who hate the very notion of law enforcement want them to get! Roll Eyes

"Sue Rahr, the commission's head until she retired in March, served on President Barack Obama's 21st Century Policing Task Force. She is known for coining the concept of "guardian" policing — a contrast to the "warrior" philosophy that has been blamed for aggressive police tactics."

"They haven't even gotten close to the mandates put out," said Raymond, the Franklin County sheriff.

Among the required topics the commission has not included in its training, according to the email: implicit and explicit bias, alternatives to jailing people, the historical intersection of race and policing, and understanding local cultures."



'71 gets a gun': Graduates of Washington's police training academy unprepared to patrol streets, law enforcement leaders say

In Washington, that may very well be true. For at least a decade, the state's law enforcement academy has trained new sheriff's deputies and police officers according to standards largely not based on evidence or research-based best practices, with inconsistent instruction and tests that fail to ensure students have learned what they need to do their jobs. That's based on a 2019 review conducted on behalf of the state agency that runs the academy. Those problems remain today, multiple law enforcement officials across the state told USA TODAY. Spokane County Sheriff Ozzie Knezovich said deputies routinely come out of the four-month academy not knowing how to write reports that will hold up in court, unable to communicate with people, and with little understanding of how to handle someone having a mental health crisis.

Poor training, decades in the making

In 2018, the Washington State Criminal Justice Training Commission, which runs the state's law enforcement academy and certifies officers, hired North Carolina-based FORCE Concepts Inc. to review and revise its basic training curriculum. The company, founded by Jon Blum, a former cop and nationally esteemed curriculum developer, discovered serious deficiencies in what recruits were taught. Some learning objectives contradicted best practices or were too advanced for rookies, like the differences between various types of homicides, Blum said. Meanwhile, the academy taught key skills such as communication so broadly that it didn't account for people of different races, cultures or ages, or those with mental or sensory impairments. Knezovich said his risk manager told him to "train to the gap" left by the academy. But, he said, he realized "there's no gap here. There's a giant black hole."

To ensure recruits meet standards, his office created a six-week, post-academy training program that he estimates will cost $1.2 million next year. He tried to create his own training program entirely, but the state commission objected. At a meeting of the Washington State Sheriffs' Association on Thursday, two dozen sheriffs approved a motion expressing concern about the quality of the state's basic law enforcement academy curriculum and demanding an outside investigation, Knezovich said. "The Criminal Justice Training Commission has dropped the ball. We're not turning out good police officers,"

Franklin County Sheriff Jim Raymond told USA TODAY. Local law enforcement agencies pay 25% of the academy's $6.3 million budget, according to the commission.

USA TODAY requested a copy of portions of the commission's curriculum weeks ago. It provided a curriculum catalog, which Blum called "100 pages of fluff." The problem has been decades in the making, said Blum, who has created curricula for the Justice Department's Community Oriented Policing Services office and the International Association of Chiefs of Police. In a 2019 email to a Washington training commission staffer, Blum wrote that it "has been using Band-Aids to stop bleeding coming from an amputated limb."

The contract with Blum's company was terminated five months early, before it finished revising the curriculum. Blum said he was never told why. Commission spokeswoman Megan Saunders wrote in an email that the termination was a business decision due to "irreconcilable differences." Asked if the commission had made changes in response to Blum's review, Saunders responded, "We are always evaluating the effectiveness (of) our training. We also adjust training based on legislative mandates and suggestions from our stakeholders. We work diligently to keep training relevant and updated."

Washington is emblematic of the problems with law enforcement training across the U.S., experts said. Because there are no national standards for training at the 18,000 departments in the country, requirements vary widely, said Randy Shrewsberry, executive director of the Institute for Criminal Justice Training Reform. Gregory Gilbertson, a police practices expert based in Washington, has encouraged attorneys suing police departments in the state to consider whether the commission is liable for the officers it trains. He requested the curriculum to align his own class to state standards but received only a breakdown of hours spent on each topic.

"The officers are killing people or shooting people or using other levels of force based upon their state training," Gilbertson said. "Well then, surrender your curriculum, surrender your course outlines, your lesson plans, your lecture notes, your PowerPoints." A reputation for progressive policing Washington has been lauded as a national model for progressive policing. Its training commission recently became one of the first to offer "active bystander" training, in which officers learn how to intervene early in a situation before it escalates and someone is injured or killed.

Sue Rahr, the commission's head until she retired in March, served on President Barack Obama's 21st Century Policing Task Force. She is known for coining the concept of "guardian" policing — a contrast to the "warrior" philosophy that has been blamed for aggressive police tactics.

Washington's legislature passed a law in 2015 requiring academy recruits to undergo crisis intervention training starting in 2017. The budget required the commission to create research-based training to help law enforcement agencies reduce uses of force. That didn't happen, according to the FORCE Concepts review.

Washington's training has "been touted nationwide as being something that's great – and every time I see it, I get a little ill," said civil rights attorney James Bible. In 2018, Washington voters passed Initiative 940, which among other things required police to provide first aid to injured people and be trained to de-escalate situations and deal with people experiencing mental health crises.

The requirements were merged with another law, and it all went into effect in early 2019. Brandon Rogel, the training commission's curriculum designer, said it has been teaching to the new law since 2019. But in an email to the Spokane County Sheriff's Office, a staffer for the commission said parts of the curriculum "may be ready by the end of July."

"They haven't even gotten close to the mandates put out," said Raymond, the Franklin County sheriff. Among the required topics the commission has not included in its training, according to the email: implicit and explicit bias, alternatives to jailing people, the historical intersection of race and policing, and understanding local cultures.

"We're all in violation of state law because that says we should be providing that training already," said Knezovich, who once sat on a state board overseeing the training commission's curriculum. It was dismantled about a decade ago for budgetary reasons. What skills do police officers need? While television shows often focus on car chases and handcuffing suspects, much of policing involves mundane tasks like filling out an inventory of an arrestee's possessions and inspecting a driver's license.

"There are 900 tasks that officers have to perform well, perfectly, to do their job," said Peggy Schaefer, the certification program director for the International Association of Directors of Law Enforcement Standards and Training. "If we fail in any of them, the public gets upset; they complain." Those tasks include how to properly handcuff a suspect, legally detain someone, comfort people who are upset, and advise people of their Miranda rights. FORCE Concepts found that the Washington training commission had not conducted a valid job task analysis in two decades. Such an analysis gathers data to determine essential job tasks and is core to any job training program. Judges look for this analysis when hearing lawsuits over inadequate training. Rogel confirmed the last analysis was done in 1997, but he said it's a "myopic" way of building a statewide curriculum because it ignores unique aspects of each department.

"The duties and expectations for peace officers have changed pretty dramatically since 1997," said Michael J. Gaffney, assistant director of Washington State University Extension. He has trained and provided technical assistance to law enforcement for 25 years. "We're seeing examples all over the country on a regular basis of what happens if you don't appropriately train and supervise law enforcement," he said.

In some cases, Blum found "no obvious linkage" between what recruits were taught and learning objectives. Instructors often used PowerPoint slides as lesson plans. The academy didn't have proper testing for most of its learning objectives, he found. Detailed lesson plans should be based on the tasks officers must know how to do, and that should be determined by research and best practices, Schaefer wrote in a training standards memo for the International Association of Directors of Law Enforcement Standards and Training. "It is not enough," Schaefer wrote, "to teach from slides or provide only the slides to the participants."

Cops who struggle with the basics of law enforcement

More than a quarter of training officers surveyed by the Washington Association of Sheriffs and Police Chiefs in 2016 said recruits didn't know the basic skills required to do their jobs.

One field trainer noted that the academy's curriculum doesn't match the work officers encounter on the streets. "Their situational awareness is not present and they all lack any report writing and communication skills," he wrote. "They don't need to journal; they need to learn to write reports that will hold up in court." Officers spend roughly a day of training on report writing, said Tony Anderman, the Spokane County Sheriff's training director. Other training officers wrote that recruits did not have a working knowledge of crime scene procedures and basic case law. They struggled with the "most basic elements of law enforcement" such as safe handcuffing and body positioning.



Another training officer wrote that several recruits failed to read suspects their Miranda rights, saying they had been trained to "not shut the suspect down." (Roll Eyes [i]Since when are unsolicited statements by suspects inadmissible, just because an arresting officer didn't provide "Miranda" warnings? Why should officers "shut down" suspects that aren't being questioned???
Roll Eyes)



The survey data was provided to the state training commission, but no substantive changes were made, Anderman said. Stephen Capellas, an expert in driving instruction who has done stints at the commission since 1991, realized over a decade ago that its driver training wasn't evolving. Motor vehicle deaths are a leading cause of death for law enforcement officers. Recruit testing wasn't adequate and instructors frequently taught to the test, he said.

Capellas and other experts examined the academy's driver training and suggested improvements. But, he said, the commission did nothing. "We've told them this needs to be based more on facts," Capellas said. "We have a lot of technology in our cars, but we’re still talking about technology that’s 25 years old." Seattle shooting showed training problems

In 2016, Che Andre Taylor, 47, was shot and killed by Seattle police officers. The two officers said they recognized Taylor as a career criminal and believed he was wearing a holster with a handgun – even though he was a felon and was barred from having a gun.

The two plain-clothes officers, one carrying a rifle and the other a shotgun, ran toward Taylor from different sides as he got out of a vehicle. One officer yelled, "Show me your hands, hands up!" while the other shouted, "Get on the ground!" according to dashcam video. Gilbertson wrote in a court filing supporting the family's federal wrongful death lawsuit that the video shows Taylor tried to comply with the different commands, but he was confused.

The officers told investigators Taylor appeared to be reaching for a gun, but none was found on him. A gun was later found under the passenger seat of the car, positioned in a way a judge deemed difficult to grab. Gilbertson wrote that the plain-clothes officers didn't identify themselves as police. Their contradictory verbal commands are "the most troubling and problematic failure," he wrote.

Bible, who represents the family, said there clearly was a training issue. The department's manual on Tasers said officers should not give conflicting instructions, but a department official testified in a deposition that the rule didn't apply to firearms. "It’s the ultimate in gaslighting," Bible said. "You can write whatever you want down on paper, you can claim that this is exactly what you do, and then it’s systematically undone by the agencies, the interactions between officers, and even, I would say, at the academies."

The family's suit was settled in December for $1.5 million. Taylor's death led his brother, Andre Taylor, and his wife to found "Not This Time," a movement for police accountability. It was among the groups that pushed for the passage of Initiative 940.

"When you're dealing with people of color, there never seems to be a sense of urgency" for things to change, Andre Taylor said. "Power's on the side of the oppressor."

'71 gets a gun'

Gilbertson, who teaches criminal justice at Centralia College in Washington, said he created his own curriculum to award officers credit toward an associate's degree in criminal justice. He said many officers who trained at the academy later attended his classes and told him instructors helped recruits on tests. "Students come back and say the big joke up there is '71 gets a gun' — and a 71 is a C-,"

Gilbertson said. "Apparently that's just part of the culture there." The FORCE Concepts analysis said instructors shouldn't develop or have access to test questions. It encouraged the state to "actively recruit new instructors and begin retraining the existing pool."

Many of the Washington academy's teachers are law enforcement officers who work there for up to three years at a time. A USA TODAY review found that five of the commission's dozen basic training division officers, including the division commander, have been embroiled in high-profile incidents or lawsuits involving ethics and use of force. Gilbertson said he believes the commission is "where agencies dump their problem officers who get in trouble" because they were heavy-handed with suspects or caused workplace problems.

Commission won't share curriculum

Part of the problem, according to people who spoke with USA TODAY, is that the commission won't share its curriculum. "Are they teaching the 21-foot rule? Are they teaching the 40-foot rule?" Gilbertson said, referring to the unsafe distance between an officer and a suspect armed with a knife. "Who knows?" Without seeing the curriculum, it's hard to know the source of the information in the academy's lessons, Anderman said.

Blum's review said most of the curriculum's lessons didn't cite any sources. Training materials from other states reviewed by USA TODAY include lengthy footnotes citing studies on best practices. After weeks of emails about the curriculum, the Washington State Training Commission put its curriculum designer, Rogel, on the phone with a USA TODAY reporter. Asked whether the curriculum cites research-based best practices, he said, "We research what we teach."

After some whispering between him and Saunders, the spokeswoman, Rogel asked if he could take a bathroom break. Minutes later, the spokeswoman called back and said any information about the curriculum's citations would have to be obtained through a public records request. A staffer later estimated it would take until Aug. 27 to receive the most recent curriculum. Told what happened, Blum texted, "SMH. That's an easy question to answer."

Tami Abdollah is a USA TODAY national correspondent covering inequities in the criminal justice system. Send tips via direct message @latams or email tami(at)usatoday.com[/I]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/71-...gtons-070008384.html


"I'm not fluent in the language of violence, but I know enough to get around in places where it's spoken."
 
Posts: 10194 | Location: The Free State of Arizona | Registered: June 13, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
The Main Thing Is
Not To Get Excited
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In 2010 there was a police shooting on my island paradise that reflects some of this.
Parents of an adult son called the cops because the son wasn't answering his phone or door. He was a troubled soul and was reasonably known on the island as difficult and sometimes combative. Two cops responded to the call, climbed the our door stairs to his apt. over the garage, knocked, announced, spent some time. The occupant, the son answered the door with an ax over his head, the two officers retreated, one stumbled and fell down the stairs. the second officer opened fire and the ax-weilder retreated into his apartment.

The cops retreated , called for the cavalry and had a stand off with no communication from the occupant.Eventually LE forced entry and found the occupant DRT.

The community was outraged, an investigation of the shooting followed, the cop was found inside policy and the outrage increased. A lawsuit by the parents ensued. Cops should have, could have, etc.

At trial, the judge found that the cop was within policy but the policy was inadequate. (sweet, huh?)The officer continued his career and the family got a $1,000,000 settlement from the city.

This kind of stuff has happened all over the state. I'm not an insider. I don't know what the training should look like but it seems that nobody, insider or not, has a clue either. The result of that is as the OP's attachment describes, Ready,Fire, Aim! and cops, especially rooks, are put in positions they aren't as equipped for as they themselves have been led to believe.


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Posts: 6390 | Location: Washington | Registered: November 06, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
semi-reformed sailor
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22 years ago, the academy didn’t prepare me for the street when I graduated. The academy is for getting the basics-law, how to do things, why we do things a particular way, processes, procedures, best practices…

When I got into field training is when I learned how to police (and I had a LE background having done LE in the CG-but policing inner cities is different from being a fish cop).

Having a good background in writing really really helps with reports. We had a college graduate from a certain eastern NC college who literally couldn’t express a cogent thought in writing. He spoke hood, but couldn’t write…he termed “foot tracks” after writing a report about pursuing the bad guy in the snow and how he deduced who it was…

Fast forward 20 years and one of the last guys I trained was a former youth pastor…..he felt that he would bring good skills to policing….I giggled a little inside when he said that. The first hood rat shitshow we responded to I let him try and talk to them and get it calmed down…it did not go as he thought it would. Social justice warriors should not be policing. But my old department is full of them now. And the staff is full of people who haven’t policed in 15 plus years.

I know now my stroke was Gods way of protecting me from the current shitshow policing has become.



"Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor.” Robert A. Heinlein

“You may beat me, but you will never win.” sigmonkey-2020

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Posts: 11275 | Location: Temple, Texas! | Registered: October 07, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by MikeinNC:
The first hood rat shitshow we responded to I let him try and talk to them and get it calmed down…it did not go as he thought it would. Social justice warriors should not be policing.


that would have been funny to see -- although i am sure it was stressful at the time

i like Mike Tyson's quote: everybody has a plan until they get punched in the face. Smile

and let me guess -- the other guy went to Elizabeth City State Univ ??

---------------------------------


Proverbs 27:17 - As iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another.
 
Posts: 8940 | Location: Florida | Registered: September 20, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Sigforum K9 handler
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Training and standards.

A nifty concept.

But before you get the cart before the horse, you have to hire quality candidates. Pay, politics, working conditions, all have to be “reformed” to get candidates that you Can train.

Until then, good luck worrying about training. You can teach true policing 101 (which in my experience academies seldom do), but if they can or won’t grasp it because they can’t or won’t grasp it, you really are spinning your tires.

In my opinion, most politicians that are involving themselves in police training, don’t want to produce cops to actually do the job. It’s all about politics and pandering.

One of these days we’ll hit rick bottom. It’s coming.




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"It's a bold strategy, Cotton. Let's see if it works out for them"



 
Posts: 37117 | Location: Logical | Registered: September 12, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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^^^
That 'Quality Recruit, Pay,' etc. train began to leave the station in the 80's. Probably just now coming to a stop at 'Rock Bottom' station any year now. I agree Jones, a nifty concept but agree with you, not going to happen until we stop at Rock Bottom station.
 
Posts: 1447 | Location: Western WA | Registered: September 11, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
semi-reformed sailor
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quote:
Originally posted by Sig209:

that would have been funny to see -- although i am sure it was stressful at the time

it was glorious he needed a good helping dose of reality- and he got it

i like Mike Tyson's quote: everybody has a plan until they get punched in the face. Smile
yup, you should always have a Plan B


and let me guess -- the other guy went to Elizabeth City State Univ ??

HAHAHHAHAHAHHA, yes-how did you know? (He’s a great guy, and I’d do anything for him, but ECSU just took his money)


quote:
Jljones,

In my opinion, most politicians that are involving themselves in police training, don’t want to produce cops to actually do the job. It’s all about politics and pandering.

One of these days we’ll hit rick bottom. It’s coming.

Absolutely the truth



"Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor.” Robert A. Heinlein

“You may beat me, but you will never win.” sigmonkey-2020

“A single round of buckshot to the torso almost always results in an immediate change of behavior.” Chris Baker
 
Posts: 11275 | Location: Temple, Texas! | Registered: October 07, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Academies are the very bottom rung when it comes to preparation for the job. They do not even begin to address the level of mans inhumanity to man that will slap you right across the face the very first shift. All of our societies ills played out full force for you to experience for the next 25 years until you can retire. If you make it.
Example:
We had a female recruit do well in academy and was expected to do equally well on the job. First night out, she and her FTO took a report of a kid who had run away from home and took the family car. And unbeknownst to the cops, the kid also took a .357 Magnum from the house. Shortly after, the cops saw the car sitting in a church parking lot. As our rookie walked up to the car, the kid put the pistol in his mouth and pulled the trigger. That was it for the rookie. She did not even finish the shift. No academy training covered that scenario.
During my first week on the job, I acquired a nickname that followed me for years: Doctor of Death. Even to this day, guys I worked at that time with will greet me with "Hey, Doc". I wont bore you with the details of how I won that nickname. I was ex-military when I joined the PD so I thought I seen seen my share of shit. The end of that week really made wonder just what the hell I had gotten into. I dont really feel there is an Academy anywhere, especially for a big city PD, that can prepare a recruit for the reality of the street. And the introduction of of woke, social service type of training will just aggravate the situation.


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Posts: 16086 | Location: Marquette MI | Registered: July 08, 2014Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Won't the street just wash out the SJWs? I can't imagine if they went from eating ice cream and playing video games to working murders and dangerous situations that don't get resolved by using socially approved pronouns that they would start looking for a nice barista job.
 
Posts: 797 | Location: Southern NH | Registered: October 11, 2020Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by MikeinNC:


and let me guess -- the other guy went to Elizabeth City State Univ ??

HAHAHHAHAHAHHA, yes-how did you know? (He’s a great guy, and I’d do anything for him, but ECSU just took his money)



i grew up / lived in Eastern NC for many years. know the general area pretty well.

------------------------------------------


Proverbs 27:17 - As iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another.
 
Posts: 8940 | Location: Florida | Registered: September 20, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Mistake Not...
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quote:
Originally posted by pulicords:
Another training officer wrote that several recruits failed to read suspects their Miranda rights, saying they had been trained to "not shut the suspect down." (Roll Eyes Since when are unsolicited statements by suspects inadmissible, just because an arresting officer didn't provide "Miranda" warnings? Why should officers "shut down" suspects that aren't being questioned???
Roll Eyes)


I understand that this might be okay in many places, but in Washington it's not. In Washington, according to specific rule (CrR 3.1 or CrRLJ 3.1 [depending on if its Superior (felony level) or District/Municipal Court (misdemeanor)]) the arrested person MUST be informed they have the right to counsel as soon as practical, which for almost all purposes would be as soon as they are arrested, though there are some exceptions if the scene is chaotic enough. This is true whether or not they are asked questions. For all intents and purposes, officers are trained to Mirandize at arrest, and the fact that they are not doesn't really bother me (as a defense attorney) because nothing the suspect says or any evidence gained from that statement is admissible because they were not so advised (AND Washington does not follow the good faith rule OR the inevitable discovery rule either, the court is serious about this). Prosecutors OTOH go INSANE when this isn't done, so the fact that this isn't trained is HUGE.


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Posts: 1955 | Location: T-town in the 253 | Registered: January 16, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Fighting the good fight
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quote:
Originally posted by Loswsmith:
I understand that this might be okay in many places, but in Washington it's not. In Washington, according to specific rule (CrR 3.1 or CrRLJ 3.1) the arrested person MUST be informed they have the right to counsel as soon as practical, which for almost all purposes would be as soon as they are arrested

This is true whether or not they are asked questions.


Interesting...

Around here, Miranda warnings are only required prior to custodial interrogations.
 
Posts: 32506 | Location: Northwest Arkansas | Registered: January 06, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Do No Harm,
Do Know Harm
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quote:
Originally posted by Hildur:
Won't the street just wash out the SJWs? I can't imagine if they went from eating ice cream and playing video games to working murders and dangerous situations that don't get resolved by using socially approved pronouns that they would start looking for a nice barista job.


Ha!

No, these idiots get shuffled off the street to gigs where they aren’t as much of a liability, and eventually promoted.

It is sure entertaining until that happens though. Some do quit, but not all.




Knowing what one is talking about is widely admired but not strictly required here.

Although sometimes distracting, there is often a certain entertainment value to this easy standard.
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Posts: 11448 | Location: NC | Registered: August 16, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Objectively Reasonable
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quote:
Originally posted by RogueJSK:

Interesting...

Around here, Miranda warnings are only required prior to custodial interrogations.

Ditto here. Prior to custodial interrogation by a known law enforcement officer.

Mirandize on every arrest, immediately? That's insanity.
 
Posts: 2461 | Registered: January 01, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by DennisM:
quote:
Originally posted by RogueJSK:

Interesting...

Around here, Miranda warnings are only required prior to custodial interrogations.

Ditto here. Prior to custodial interrogation by a known law enforcement officer.

Mirandize on every arrest, immediately? That's insanity.


No kidding. Insanity. Really can’t get a lot of cop stuff done doing it like they do in Washington state.
 
Posts: 4054 | Registered: January 17, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by chongosuerte:
quote:
Originally posted by Hildur:
Won't the street just wash out the SJWs? I can't imagine if they went from eating ice cream and playing video games to working murders and dangerous situations that don't get resolved by using socially approved pronouns that they would start looking for a nice barista job.


Ha!

No, these idiots get shuffled off the street to gigs where they aren’t as much of a liability, and eventually promoted.

It is sure entertaining until that happens though. Some do quit, but not all.


That or they stick it out and get a cop or two or citizens hurt because they can’t do the job. Or,like it has been stated, they get promoted and then rat fuck the working stiffs w/ pussy PC policies.
 
Posts: 4054 | Registered: January 17, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Conveniently located directly
above the center of the Earth
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that "thin veneer of civilization" continues to erode the more control the political caste manages to accumulate


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Posts: 9854 | Location: sunny Orygun | Registered: September 27, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Police academies are for BASIC instruction only (Constitution, state criminal law, PC, traffic stops, building searches, intro to firearms, DT, etc.). In my state of Arkansas, 13 weeks is just touching the surface.

MikeinNC is spot on. True training occurs on the job with an FTO and OJT. Jerry is right about hitting rock bottom at some point. We're seeing that now with the hiring practices of local agencies.

As for PC training, I personally have not seen this much yet in the south. What I do see are recruits who are university graduates who bring in what they learned from their professors. Often, they are not popular with others for obvious reasons. The overwhelming majority of our police recruits are conservative pro-2A, pro-Constitution, but I can speak only to my experience.

As for the "warrior" versus "guardian" models, and the premise that the "warrior" model leads to more "aggressive policing," it still astonishes me that these so-called intellectuals never take into account suspect actions in their proclamations and policies about "aggressive policing."
 
Posts: 1091 | Location: Arkansas | Registered: September 25, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Mistake Not...
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posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by RogueJSK:
quote:
Originally posted by Loswsmith:
I understand that this might be okay in many places, but in Washington it's not. In Washington, according to specific rule (CrR 3.1 or CrRLJ 3.1) the arrested person MUST be informed they have the right to counsel as soon as practical, which for almost all purposes would be as soon as they are arrested

This is true whether or not they are asked questions.


Interesting...

Around here, Miranda warnings are only required prior to custodial interrogations.


Yeah, WA has a lot of unique things like that. You’d faint over the search and seizure stuff.


___________________________________________
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Mistake not my current state of joshing gentle peevishness for the awesome and terrible majesty of the towering seas of ire that are themselves the milquetoast shallows fringing my vast oceans of wrath.

Velocitas Incursio Vis - Gandhi
 
Posts: 1955 | Location: T-town in the 253 | Registered: January 16, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Mistake Not...
Picture of Loswsmith
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by DennisM:
quote:
Originally posted by RogueJSK:

Interesting...

Around here, Miranda warnings are only required prior to custodial interrogations.

Ditto here. Prior to custodial interrogation by a known law enforcement officer.

Mirandize on every arrest, immediately? That's insanity.


You’d think right? BUT it turns out Shrek was right, getting then to shut up is the trick. And since they’re already Mirandized, all you can do is try to spread jam over that toast.


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Posts: 1955 | Location: T-town in the 253 | Registered: January 16, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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