quote:

Originally posted by blueye:
Maybe their thinking about taking the "grill work" out of their mouths.

With side cutters?

quote:

Originally posted by BBMW:
There are already civil forfeiture laws. How would this be any different?

Since when is the Government taking your shit ... civil ?

quote:

Originally posted by smschulz:

quote:

Originally posted by BBMW:
There are already civil forfeiture laws. How would this be any different?

Since when is the Government taking your shit ... civil ?

Never.

One of those absurdist labels like "The Patriot Act".

The punchline to the joke is that they're essentially claiming that the criminal justice system is overwhelmed, and the solution is to dump all these messes in the overwhelmed civil justice system. About the only thing they're doing (I would guess) is bypassing any need for proof "beyond a reasonable doubt".

Does criminal restitution necessarily take precedence over civil restitution awards in Illinois? If so, then I guess, the assumption is that there will be no criminal charges at all.

I fee I have to address a few things on the Gangs in Chicago, our fucked-up system and our nit-wit mayor and this policy-
I'll also attempt to answer a lot of questions.

quote:

Originally posted by Balzé Halzé:
Are these gangs in Chicago that organised? Am I to believe there is a Stringer Bell type, business savvy kingpin running the show there? Maybe I don't give them enough credit.

Yes and No.
Gangs are structured like a Fortune 500 Company or the Military. Larry Hoover, Jeff Fort, Ramon Santos et al aren't stupid people. (personally speaking, they would be phenomenal business men, but they decided to choose crime vs legitimate ventures) There's a hierarchy to the gang, rules and "taxes".
President/CEO would run the gang. A Vice President, and an Accountant.
A "board of directors", if you will (See Gangster Disciples).
Regional Managers, under them there's managers, enforcers and soldiers.

Drugs are the main way the gangs make money, however; prostitution, auto theft, money laundering, credit card fraud, counterfeiting, kidnapping, murder for hire, extortion and a list of others are also money makers.

It's a multi million dollar business. AND ITS (U.S.Government) TAX FREE! I'm not talking 5, 10, 30 Million... Try Hundreds of Millions of Dollars, just here in Chicago!
A "Hot" Area in Chicago could make easily $40 - $50 THOUSAND A DAY. (Think Project Buildings like you mentioned in "The Wire")
That Building or set of buildings is one gang, they "pay tribute" up the "Chain of Command" (Give a portion of money to their higher-ups, in turn, guns and more drugs flow down the chain. It's not like they have a bank account, so money is stored in "Stash Houses", then laundered thru various businesses, and possibly used for "legitimate" means (There's been more than a few campaign contributions made! Hard for a politician, even one in Chicago to accept a check from the "Gangster Disciples", but from "Growth and Development", it's perfectly legit... and a true story ). Don't think for a second that the Irish or Italian Mob has the only hold on Judges, Lawyers or Politicians!

So "getting lucky" on my side of the fence and hitting a house with $50K, $100K, $500K, even up to $1M in cash isn't all that uncommon. Law Enforcement has people working in "Asset Forfeiture" who track down money, how much of a profit a business IS making vs WHAT THEY SHOULD be making (Money laundering), car purchases, boat purchases... So seizing the assets from a Civil Suit is very possible. File the Lawsuit in Federal Court, the Gangster Disciples in Memphis get hit by the Police, they recover $50,000. City of Chicago gets their money first. Sorry Memphis, we have a Lawsuit, we take precedence. Again, this was successfully done in San Diego, Cicero Il, and a few other places.

Here's the problem- Years ago, Chicago and the FBI hit the Gangster Disciples HARD. We took out their Board of Directors and Regents twice. (Once, thanks to this little shitbird nicknamed "Ugg", short for Ugly, and damn if he didn't earn that nickname! All about him getting shorted in a dice game, and having a "hit" put out on him because he punched a Regent - way higher ranking member than this little peon. Want any more to that story, and you'll have to buy me or Cato drinks!)

Well, guess what it taught the lower echelon?
It doesn't pay to be at the top!

So a lot of the Black gangs fragmented, and now there's no "centralized" Chain of Command or hierarchy. Its's now all "Cliques" or "Sets". The smaller factions of the larger gang are now all independent. There's still a drug and gun network, and all the other crime that was involved, but it's now all THIS small area (3-4 blocks by 3-4 blocks / 20 people) against THAT small area (5-6 blocks by 5-6 blocks / 30 people), where years ago, they would all be in the same Gang.

^^^ Here's where the problem comes in. The Latin Kings still make a shit-ton of money because there's a hierarchy, "Thrilla-Ward" or "O-Block", not so much, because that little "Set" is only about 30 members. 30 members doesn't make nearly as much as a 1000, 5000 member gang.

Gang Affiliations (as in being affiliated with the Gangster Disciples, Black Disciples, 4 Corner Hustles, Vice Lords..) in the Black Community don't really come into play until they go to County or Prison.

Latin Gangs? Oh, they are still TRUE to the game! Once a King, Always a King. They haven't broken apart like the Black Gangs. However, their leaders are way more low profile now.

It's not hard to prove that someone is a Gang Member- All you need to do is look at Facebook and Twitter! They advertise it all day on Social Media.


Russ59- Whats' our conviction rate?
How about "Fucking laughable!"
Murder is (+/-) 10%.
Yeah, do the quick math... You have a (+/-) 90% chance of getting away with a Murder here in Chicago.
Aggravated Battery isn't much better.

Drugs? How about almost non existent! And I'm serious! Unless you have a Truck Load of Cocaine, noting is going to happen to you from a criminal standpoint.
(I got a phone call just after last Thanksgiving asking if I wanted to go back to Narcotics and take a Team. Any other time, I would have been on that offer like white on rice. This time, I almost laughed at the person asking me. Its' just not worth my time, headache or aggravation to do a job where you're better off banging your head against the wall. Someone wants me to risk the safety of my Officers, and their financial well-being to arrest someone who will be out in 24 hours, and never be held accountable? Fuck that!)

Meanwhile, that twat of a mayor (and former federal prosecutor) we have is going to put her "top men" on this endeavor.
And when I say "top men", I mean "Most Diverse Group of People". So see how well that it's going to work out. Hell , half of the first month is going to be used up figuring out everyone's "preferred pronouns" and what shitter to use.

You would think that a Former Federal Prosecutor would know better, but that's WHY the key word is "Former".

Like I said, This place is a Joke! One big floppy clown shoe wearing JOKE!

Thank you CPD SIG for staying the course. It’s easy to lose heart.

Thanks CPD good information. Learned a lot.I did not know about the Cicero deal.

Great story CPD albeit the unfortunate truth.

FWFW, a well formatted and very readable for a long story much like what Para's recent thread.
This is the way to do it.

Thanks

quote:

Originally posted by CPD SIG:
I like the part in the article that says

“We have an opportunity to bring these violent street gangs into civil court, out of the shadows, expose them for what they are,” she said. “And if we’re successful, and I think we will be, take their assets and the profit motive for killing our babies.”


Civil....
Not CRIMINAL.
Naaaa, can't actually lock up and incarcerate a bag guy, because there's "too many black and brown people in jail"!
So, yeah, let's keep them roaming among the good people, let them to continue to commit crimes, injuring good people...
But we're going to take their money, not their freedom.

This place is a joke. One big floppy clown shoe wearing joke.

One Northside citizen, carjacked at gunpoint while shoveling his parking spot, refused to press charges. Why? He stated: "They must have needed a car more than I did". It was a Lexus SUV.

quote:

So a lot of the Black gangs fragmented, and now there's no "centralized" Chain of Command or hierarchy. Its's now all "Cliques" or "Sets". The smaller factions of the larger gang are now all independent. There's still a drug and gun network, and all the other crime that was involved, but it's now all THIS small area (3-4 blocks by 3-4 blocks / 20 people) against THAT small area (5-6 blocks by 5-6 blocks / 30 people), where years ago, they would all be in the same Gang.

The business model is "diversification of assets"........basically what your 401k manager tells you to do with any investments. Back in the day, there used to be 6 main gangs in St. Louis, now there are over 1000 identified "gangs, sets, cliques". A lot of it started with ending of the main housing projects and moving those residents out to other areas, which also coincided with arrests and dismantling of the main gangs.

quote:

Originally posted by kidcop:
Targeting the finances of organized criminal gangs, drug cartels, outlaw motorcycle gangs has a long and successful history. Don't knock it until it's been tried.

The problem is I am not convinced that most of Chicago's issues are of the organized variety or at least on a large scale organization(s).

quote:

Originally posted by 95flhr:

quote:

Originally posted by kidcop:
Targeting the finances of organized criminal gangs, drug cartels, outlaw motorcycle gangs has a long and successful history. Don't knock it until it's been tried.

The problem is I am not convinced that most of Chicago's issues are of the organized variety or at least on a large scale organization(s).

Most of it is the smaller gangs (think 50 or less, usually full of family from same area) targeting other gangs and corners. Of course there are the tragic and stupid murders such as the "mother" who shot her son in the head over a memory card. There are also the random acts of violence such as robberies, carjackings, road rage shootings, "dis-respect me" shootings, thugs playing real life Grand Theft Auto. Here are this last weekends shootings from Hey Jackass.com Notice the multiple victims at the same location, those are results of thug life involvement either dealing, drug debts, "snitches get stitches", shootings, retaliation shootings, retaliation to the retaliation shootings, and of course retaliation to the retaliation shooting of the original retaliation shooting to the original shooting.

"Another Summer Shooting Season may be in the books, but there’s plenty of agreeable days ahead to add to an already record run.

Final Peaceful Tally: 10 killed, 58 wounded
2020 weekend tally: 15 killed, 43 wounded
2019 weekend tally: 10 killed, 21 wounded
2018 weekend tally: 4 killed, 23 wounded
2017 weekend tally: 11 killed, 31 wounded
2016 weekend tally: 6 killed, 38 wounded
2015 weekend tally: 10 killed, 47 wounded
2014 weekend tally: 6 killed, 31 wounded

Friday 9/10
1:00p 5500 W Adams, Austin, M/27
2:45p 1900 S Ashland, Lower West Side, M/67
3:10p 100 E 43rd, Grand Boulevard, M/34
3:35p 5000 W Iowa, Austin, M/21
5:30p 7200 S Yale, Grand Crossing, M/31
5:50p 7100 S Princeton, Grand Crossing, M/62
6:10p 4200 S Wells, Fuller Park, M/27
7:00p 8200 S Marquette, South Chicago, M/37
7:20p 100 N Lorel, Austin, M/?
8:50p 100 E 43rd, Grand Boulevard, F/23
8:50p 100 E 43rd, Grand Boulevard, M/35
8:50p 100 E 43rd, Grand Boulevard, M/42
10:30p 5800 W Augusta, Austin, M/12
10:30p 5800 W Augusta, Austin, M/13
11:45p 9500 S Stony Island, South Deering, M/50
Saturday 9/11
12:55a 7600 S Green, Auburn Gresham, M/16
1:20a 2700 W 15th, North Lawndale, M/16
1:25a 8700 S Lafayette, Chatham, F/34
3:35a 800 E 89th, Chatham, M/18
4:55a 3500 W 58th, Gage Park, M/29
7:05a 3900 W Lexington, Garfield Park, M/24
10:30a 8000 S Bennett, South Chicago, M/12
12:10p 5700 S Loop, Washington Park, M/32
12:10p 5700 S Loop, Washington Park, M/36
2:15p 1500 S Hamlin, North Lawndale, M/17
2:50p 9100 S Wentworth, Roseland, M/17
4:15p 1100 N Kildare, Humboldt Park, F/29
4:15p 1100 N Kildare, Humboldt Park, M/32
4:15p 1100 N Kildare, Humboldt Park, M/53
4:55p 900 E 79th, Chatham, M/24
4:55p 900 E 79th, Chatham, M/26
4:55p 900 E 79th, Chatham, M/27
4:55p 900 E 79th, Chatham, M/28
5:05p 7900 S Escanaba, South Chicago, M/21
5:05p 7900 S Escanaba, South Chicago, M/23
7:15p 700 E Oakwood, Grand Boulevard, M/17
7:15p 700 E Oakwood, Grand Boulevard, F/35
8:15p 9000 S University, Burnside, M/53
9:40p 300 E Kensington, West Pullman, F/42
9:40p 300 E Kensington, West Pullman, F/15
9:40p 300 E Kensington, West Pullman, M/22
9:40p 300 E Kensington, West Pullman, M/31
9:40p 300 E Kensington, West Pullman, M/32
9:40p 300 E Kensington, West Pullman, M/38
Sunday 9/12
1:00a 4100 W 16th, North Lawndale, M/?
2:05a 3400 W Madison, Garfield Park, M/34
2:30a 100 W Wells, Loop, M/24
2:40a 2900 W Congress, Garfield Park, M/27
2:40a 2900 W Congress, Garfield Park, M/29
4:15a 2700 W Flournoy, Garfield Park, M/54
4:15a 2700 W Flournoy, Garfield Park, F/42
5:00a 2600 W Jackson, Garfield Park, M/24
5:20a 300 S Sacramento, Garfield Park, M/33
5:20a 300 S Sacramento, Garfield Park, F/55
11:15a 700 E 81st, Chatham, M/28
1:10p 8300 S Avalon, Avalon Park, F/28
1:45p 3600 W 56th, West Elsdon, M/16
4:45p 1100 N Lawndale, Humboldt Park, M/16
6:30p 10 W Roosevelt, Loop, M/18
7:15p 6200 S Laflin, Englewood, M/34
8:30p 8700 S State, Chatham, M/22
9:10p 1100 W 51st, New City, M/58
9:20p 3700 W 62nd, West Lawn, M/18
9:20p 3700 W 62nd, West Lawn, M/19
9:35p 11800 S Vincennes, Morgan Park, M/29
No Accountability Monday
12:25a 10 S Leamington, Austin, M/16
1:10a 3400 W 26th, Little Village, M/22
1:55a I94 @130th, Riverdale, M/49"

It looks like a relatively uneventful weekend in Chicago.
Of course St. Louis City and County is as bad or worse, due to lack of population density, we have much higher murder and shooting rates.

how about a gang-banger bullet tax