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| No More Mr. Nice Guy |
Yup. | |||
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| No More Mr. Nice Guy |
Similar concerns here. The Great Salt Lake is a slow motion disaster already, with water being diverted for agricultural and human use. The population growth is a big problem for electrical power. Then there's the heat generated by the data centers. They are proposing at least two big installations in beautiful locations. It may seem like western wasteland to outsiders, but you all come out here on vacation to marvel at the natural scenery. These centers will impact bird migration and habitats, the local climate, and further deteriorate the water situation. | |||
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Member |
Could data centers be [reasonably] constructed underground, so as to not ruin landscapes? Admittedly, that wouldn’t change anything in terms of power/water/resource consumption, but it might help with the “aesthetic” issues. Politicians seem to have forgotten that they work for us, not the other way around. — — — — — — — — — — — — God bless America. | |||
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| Green grass and high tides  |
Still no answer to the questions I posed on the first page of this thread, hmmmm? "Practice like you want to play in the game" | |||
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Optimistic Cynic |
In VA at least, one political Party decries that they "aren't paying their fair share" of taxes. Data centers have certain tax breaks intended to foster innovation and bring business to the Commonwealth, one Party wants these repealed so they can spend more money on "social causes." Of course, if the tax equation changes, data center operators are free to build/move to another State, the complaining Party denies this reality. VA appears to be rapidly moving to a simplified tax computation (ar least for businesses): 1) What were your earnings for the tax year? 2) How much do you have left after paying Federal taxes and political contributions? 3) Send it in! | |||
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| If you see me running try to keep up  |
This guy claims they are making people sick, I have my doubts. There are too many hypochondriacs around to base this just on what people claim https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_bP80DEAbuo | |||
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| If you see me running try to keep up |
I have not verified, but this site claims to show owners: https://www.cleanview.co/data-centers/us | |||
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| Lawyers, Guns and Money  |
I don't like tax abatements, but that's not just for data centers. Special deals, for special folks. If we don't give them a special deal, they will go somewhere else. It's the same with tax abatements for football/baseball stadiums. I don't want to spend more money on "social causes" either. I don't think we should spend anything on "social causes." That's not the purpose of government. I just want low taxes, evenly applied. "Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible." -- Justice Janice Rogers Brown "The United States government is the largest criminal enterprise on earth." -rduckwor | |||
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| Optimistic Cynic |
The problem is that you are unlikely to find two people who would agree on what that means, much less across a political Party. The real mystery is why, with all the inherent advantages a Government would have, it cannot be self-funding as are commercial businesses and individual wage earners. Of course, that would open a different Pandora's box of problems. But really, why should there be taxes at all? | |||
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| Lawyers, Guns and Money |
Yes, that would open a Pandora's box of problems. Government produces nothing. Government exists to protect my God given rights, and nothing more. To do so, we empower government to enact law, which must apply equally to all. It's the role of government to keep an even playing field. Government is the umpire... not a player. "Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible." -- Justice Janice Rogers Brown "The United States government is the largest criminal enterprise on earth." -rduckwor | |||
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Recondite Raider |
People in my area complain about water usage and pass misinformation that the used water has higher nitrates than the existing ground water. We are in the NE Oregon desert on the Columbia River. Currently there are five or six data centers withing 30 miles of me. I point out that while they may be getting tax breaks, and they don't create very many jobs other than the 20 or so people who are full time staff at each center and the unarmed security officers outside (the data centers keep three different security companies in business) that those same centers could easily move to China or somewhere in South America. I have much more of an issue with the wind and solar farms that are being constructed around here. And since I like my computer, internet, cell phone, smart watch, smart scale, etc... I think I can put up with and accept the data centers. __________________________ More blessed than I deserve. http://davesphotography7055.zenfolio.com/f238091154 | |||
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Member |
The way they put them up soo fast around here (NOVA), they must be [excuse me] making fuck tons of profit The real-estate in this area is insane, let alone the other stuff. FWIW: I think they are ugly AF and I think with their high demand for resources, even paying their bill, they reduce supply on many levels and drive up my costs even though I am 50 miles west of them. i.e. My electric company warned us of a 9% increase this year. | |||
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| Ammoholic |
I suspect it is like anything else, the project can be built in a way that is environmentally friendly and out of the way, but both cost more money. The folks building the project want to built it as inexpensively and as inexpensive to run as possible. These goals are at odds with environmentally friendly and out of the way. Closer to good infrastructure is cheaper to build and to operate (land costs being the same, which they won’t). If your staff has to commute two hours to get to work, that’s going to suck. That additional two hours of trucking materials in isn’t going to do anything good for the cost of construction either. In a perfect world, the folks issuing the permits (planning staff & politicians) would be impartial and would totally understand all the issues and negotiate / require the absolute best, low impact, but still viable, projects. The reality is that most of the decision makers lack the expertise and certainly aren’t unbiased. The project proponents, realizing that it is cheaper to lobby for support than to build tge lowest impact project, spend their dollars on lobbying and often build a project that isn’t quite as nice as where Jesse works. This is in no way unique to data centers. Pick your pet project and that’s how it goes. | |||
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Legalize the Constitution |
I would like to see them all built within city limits. I believe that going outside the city limits is an immediate environmental problem, whether its ag land (already being gobbled up by urban development) or native grassland, as it is in two huge data centers already being constructed in the Cheyenne vicinity. _______________________________________________________ despite them | |||
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| No More Mr. Nice Guy |
In Utah, nearly every state level elected official has a direct professional connection to real estate and/or development. Many city or county level politicians do, too. None of them have ever seen a development project they didn't love. Or was it the lobby money they love? In any case, the system is badly corrupted here. They go against the citizens all the time. | |||
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Ammoholic |
I find it strange that people would give up on gun rights, trans in girls lockers, illegal aliens just because they don't like ugly buildings. I would physically move my house onto our campus. It's beautifully landscaped; way quieter than the neighborhood I currently live in with the mariachi music and constant noise of Amazon and UPS trucks driving down my road I'm for American excellence. The data centers are NOT going away, it's really more of a question of who you want controlling data/AI. If you trust China's government over US businesses there's nothing I can do for you go CCP whooo hooo (not directed at you). It's tilting at windmills, the information industry is not going away and I really prefer not to trade illegal immigration for AI supremacy. To each their own we can have shitty cellphones and illegal aliens/trans and feel good that we fought a impossible battle. The information age started long ago and is not going away. No matter how bad people scream and shine about it. I do approve huge setbacks and noise mitigation systems as well as any that are located near residential area shouldn't be something that looks like a warehouse or factory. These are the factories of this age. We maybe reshore a few factories, but we are not going to be a manufacturing hub again, unless it's through the use of automation and cutting age technology. We currently lead the world and I don't want that to change, but to each their own. Jesse Sic Semper Tyrannis | |||
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Member |
Who is behind them? People that want to be rich What Data? Facebook, Amazon, YouTube, Google Maps, Waze, Roku, Netflix, online shopping, any search engine, booking flights and cruises and hotels, and all the data at your finger tips on your phone or computer has to be stored and retrieved from somewhere. Sigfourm is hosted somewhere. Data and online information and services is in more demand every day and building new data centers is the only way to keep up with the demands. _____________________ "We're going to die. Some people are scared of dying. Never be afraid to die. Because you're born to die," Walter Breuning 114 years old | |||
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Shall Not Be Infringed |
Let's be real...There are Data Centers, and then there are DATA CENTERS! These facilities have been around for a while now, and during that time they've been largely for corporate/consumer services/government (Think financial institutions, health care, state & federal gov't services, social media, web services, etc). The new breed of Data Center to support the EVERYTHING is AI now craze are a whole nother level. One standout is the Stratos Hyperscale Data Center project in Box Elder County, Utah which will reportedly be situated 40,000 acres and twice the size on Manhattan! Skins - Your 'data center' may be might be beautifully landscaped, but it was designed/built years ago, and is simply NOT on the scale of whats being proposed/built currently that has everyone freaking out. ____________________________________________________________ If Some is Good, and More is Better.....then Too Much, is Just Enough !! Trump 47....Making America Great Again! "May Almighty God bless the United States of America" - parabellum 7/26/20 Live Free or Die! | |||
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| Green grass and high tides |
Maybe if they called them Cyber tracking facilities they would be better received? "Practice like you want to play in the game" | |||
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| Staring back from the abyss  |
What I would like to see is a complete ban, punishable by the death penalty, on any and all "data" harvesting. There was a time when a fella could go down to Monkey Wards and browse through their guns and tools and not receive reams of junk mail in their mailbox from the companies that made the things he was looking at. Why is it OK to do that now? If I look up a pair of Rockport shoes on my work computer, every device that I am somehow associated with is inundated with Rockport shoe advertisements for weeks on end. This was never OK before and it should not be OK now. Frankly, I believe that it is an invasion of privacy. Dick Proenneke had the right idea. ________________________________________________________ It is long past time for a Convention of States. The Founding Fathers gave us this tool to fix an out of control government and we need to use it. | |||
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