Out of a 2" barrel? I'm very skeptical.

quote:

Originally posted by CQB60:
Modern 38+P is more than capable.

any volunteers to take one for the team?

I carry the Speer Gold Dot short barrel 357's in my M&P 340. They are "manageable" at the range and I imagine they are more than adequate for their intended purpose. I've never chrono'd them (not really my thing). Personally I'm a believer in carrying what you are comfortable with if it makes you carry. To each their own.

That's stupid question.

Let's look at it this way. You're in a room. At the other end of the room is a 6'5" 230lb guy with a ten inch bowie knife that wants to cut you in half. You can have a gun with any of the normal handgun service calibers (sorry, no 454 Casull, no long gun calibers) including .38. Which would you choose? Would you want .38? For me, it would be the last choice.

quote:

Originally posted by az4783054:
any volunteers to take one for the team?

It's not a stupid question at all. Your response is theoretical. I have actual experience. The old saying about shot placement will always apply.

Have you ever shot someone with a 2" snub nose? I have, on the one day that I left my Colt Commander/.45 at home. A 2" snub nose Model 36 obviously would not have been my first choice had I known what he was armed with. I made do.

He was a homicide and kidnapping suspect with his hand pulling out his Model 29/.44mag and yelling he was going to kill three other homicide detectives and myself. He carried a bag with 200 rds of ammunition.

We were all caught off guard with no solid cover inside the single wide mobile home. It was broad daylight but in a darkened hallway. One of the other detectives fired a Model 39/9mm, missed and struck a door behind the suspect. Another fired a 12 gauge/ 870, struck the HVAC return vent, ricocheted and struck the back door the suspect had just entered. Shooting distance was just over 7 yards.

I fired one round of (worthless) Super Vel hitting his 6'3", 250# body squarely in the chest. He bragged to the medical staff that he intended to kill us all had I not shot him. He later died of complications.

^
Did he go down, or did he just give up?

He went down.

He was moving towards the bathroom when I fired, evidently a poor plan to barricade himself. One of the other detectives and I approached from inside while the other two went outside. He was laying on the floor 'bubbling ooze' and reaching for his pistol again. The 870 within inches of his face changed his mind.

I still have the SUPER VEL round that failed to expand. My shot ricocheted off a rib and penetrated well enough to take out chunks of several internal organs.

My weasel chief ordered me not to tell anyone about the SUPER VEL performance. So I bought a couple hundred rounds of REMINGTON jhp and gave rounds to revolver carriers that wanted them.

Do I wish I'd had carried something larger: yes, but the outcome probably wouldn't have been any different.

^
So you got in a good shot, which had some effect.
But the guy was still conscious and maneuvering enough to be able to try to go for his gun, until your partner shoved a shotgun in his face. Still, a good outcome in that situation. I also get the feeling this was quite a while ago (70's-80's)

Nowadays, if you had the same Model 36 and a P365 sitting on your dresser next to each other, and you have to pick one to grab to go out on that assignment (not knowing that it would go down they way it did), which one would you pick?

This message has been edited. Last edited by: BBMW,

az4783054

Man that's a great story. Must admit, most amazed that the cop missed with a shotgun at 7 yards. Not judging by any means, just goes to show what can happen when things go south quickly.

I just purchased my first revolver, the new Colt Cobra retro. I think it is really nice. I carry it occasionally with Speer Gold Dot Plus P JHP short barrel ammo and don't feel its any less capable than a 9mm round with the exception of capacity of course.

quote:

Originally posted by BBMW:
Nowadays, if you had the same Model 36 and a P365 sitting on your dresser next to each other, and you have to pick one to grab to go out on that assignment (not knowing that it would go down they way it did), which one would you pick?

quote:

Originally posted by az4783054:
Do I wish I'd had carried something larger: yes, but the outcome probably wouldn't have been any different.

Moral of the story: there is no magic bullet.

This is true. But that highlights two facts. None are magic, but some are better than others. Also, the more you have the better off you are. Note, I'm only talking about the hardware side of the equation. There is also the training/practice/tactics side. But I take those as a constant in this discussion.

quote:

Originally posted by VictimNoMore:
Moral of the story: there is no magic bullet.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: BBMW,

quote:

Originally posted by az4783054:
He went down.

He was moving towards the bathroom when I fired, evidently a poor plan to barricade himself. One of the other detectives and I approached from inside while the other two went outside. He was laying on the floor 'bubbling ooze' and reaching for his pistol again. The 870 within inches of his face changed his mind.

I still have the SUPER VEL round that failed to expand. My shot ricocheted off a rib and penetrated well enough to take out chunks of several internal organs.

My weasel chief ordered me not to tell anyone about the SUPER VEL performance. So I bought a couple hundred rounds of REMINGTON jhp and gave rounds to revolver carriers that wanted them.

Do I wish I'd had carried something larger: yes, but the outcome probably wouldn't have been any different.

AZ. I got a partial box of the Super Vel 110 .38 a couple of years ago. Took them to the ballistics section at PSP's Crime Lab in Harrisburg. The round out of the 2 Inch Masterpiece failed to expand, The round out of the 4 inch Masterpiece just started to Expand. The round out of the six inch Model 14 did expand Fairly well. This is from twenty five years ago and it did leave an impression on me.

With springtime among us I have left my 365 at home and have opted to carry my Smith 340PD. I can wear it with cotton shorts and a sticky holster in my drawers with its 14oz weight loaded I feel it works for me.

Somewhat relevant to a conversation between a friend of mine.

He went through a bear defense course, where he was taught to try to side step and shoot the heart.

While I do not know about bears, an anaerobic athlete human should be able to function about 45 seconds of myoglobin and creatin. This should negate the need for heart function.

During these blazing hot months, I carry my Colt cobra 2" with .38+P 135gr GDs a lot.

Will the P365 fit in the sticky holster (which are known for not being so gun specific) and carrying it the same way? Would that work? Yes, I know it will be heavier.

quote:

Originally posted by barry1967:
With springtime among us I have left my 365 at home and have opted to carry my Smith 340PD. I can wear it with cotton shorts and a sticky holster in my drawers with its 14oz weight loaded I feel it works for me.

j frame in an uncle mikes pouch into frt pocket always works very well for me .. thinking of changing to a small glock just because i now know how reliable they are and would like to increase round count some Might experiment with some OWB holsters and just wear long shirt

quote:

Originally posted by BBMW:
Will the P365 fit in the sticky holster (which are known for not being so gun specific) and carrying it the same way? Would that work? Yes, I know it will be heavier.

Yes, a P365 fits just fine in a sticky-type holster. I occasionally carry mine this way. And yes, it's heavier with 147-grainers in it.

Ah, 2020. Interesting times. Due to the pandemic situation, all of my shooting training has been “dry,” so my auto-loading pistols have been relegated to being museum pieces, as my long-stroke DA skill is much less perishable than my skills with 1911 or Glock triggers, and, of course, dry-firing a DA revolver does not require that the slide be used to reset the trigger/hammer/striker. I do not foresee live-firing my Glocks or 1911s before some time next year. (My wife, and another adult in our household, have medical conditions that would make a COVID infection a likely death sentence, so we stay away from publicly-accessible buildings, unless absolutely necessary.)

After retiring from policin’, in 2018, I was tending to gravitate to DA revolvers, anyway. Nothing fits my hands better than a GP100, with K-/L-Frames, Security/Sevice/Speed Sixes, and the SP101 not being far behind.

Plus, my right hand, wrist, and arm do not always do what I want them to do. This can cause limp-wrist malfunctions, if I shoot right-handed, and if I shoot an auto lefty, my right hand may have trouble running the slide. (It is not a hand-strength thing, but nerve and structural issues, with good days and bad days.)

J-Frames may be convenient, but they are becoming painful, for my aging hands, and they are a less-“natural” fit, so require live-fire training, for me to maintain confidence in my accuracy. So, I have tended to use medium- and medium-large-frame revolvers.

I do like auto-loading shotguns and rifles. Nothing against auto-loading, in principle. Life is good.

quote:

Originally posted by njauto:
az4783054

Must admit, most amazed that the cop missed with a shotgun at 7 yards.

It's not that hard to miss with a shotgun at 7 yards.

I can do it with one hand tied behind my back.