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It’s not a zipper merge when there is no space for you to merge into. It’s not up to the drivers in the open lane to make space for you. It’s up to you to find and take space way back there where you saw the big giant sign that says your lane is ending. Racing up to the end and expecting everyone to stop and make an opening for you is not merging. The reason there is no space at the end is because of all the nitwits that raced up to end and stopped traffic so they could “merge”.
 
Posts: 83 | Location: Kentucky | Registered: June 06, 2021Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by radioman:
My Strategy:

I drive a nearly antique car, I dress like 1950, and look half drunk and hollow-eyed.

So I'm the guy that other cars try to avoid.


The reason I sometimes miss my old ugly 78 Granada. The guy in the nicer car always thought twice about trying to force their way around me.

“I’ll just force my way into…int.. ah, you know, I’ll wait.”


--
I always prefer reality when I can figure out what it is.
JALLEN 10/18/18
 
Posts: 2266 | Location: Roswell, GA | Registered: March 10, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Casuistic Thinker and Daoist
Picture of 9mmepiphany
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quote:
Originally posted by jed7s9b:
It’s not a zipper merge when there is no space for you to merge into. It’s not up to the drivers in the open lane to make space for you.

And that's the reason folks have such an issue with not understanding the concept of Zipper Merging.

It is on the driver, in the lane being merged into, to make space for you. That is the actual definition of Zipper Merging.

To not allow a merging car in or purposely blocking them from merging is the definition of Entitlement




No, Daoism isn't a religion



 
Posts: 13947 | Location: northern california | Registered: February 07, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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The ending lanes merges with other traffic. Those in the open lane have the right of way due to fact they are actually right there, right now. You aren’t entitled to anyone else’s space in a lane. If you are missing teeth in your zipper and you pull that slider, do the teeth before the gap rush up to the ones after the gap and expect the teeth on the opposite side to wait for that? No. The teeth zip their ass together right where they are and it all goes smoothly.
 
Posts: 83 | Location: Kentucky | Registered: June 06, 2021Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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There was a time in Ohio when they would post "no passing slower vehicles" in approaches to construction zones and they would enforce it with anywhere from 4 to 10 OHP cars on site. Because of this you would barely have to slow up at all for a construction zone because drivers all merged well before the approach. Unfortunately due to budget cuts OHP is not nearly the size it once was and speed limits are barely enforced.


I've stopped counting.
 
Posts: 5066 | Location: Michigan | Registered: November 07, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by jed7s9b:
It’s not a zipper merge when there is no space for you to merge into. It’s not up to the drivers in the open lane to make space for you. It’s up to you to find and take space way back there where you saw the big giant sign that says your lane is ending. Racing up to the end and expecting everyone to stop and make an opening for you is not merging. The reason there is no space at the end is because of all the nitwits that raced up to end and stopped traffic so they could “merge”.

thinking like that is the problem
 
Posts: 3473 | Registered: August 19, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Casuistic Thinker and Daoist
Picture of 9mmepiphany
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quote:
Originally posted by jed7s9b:
The ending lanes merges with other traffic. Those in the open lane have the right of way due to fact they are actually right there , right now.

That is the root of your mis-understanding.

By definition, in a zipper merge, the cars in the land being merged into have to yield alternating spaces to the cars merging into the lane...that's why it's called a Zipper Merge. The fact that you didn't avail yourself of the open lane doesn't change the fact that you should be yielding...it simply means that you don't understand the concept and are slowing down traffic by merging early.

It would be like having two checkout lines at a store that fed one register. You get to choose which line you want to get into. The cashier checks out customers in an alternating sequence. Just because you got into one of the lines before someone got into the other doesn't mean you have priority access to the cashier




No, Daoism isn't a religion



 
Posts: 13947 | Location: northern california | Registered: February 07, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by jed7s9b:
If I can merge early, the other cars can as well. The problem is people running up and passing those who have performed their zipper merge. The passers them expect to given special treatment. The big slow down is due to those people and it snowballs.
The cash register lines comparison would be more applicable if there was one line. Everyone approaches from any which way and zippers into that line. Now someone special decides he wants to run alongside forward and expects a position near the front.
 
Posts: 83 | Location: Kentucky | Registered: June 06, 2021Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Casuistic Thinker and Daoist
Picture of 9mmepiphany
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quote:
Originally posted by jed7s9b:
If I can merge early, the other cars can as well.

You're right, they can.

Then they'd be contravening the process as designed to smooth the flow of traffic, be contributing to slowing down traffic (by merging early), and reducing the efficiency of the whole process...just as you are doing.

Just because it makes you feel better to get into a line when it isn't necessary doesn't mean other folks have to follow your lead when it isn't the correct procedure. Your preference, besides being wrong, is inherently less orderly and even unnaturally inefficient


For most people, lining up in a single line is a artifact of the elementary school system, just like asking permission to go to the bathroom and rising your hand to speak...many of us have put those things behind us when we moved beyond secondary education




No, Daoism isn't a religion



 
Posts: 13947 | Location: northern california | Registered: February 07, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
אַרְיֵה
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Merge early, merge late, it makes no difference whatsoever in terms of total traffic movement.

When two or more lanes are merged into one, the overall speed is limited by the capacity of the single lane after the merge point.



Any cocktail can be a shrimp cocktail if you put your mind to it, and if you carry lots of loose shrimp in your pocket.

הרחפת שלי מלאה בצלופחים
 
Posts: 27877 | Location: Central Florida, Orlando area | Registered: January 03, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Yes. It will slow down and probably stop due to the timid drivers amongst us. Somehow conveyor systems manage it at UPS all day long without one special package stopping it all. None of the packages rush to pass and all of the packages let the others in.
 
Posts: 83 | Location: Kentucky | Registered: June 06, 2021Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Originally posted by SIGnified:
I drive a ragtop manual transmission…..I realized with a chopped fly wheel and a GT3 RS racing clutch, no one is ever gonna be able to drive that thing but me.


Or me (former PCA racer ;-))


------------------
Eddie

Our Founding Fathers were men who understood that the right thing is not necessarily the written thing. -kkina
 
Posts: 5647 | Location: In transit | Registered: February 19, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Originally posted by jed7s9b:
The ending lanes merges with other traffic. Those in the open lane have the right of way due to fact they are actually right there, right now. <snip>

Everything you've posted in this thread would be wrong in the state of Utah.
quote:
Utah Code
41-6a-903.1. Right-of-way -- Zipper merge.
(1) As used in this section:
(a) "Merge point" means the point at which two traffic lanes merge into one traffic lane.
(b) "Zipper method" means a method of merging vehicles at a merge point that involves the operators of the merging vehicles:
(i) using both lanes of traffic until the vehicles reach the merge point; and
(ii) once the vehicles reach the merge point, alternating yielding the right-of-way into the single traffic lane.

(2) An operator of a vehicle shall use the zipper method when merging at a congested merge point.
(3) A violation of this section is an infraction.


Having driven millions of miles all over this country, and encountered zipper merges in 48 states, I'm certain that Utah is not unique in its laws. Some states even put up signs that say "Use Both Lanes" followed by another that says "Merge Here." They are trying to discourage the very behavior you're espousing.

Sometimes, I've used my semi in the "open" lane to match speed with the through lane, in an attempt to get the through lane moving. I have had police officers motion for me to speed up and go on down to the merge point. Everything in my experience supports zipper merging, and your behavior is one of the reasons why these merges don't work as well as they could. Merging early and then being sanctimonious to vehicles who are correctly negotiating a zipper merge is simply misinformed and unjustly pious. You should reconsider your position.



Demand not that events should happen as you wish; but wish them to happen as they do happen, and you will go on well. -Epictetus
 
Posts: 7796 | Location: Utah | Registered: December 18, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Months long Interstate construction on my route home. Four miles warning to "Merge Right Now". Saw it every day... "Late Merge" is the offence they call it in Tennessee.

Apparently, after enough complaints they sent 4 State Troupers cars to enforce timely merging. A warning about the impending operation was even on the nightly news. The Troupers parked at about 1/4 mile intervals in the last mile and were out of their cars. The first three parked on the shoulder. The last parked actually blocking the lane of traffic. Every single car attempting a late merge was motioned over. At times they had so many stopped they was a wait queue 3 or 4 cars long for each Trouper. They did this every day for about a week... most got the message as the practice was almost eliminated. They repeated the operation once again after a month or two.


Zipper merge... on the very rare occasion TDOT utilizes it they post signs saying use both lanes and to zipper merge. I have only seen it done twice that I can recall since I started driving in 1970.



The shade comes free with the tree!
 
Posts: 3822 | Location: Middle Tennessee | Registered: February 07, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Get my pies
outta the oven!

Picture of PASig
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quote:
Originally posted by jed7s9b:
It’s not a zipper merge when there is no space for you to merge into. It’s not up to the drivers in the open lane to make space for you. It’s up to you to find and take space way back there where you saw the big giant sign that says your lane is ending. Racing up to the end and expecting everyone to stop and make an opening for you is not merging. The reason there is no space at the end is because of all the nitwits that raced up to end and stopped traffic so they could “merge”.


You clearly don’t understand the concept of zipper merging.

The sign isn’t saying “get in one lane 3 miles long” but that’s what people do


 
Posts: 31135 | Location: Pennsylvania | Registered: November 12, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Traffic has be moving to merge. When some nitwit races to the end of the lane and expects others to stop and let them in, that is not merging. Merging is getting in the moving lane where there is open space, like all of the other cars that said nitwit is passing have already done. It’s easy to pick out the nitwits from those who just haven’t found that spot due nitwits determined efforts to run to the end.
I have seen lots of trucks running side by side at a slow steady pace in order to not suffer the stop and go created by the nitwits “merge”. Always glad to see it.
 
Posts: 83 | Location: Kentucky | Registered: June 06, 2021Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Get my pies
outta the oven!

Picture of PASig
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quote:
Originally posted by jed7s9b:
Traffic has be moving to merge.



Yeah no shit

It’s NOT MOVING because everyone stacked up into ONE LANE 3 miles too early!

Roll Eyes


 
Posts: 31135 | Location: Pennsylvania | Registered: November 12, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by jed7s9b:
Traffic has be moving to merge. When some nitwit races to the end of the lane and expects others to stop and let them in, that is not merging. Merging is getting in the moving lane where there is open space, like all of the other cars that said nitwit is passing have already done. It’s easy to pick out the nitwits from those who just haven’t found that spot due nitwits determined efforts to run to the end.
I have seen lots of trucks running side by side at a slow steady pace in order to not suffer the stop and go created by the nitwits “merge”. Always glad to see it.


Once again, wrong. If the road is over capacity, it will stop, regardless of where the consolidation happens.



Demand not that events should happen as you wish; but wish them to happen as they do happen, and you will go on well. -Epictetus
 
Posts: 7796 | Location: Utah | Registered: December 18, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Unbelievable.
Everyone in one lane moves. It’s moving after the merge, correct?
The stop happens when people run to end and expect it all to stop so they can get over.
The opposite for example. Lanes join and expressway and continue without end. Slow Nitwits NEED to merge into the other lanes NOW and HERE. Traffic jamb. All they need to do is drive on and look for a space. They don’t even need to do that. But no. Traffic jamb. DOT added plastic lane divider posts and the traffic jamb just moved down the road.
Merge while you’re moving, at first notice, into the first available space. Don’t be a dick.
 
Posts: 83 | Location: Kentucky | Registered: June 06, 2021Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Raptorman
Picture of Mars_Attacks
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Y'all need to try Atlanta traffic.

It DOESN'T move, not even in the single lane, then there's the line breakers using the left turn lane to break line. People behind them blowing their horn as the left light is green.


____________________________

Eeewwww, don't touch it!
Here, poke at it with this stick.
 
Posts: 33255 | Location: North, GA | Registered: October 09, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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