quote:

Originally posted by Largefarva:

Unable to leave a hotel room at all sure sounds like illegal imprisonment to me.

Without stating an opinion on whether this is a good thin or a bad thing, I do question your definition.

Imprisonment does not give you a choice, it is forced on you.

This quarantine does give you a choice, you can choose not to travel to Hawaii. Nobody is forced to go there and then be "imprisoned" in a hotel room.

A different slant on this -- suppose that somebody had planned and budgeted for a one-week vacation, arrives, and is restricted to a hotel room for 14 days. Who pays for the second week? The unwilling guest? The state government that mandated the 14 day stay in the hotel room? I know that if it were I in that situation and the hotel wanted to charge me for a second week, I would tell them to pound sand (ample supply of sand in Hawaii), collect from the state, sue me, whatever, but I would not pay.

The Dept of State arranged two flights for US citizens in Peru, recently. Two chartered airline aircraft; the passengers are responsible for the costs. The US arranged chartered flights for the passengers of the cruise ship in Japan; the passengers were responsible for the costs.

If you go to Hawaii and can't get out because there are no flights you're going to be stuck with some high costs.

If you refuse to pay the hotel bill, there will likely be collections activity to follow; if the hotel already has your credit card, you could dispute the charge. Generally hotels charge ahead on your card, along with a deposit, in the event you leave. An early check out results in a refund, but if you stay longer or extend the room longer, the card gets charged for that period prior to the extension.

quote:

If you go to Hawaii and can't get out because there are no flights you're going to be stuck with some high costs.

In 2018 I went back to Hawaii to cover a friend’s cardiology practice for a week while he was on vacation. Because of ongoing hurricane threats and flight cancellations, we ended up canceling a beach condo and having to stay in the airport hotel for a week. The whole thing meant I didn’t make any money for my week of work.

P210, glad to hear you’re having a great time with the grandson. Our granddaughter is the sun that our world revolves around now.

We do miss Maui though.

quote:

Originally posted by sns3guppy:

The Dept of State arranged two flights for US citizens in Peru, recently. Two chartered airline aircraft; the passengers are responsible for the costs . . .If you refuse to pay the hotel bill, there will likely be collections activity to follow

You’re comparing apples to bicycle tires.

The people in Peru can choose to stay there or fly out. Nobody is forcing them to fly, it is their choice. If they choose to fly, they pay.

Travelers can choose not to go to Hawaii, but if the 14 day hotel room quarantine applies to those who are already there, that is not their choice. It is being shoved down their throats. I would not pay in that situation.

Let it go to collections. My house is paid for. My car is paid for. I am 83 years old, I really don’t give a flying fuck if it goes to collections, what difference does it make to me, at this point in my life, what my credit rating is? It could go to zero, or even negative, and would have no impact on me.

It doesn't have to go to collections. Your card information is taken when you enter the room. The hotel already has your money, plus a deposit, which you get back at check-out, or typically up to two weeks after you check out. If you booked for a week, your card has already been hit for that amount, and if you check out after three days, the rest will be refunded on checkout.

If you booked for a week but need to stay longer, your room key will need to be renewed. When your room key is extended, the hit to your card will be extended; the hotel already has your card information and will charge it.

By the time you get done with the 14 days, you've already paid for it. You can dispute it, but the hotel has already charged you. That's why hotels take your credit card at check-in. If you choose to pay cash, and many places won't take it, then you'll pay a significant deposit, and you'll pay in advance.

Same way that hotels already have your money if you make off with the towels, or clean out the mini bar.

It's possible that the state may make a fund available to a hotel so that your card doesn't get charged, but the hotel generally doesn't care why you're staying there. They just want their money. They get it up front.

Uuhhh, not to disrupt your discussion, but exactly WHO is going to enforce this?

I don't think the bellhop at the Hilton has the legal authority to make you stay in your room.

What's going to happen if you tell the manager at the hotel "I'm checking out now."?
It's Hawaii, not the Hotel California.



The only problem is getting your ass back on the plane to leave.

quote:

Originally posted by CPD SIG:
Uuhhh, not to disrupt your discussion, but exactly WHO is going to enforce this?

I don't think the bellhop at the Hilton has the legal authority to make you stay in your room.

What's going to happen if you tell the manager at the hotel "I'm checking out now."?
It's Hawaii, not the Hotel California.



The only problem is getting your ass back on the plane to leave.

From the original post:

quote:

Starting March 26, 12.01 am(Thursday) anyone arriving at any airport in Hawaii, or arriving by ship will be quarantined for 14 days. Compliance will be checked by authorities. Violating the order is a misdemeanor offense with a maximum fine of $5,000 and up to one-year imprisonment.

Anyone arriving in Hawaii after Thursday will be traced and the place of quarantine has to be communicated to authorities after landing.

Residents will be quarantined at their home, arriving visitors will be required to stay in their hotel room for 2 weeks, unable to leave the room for that period.

Those who are in a hotel now may elect to leave. Those who choose to go to hawaii have been given advance notice.

It's not like a warning goes out hours prior and all are trapped, unaware. There's a choice: stay or go.

About 85-90% of Hawaii's food is imported which makes it particularly vulnerable to natural disasters and global event that might disrupt shipping and the food supply. ... Hawaii is self-sufficient in some vegetable and fruit crops but has become less self-sufficient in eggs, milk, livestock, hogs and pigs. I’m somewhat surprised by this. I would have thought with all the green weenies on those islands a few of them would have focused on being more self sufficient.

quote:

Originally posted by sns3guppy:

Your card information is taken when you enter the room.

My card issuer gives me the ability to generate a "virtual card" for any vendor. It is only valid for that specific vendor, and I can lock the virtual card, or delete it, at any time.

I have used this at hotels. Pay in advance for the specified time period, then lock the card. Any attempt at additional charges to a locked card are denied.

quote:

I’m somewhat surprised by this. I would have thought with all the green weenies on those islands a few of them would have focused on being more self sufficient.

Maui has thousands of acres of cane sugar land that now lie fallow after HC&S closed the sugar mill; the greenies are not interested in actual work.

quote:

Originally posted by V-Tail:

quote:

Originally posted by sns3guppy:

Your card information is taken when you enter the room.

My card issuer gives me the ability to generate a "virtual card" for any vendor. It is only valid for that specific vendor, and I can lock the virtual card, or delete it, at any time.

I have used this at hotels. Pay in advance for the specified time period, then lock the card. Any attempt at additional charges to a locked card are denied.

Understood. Having done that, your room key also becomes invalid after the time assigned it upon check-in.

To get your room key extended, you'll need to present payment.

I stay in hotel rooms 200-250 nights out of the year, typically, all over the globe. Sometimes more. The circumstances are continually changing, so a lot of cancellations, a lot of extensions.

When an extension is made to the room reservation, or the value applied to the room key at the time of check-in, it must be brought back to the front desk to have the key extended. If it's beyond the period paid at the start of the hotel stay, and the original card isn't available to charge again, and the original charge has been used up by the duration of the stay, you'll need to present payment again, because payment is taken in advance.

quote:

Originally posted by maxwayne:
We flew home from Hawaii 21 days ago. Glad we got out when we did.

My church Choir had a couple stranded on the cruise ship from Hawaii. They have now returned to Texas and have been tested (negative). We hope to see them soon (when church activities resume).

Question: if you are required to stay in your room, what difference does it make if your room key is not extended?


flashguy

quote:

Originally posted by V-Tail:

quote:

Originally posted by Largefarva:

Unable to leave a hotel room at all sure sounds like illegal imprisonment to me.

Without stating an opinion on whether this is a good thin or a bad thing, I do question your definition.

Imprisonment does not give you a choice, it is forced on you.

This quarantine does give you a choice, you can choose not to travel to Hawaii. Nobody is forced to go there and then be "imprisoned" in a hotel room.

A different slant on this -- suppose that somebody had planned and budgeted for a one-week vacation, arrives, and is restricted to a hotel room for 14 days. Who pays for the second week? The unwilling guest? The state government that mandated the 14 day stay in the hotel room? I know that if it were I in that situation and the hotel wanted to charge me for a second week, I would tell them to pound sand (ample supply of sand in Hawaii), collect from the state, sue me, whatever, but I would not pay.

I wouldn't willingly pay for the first week, since I couldn't leave the room.

flashguy

quote:

Originally posted by V-Tail:

quote:

Originally posted by Largefarva:

Unable to leave a hotel room at all sure sounds like illegal imprisonment to me.

Without stating an opinion on whether this is a good thin or a bad thing, I do question your definition.

Imprisonment does not give you a choice, it is forced on you.

This quarantine does give you a choice, you can choose not to travel to Hawaii. Nobody is forced to go there and then be "imprisoned" in a hotel room.

A different slant on this -- suppose that somebody had planned and budgeted for a one-week vacation, arrives, and is restricted to a hotel room for 14 days. Who pays for the second week? The unwilling guest? The state government that mandated the 14 day stay in the hotel room? I know that if it were I in that situation and the hotel wanted to charge me for a second week, I would tell them to pound sand (ample supply of sand in Hawaii), collect from the state, sue me, whatever, but I would not pay.

Maybe the term I should have used was illegal detention instead of imprisonment. If you’re not allowed to leave the room for 2 weeks I view that as being detained in one place. And unless martial law is declared, it’s illegal in this country, especially if you’ve done no illegal activities.

I could see some medical reasoned rule making it so you could be quarantined, but wouldn’t that usually be in response to actually being sick with an infectious disease? Not just for simply entering the area.

But I do agree that regardless if it’s legal or not, people are warned about this issue ahead of time and can choose to not go there in the first place.

I have not seen anywhere the "end date" for all this. I was supposed to be in Hawaii in early May.

quote:

Originally posted by sns3guppy:

quote:

Originally posted by CPD SIG:


From the original post:

[QUOTE] Starting March 26, 12.01 am(Thursday) anyone arriving at any airport in Hawaii, or arriving by ship will be quarantined for 14 days. Compliance will be checked by authorities. Violating the order is a misdemeanor offense with a maximum fine of $5,000 and up to one-year imprisonment.

Anyone arriving in Hawaii after Thursday will be traced and the place of quarantine has to be communicated to authorities after landing.

Residents will be quarantined at their home, arriving visitors will be required to stay in their hotel room for 2 weeks, unable to leave the room for that period.

Those who are in a hotel now may elect to leave. Those who choose to go to hawaii have been given advance notice.

It's not like a warning goes out hours prior and all are trapped, unaware. There's a choice: stay or go.

I can't comment on how busy Steve and Danno are over at Hawaii 5-0, but I'm betting that their plate is kinda full right now. (Strictly speaking from my perspective here in Chicago)

I get it, it's a "leave now, or else" kinda thing... But I can't see local PD knocking door to door with the "Let me zee das papers" bit. Maybe things aren't getting busy out there like they are here, but I'm thinking they're doing other stuff. (At the least, following what their Department Lawyers are saying about violating someone's rights and an impending lawsuit)


I can't see the local PD (or even the TSA) stopping everyone from leaving an airport either.

Gov J(abba the hutt) Pritzker announced the "shelter in place" stuff here in Ill. Mayor Lighfoot is on board. We (CPD) got the memo from the bosses the other day.
FIRST THING out of my pie-hole at roll call was "Gather round kids, it's Sgt CPD SIG story time. Remember the oath of office you took? Remember that part about 'Support the Constitution of the United States'... Well, this is the part where it really applies!"

So Hawaii, like the Aussie state of Tasmania ... has a moat and is using it.

Tasmania is providing one-time payments to those quarantined. Not much, but they're providing something.

quote:

Originally posted by V-Tail:

quote:

Originally posted by sns3guppy:

The Dept of State arranged two flights for US citizens in Peru, recently. Two chartered airline aircraft; the passengers are responsible for the costs . . .If you refuse to pay the hotel bill, there will likely be collections activity to follow

You’re comparing apples to bicycle tires.

The people in Peru can choose to stay there or fly out. Nobody is forcing them to fly, it is their choice. If they choose to fly, they pay.

Travelers can choose not to go to Hawaii, but if the 14 day hotel room quarantine applies to those who are already there, that is not their choice. It is being shoved down their throats. I would not pay in that situation.

Let it go to collections. My house is paid for. My car is paid for. I am 83 years old, I really don’t give a flying fuck if it goes to collections, what difference does it make to me, at this point in my life, what my credit rating is? It could go to zero, or even negative, and would have no impact on me.

Defrauding an inn-keeper is a crime that most states take very seriously. You would really rip off a hotel owner after staying there for 2 weeks? If you were quarantined for 2 weeks by the State, what does that misfortune have to do with the hotel owner?

Nobody is being forced to stay and pay for lodging against their will. Anyone already here visiting is free to leave. Those who come after Thursday anyway can just get on the next flight out so they won’t be forced to pay for unwanted lodging either.