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I'm Fine |
What types of orders would you obey or where would you draw the line regarding collecting guns ? Obviously if order was against someone who had been through full due process - seem like no brainer. Go get their stuff. Red flag laws ? Maybe not quite as simple. How about if state congress approves a gun taking type thing ? Governor does something without congress ? National law passed but nothing at state level ? Have any of you thought about this or do most of you think it will not happen and therefore don't worry about it ? I feel sure it couldn't happen in some states, but also think there are a few states that are pretty close to it already. I could see just staying busy doing other things, but what happens when your direct supervisor says you have to go spend a day collecting XYZ from normal people... ? ------------------ SBrooks | ||
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| Member |
I think this will factor in, but it is speculation: LEOs are paid professionals with bills to pay and mouths to feed. If such a confiscation law takes effect, Police will act on it. Will some quit? or refuse to comply? Yes. But in the end it will come down to whether or not local chiefs will require officers to go door to door and take guns. What will happen where you live? Ask your chief or sheriff. And remember someone pays his salary too. End of Earth: 2 Miles Upper Peninsula: 4 Miles | |||
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Member |
I'm retired now, but I was a LEO for more than 30 years and I'm Jewish by birth. When I was sworn in as cop, I took an oath to obey the Constitution of the United States of America. The 2nd Amendment is an important component of the Bill of Rights, and provides a safeguard for all citizens (not just the majority) against a tyrannical government. I consider these factors, and the undeniable truth that what Hitler directed his government to do to people of my faith, as well as other minorities was lawful, according their system of "justice." LEOs aren't just "paid professionals." If they were only that, they wouldn't take an oath to uphold something greater than local, state, or even federal legislation. There's many ways to resist unlawful/immoral commands. I've done so in the past and I'm sure I (or any cop worth their salt) could effectively do so in the event some "manager" requested them to take actions that were contrary to their oath of office. "I'm not fluent in the language of violence, but I know enough to get around in places where it's spoken." | |||
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quarter MOA visionary |
They didn't have a problem going door-to-door during Katrina - taking citizens weapons at will so ... YES ... I believe they would if the Dems enact some confiscation policy. But this time they should expect some who will lawfully fight for their rights. | |||
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אַרְיֵה |
I remember some trials about seventy years ago in Germany. The people on trial said that they were just following orders. הרחפת שלי מלאה בצלופחים | |||
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| Member |
I expected the response from fellow LEOs, past and present, would mention the Oath of Office. Does it mean something to me? It certainly does. But I think it naive to believe that the Oath will prevent officers from complying with an order. Will that order be lawful? It will be if confiscation becomes the law of the land. And there will be, no doubt, officers who will not obey that order. They will be fired (or have quit already) and be replaced by officers who will act on the law. All it will take will be the repeal of the second amendment. End of Earth: 2 Miles Upper Peninsula: 4 Miles | |||
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| I'm Fine |
If they completely repeal the 2nd amendment, then that is likely the beginning (or a beginning point) of the 2nd Civil War or Revolutionary War (whichever way you want to look at it). I'm not necessarily looking at something that drastic happening. I think it will start with a state law probably. ------------------ SBrooks | |||
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| Member |
My experience with LEO's based on close to 20 years doing criminal defense work, the majority of them will willingly and knowingly violate every one of your Constitutional rights. The law libraries are full of cases in which LEO's violated people's 1st, 2nd, 4th, (they have little regard for this one) 5th, 6th, and 8th Amendments. So if they were given the order to kick in doors and take guns, they would carry that out with impunity. Think I am over reacting? Look up New York City Police Department’s stop-and-frisk program. How many LEO's in NYC quit when given the green light to violate the 4th Amendment? Or was it they were ignorant of Terry v Ohio.....? | |||
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Still finding my way |
My guns, at least the ones that survived the boat accident, aren't going anywhere. I'll die on that hill if our country devolves enough for it to actually come to that. | |||
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| quarter MOA visionary |
I don't think you are over reacting at all. I think they will do whatever they are told to do. Scary but true, not that they are bad guys because I don't think they are but they are trained to get a means to an end. It's why we cannot allow any more movement of the second amendment. No 2A then no way to defend yourself - the exact premise it was intended. | |||
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| Speling Champ |
I think it would depend on where you live. NYPD’s execution of such a law/order would likely be much different (and likely more enthusiastic) than say Buford Pusser co. Sheriff’s Office | |||
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| Still finding my way |
When our laws are applied equally again is when "Lawful" will have any meaning to me. Until then it's all about what's best for me and mine. | |||
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| Sigs are my Panacea...  |
Non-LEO here... This is a great question for the Leo’s on the board, as I have often wondered nearly the same question about what would happen if this were to pass. It’s far from an easy question, actually very complex where I would still believe that many law-enforcement officials would do everything they could to not carry out something they didn’t believe in. I know that sounds a little naïve, but I live in a very small town of less than 500 people. The county law-enforcement officers live in this community. In fact my next-door neighbor is a county sheriff, and he is one of the most regular, non-attitude person I’ve met. I’ve hesitated to raise this question with him as I don’t want to appear like someone who’s paranoid about the future, but it his take on this would be fascinating! Thanks to the OP for raising this question! Carry-on * --- Sig 365, 365XL, 245, P6 * | |||
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Member |
There are 750,000 police officers in this country. You're painting all of them with a very broad brush because of your experience with how many? It's a tough question for anyone to answer until it actually happens. Those of us who have served get it... you don't like the police. But that's how you make your living. | |||
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| Member |
I imagine it will vary greatly by location. I can see non compliance in many many areas and the locals telling the state or the feds that they're on their own. In many other areas I'd wager the jackboots would be on doors. How long that lasts probably depends on how many boots don't go home when the shift ends. It's one thing to impose the full weight and power of government on strangers but something else to do it to family, friends, and neighbors. Acceptance of risk is part of the job. Signing up for what easily turns into a suicide mission isn't what most agreed to. Confiscation would be a mess. It's far easier to make guns unpopular and expensive. | |||
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| No Compromise |
Didn't the Aussies take away gun rights a little at a time, to the point of confiscation? Then they destroyed what they had confiscated. Little by little, the populace complied with the dictates of the state. I imagine this could happen here. They could take your rights little by little. Something similar happened in Nazi Germany, and to a lesser degree, the UK. Maybe those examples don't compare exactly. Oranges and Toyotas, as it were. Still, it could happen. H&K-Guy | |||
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| Member |
You beat me too it. While I'm sure there are some out there who would obey any order, most of us would figure out a way to disobey it. BTDT. | |||
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For real? |
??? I don’t have time to follow some asinine order. I’m more worried about the idiots with guns and not the good people. I did seize a gun yesterday and plan on having her carry permit revoked eventually. She got into an argument with her child’s father and fired a shot in his direction to let him know how angry she was. Now is that someone you want to have a gun? Not minority enough! | |||
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| I'm Fine |
Wonder if the national guard would be willing to get involved in something like this ? The further you can remove someone from his own neighborhood - the more likely he is to do something he normally wouldn't... ------------------ SBrooks | |||
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| Member |
My personal experience, along with case law throughout the country plus my friends that also practice criminal defense.....a lot.
Not liking police is not how a "make a living". Defending the Constitution from government overreach is how. And as for "not liking police" that is a misinterpretation of my opinion on LEO's violating the constitution. I have lots of good friends in LE. But this is not personal, it is just fact. Or there would be no such thing as a Motion to Suppress or the 2nd Amendment. Founding Fathers understood that the Executive Branch may not always play nice. | |||
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