I am a typical Viet Nam era vet whose fathers were in WWII. Almost all of my high school class of 1963 were in the military so I do not consider myself special. I signed up for OCS as I thought the extra pay would be necessary to support my soon to be wife. Jody got her when I was in AIT prior to me goingto the Infantry School at Ft Benning. After I got out and went back to college I was told that 70% of the U of TN business school were veterans. After graduating at age 25 I got a job in the corporate world. I then discovered that those that were exempt from the draft had started working at a younger age and were at a more senior level with better pay. No company cared about any military experience and actually would not hire anyone that was not exempt or a vet. Was I paid less because I spent 3 years in the Army,Yes.

I understand some of your feelings, and yes, people other than vets served their country. Garbage men, however, didn't get shot at while doing it. It really does come across as a douche post, because you don't know all vets. Matter of fact, I doubt you know many at all. Like the man said, the recruiters door was open.

I've met some vets who were complete wastes of space. The world would be better off without them. Is this a significant portion of veterans? Hell no. Vets are people. There are good ones and bad ones. I've known plenty of stand-up vets who are tributes to their country and society. Knowing someone is a vet when I first meet them gives them a slight shift on the balance towards the positive for me. It is not a pass to Jesus-like status, nor is anything else.

FWIW, I began military entrance processing in 2006-07, but was DQ'd for medical reasons. I wasn't allowed to serve in that fashion, but I immediately found other ways.

Lastly, there's no way the OP wrote that without realizing the kind of shitstorm such a douchey post would have brought up. Seems trollish to me.

I've got a single question for all of the Vet's.

What's your opinion of your recruiter?

quote:

Originally posted by FenderBender:
I've got a single question for all of the Vet's.

What's your opinion of your recruiter?

Mine was straight as an arrow. I took the ASVAB, my score qualified me for Advanced Electronics School with a 6 year obligation. I signed up while still a senior in high school for delayed entry in April of the year following graduation.

Only glitch was a phone call in February asking if I'd be willing to go early. As I was well and truly sick of what I was doing (slinging hoods and fenders on the night shift at the Oldsmobile plant) I said "Sure" and got on the bus. GLAKES in February wasn't the most fun I've ever had, but the rest, as they say is history.

Same as Paul said.

TSgt. Don Hillyer
No BS, helpful and honest.

quote:

Originally posted by FenderBender:
I've got a single question for all of the Vet's.

What's your opinion of your recruiter?

Mine was 100% not a used car salesman and pushed me to lose weight and do lots of pushups and sit ups and running in the approximately 10 months I was in the Delayed Entry Program.

He did look at me kinda funny when I insisted on becoming an Army cook after scoring a 98 on the ASVAB. He said something like “You DO know we give this MOS to people who can’t do anything else because of their ASVAB score, right?”

I got the MOS and had a blast doing it.

quote:

Originally posted by FenderBender:
What's your opinion of your recruiter?

MSGT Bogut. Great guy, and we remained friends for many years until his passing. He steered me in the right direction and it is no exaggeration to say that I would not be where I am today without his influence.

Philly, 1984. My recruiter was pretty good. Straight up and helped me get the advanced electronics that I wanted.

Now as an RDC, I had horror stories about recruiter each time I picked up a new division. I had recruits that came through Chicago MEPs when they where creating fake high school diplomas. Someone needs to start a new thread for that discussion.

Oath of a Naturalized Citizen:

I hereby declare, on oath, that I absolutely and entirely renounce and abjure all allegiance and fidelity to any foreign prince, potentate, state, or sovereignty of whom or which I have heretofore been a subject or citizen; that I will support and defend the Constitution and laws of the United States of America against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I will bear arms on behalf of the United States when required by the law; that I will perform noncombatant service in the Armed Forces of the United States when required by the law; that I will perform work of national importance under civilian direction when required by the law; and that I take this obligation freely without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; so help me God.

Oath of enlistment:

I, _____, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God.

Similar, not the same. Naturalization requires more commitment.

This is the premise of this thread. I swore this to death.

Naturalized citizens take an oath to this country, because we have come from places most can't fathom. 1975, Korea was a mud puddle. We only made it because of America.

My first Christmas at the orphanage the gates opened and all these trucks rolled in...at 5 years old, some US service member gave me a Fisher Price cash register, with the big buttons.

They ate our food, played games, spent an entire day with us orphans.

Much later (decades), in DC, I shared this story with Major General Frank Panter, USMC/ UN Command ROK/US Combined Forces Command US Forces Korea. (Only dropping his name because so many of you think I don't understand military structure)

He asked me to send him an email asking to describe that Christmas of 1975, to some no name Korean orphanage, because it was the USMC Toys for Tots program that delivered those gifts.

Of course I did, and that letter got published in the Navy Times, this was 20+ years ago.

So, those in this tread thinking I have some beef with veterans, this is not the case.

I have tried to live my life in service to this country, as my adoptive parents reared me to.

But to categorically say, that military service is the only way to have a vote is fundamentally wrong.

Sorry, you’re still an asshole in my book. Go back and read your first post, lay off the booze, and take some stress management classes.

For Pete’s sake stop. Just stop already.

I’m glad you were rescued from an orphanage. I’m glad you renounced all ties to your prince, dictator, previous overlords or whatever. I’m glad you want to serve this great country. But no, the naturalization oath does not require more commitment. Stop trying to equate your naturalization experience with military service. It is NOT the same.

And despite saying you don’t have a beef with veterans, as was already said go back and read your first post. It’s clear that you do. I’d think you’d be more grateful seeing how US soldiers made such an impression on you in Korea. But no, you show your ungrateful and jealous ass with your fries and crayon comment.

No, not all vets are perfect and not all served honorably but they served. Stop trying to equate your “service” to theirs. It’s not the same.

Instead of offering an apology or retraction of your offensive statements, you double down with your idiotic “naturalized citizens are more committed” comment. You should have just quit while you were behind.

So, I’ll reiterate what others have said and my previous post. Take your fries, crayon and smart ass comments and shove them up your ass. Oh, and fuck you.

Hmm. My only dog in this fight is that my husband served.
And he knew exactly what he signed up for: up to and including his life.

He received an honorable discharge and rarely/never used the “benefits” offered to veterans, such as loans for buying a house, etc. He rarely even stands up at events that ask military to stand up so they can be honored, but he’s finally starting to after I give him a poke and remind him that he did something worthwhile that he should be acknowledged for.

He has an old friend that served with him and he reminds my husband yearly what he did by sending us notes and gifts (my husband took an extra tour for him so he could be with his family in a time of need. Another thing he rarely mentions).

He is not the same as a garbage man; a garbage man can quit and walk away without repercussions. A garbage man can decide whether or not he wants to put his life on the line by collecting garbage from a questionable source.

I have the utmost respect for anyone who serves, because I see so many men and women walking around living this glorious, casual life without having done anything to earn the freedoms they have had, yet taking advantage/looking down at those who have worked to make sure that freedom is theirs.

Someone here did mention: there’s good and bad everywhere. Totally true.
I regularly see my husband getting overlooked when he should be getting thanked, and he just smiles and keeps moving. They have no fucking idea.

To the OP, you’re that poor marksman that just keeps missing the target. As Benjamin Franklin said, “Better to stay silent and have people merely think you’re a fool, than to speak up and remove all doubt.”

Lastly, I’ll just leave this here;

God and a soldier all people adore
in time of war, but not before.
And when the war is over,
and all wrongs are righted
God is ignored and an old soldier slighted.

Other than chuckling at other posts and my response to the Recruiter post, I've been holding my tongue here. However...

Sooma, it's a free country and you have every right to hold and express your opinion.

Trying to convert people who clearly do NOT share that opinion is a waste of breath and bandwidth. Give it up already.

I never served in the military. I kind of wish I had, but my life probably would have turned out very differently and I have no desire to change what I've got, so ultimately I have to conclude that it was for the best.

As others in this thread stated...vets are people, too, and some people as assholes. But military service shows self-discipline and a commitment to serving our country that I respect, and when I find out that someone has served they have my admiration by default until their actions dictate otherwise.

Sooma, I served in the US Army for 21 years. My wife is Korean and was naturalized in 1976.

I have another bag of fries for you to shove up your ass.

The military is the only job I know of that you can’t quit and really can’t say no when they want to send you somewhere or have you do something without legal ramifications.

I’m a proud veteran, and being so, part of a brotherhood you can’t understand unless you’ve been there.

I’m in no way special, nor do I expect special treatment and to the OP, you are entitled to your opinions, but I hope you can remember, you are entitled to express those opinions due to the blood spilled by those who have served this country.

Here’s another bag of fries you can shove up your ass.

This is from the asshole who said property owners or military members are the only ones who should vote. No skin in the game, you shouldn't be allowed to vote.

I drank professionally for my country and saw combat against civilians in Great Mistakes, Groton Connecticut and Charleston SC.

God Bless America.

There's going to be a lot freedom fries wasted up the OP's ass in this thread.