That Amazon trailer shows me nothing but woke shit. Amazon is going to shit on LOTR the same way Disney shit on Star Wars. I think I'm going to just avoid this Amazon crap entirely and simply enjoy the perfection of the LOTR and Hobbit movies, along with the books. No skin off my teeth.

"Everything woke goes to shit."
- President Donald J. Trump

quote:

Originally posted by Chris17404:
I think I'm going to just avoid this Amazon crap entirely and simply enjoy the perfection of the LOTR...

Agreed...

quote:

... and Hobbit movies

Well, you lost me there.

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Originally posted by P220 Smudge:
If you're not totally ruined for all of it now, ...

I am. I’m more of a Sci-fi geek anyway.

quote:

Originally posted by RogueJSK:

Well, you lost me there.

Visually amazing... which is what made an even bigger shame. If I had to list a movie that disappointed me the most, it was that (them). Wow.

(I'd take some '77 animated version of that any day.)

quote:

Originally posted by cas:
(I'd take some '77 animated version of that any day.)

I think I wore out two LPs of that Hobbit version when I was little. I love that version.

I am hopeful for this, but have grave reservations.

I find the Silmarillion unreadable, as a whole. There are some parts that are good stories, but for me, it is more a reference work.

(Of course I say that not having seen it in 40+ years)

quote:

Originally posted by RogueJSK:

quote:

... and Hobbit movies

Well, you lost me there.

Ok, they weren’t perfect. But the only real criticism I have of them is that they could have condensed it down to maybe 2 movies instead of 3, and they took some liberties with the story. They modified the LOTR trilogy movies too.

Could you articulate your criticisms of the Hobbit movies? I have no intention of doubting, just curious about your perspective.

quote:

Originally posted by mark123:
I think I finally found the reason for my hatred of the series. W

....The Silmarillon has to be plodded through, it explains a lot. You see, it was the first Tolkein book I picked up. That made it also the last.

Yeah...you did it all wrong and now you're scared for life
Silmarillion should be read ONLY after reading through The Hobbit and The Lord of the Rings and ONLY then, should you even consider picking up the Silmarillion

This shit is getting old. I gave up on WoT and I'm not going to bother w/ this shit. It's like they keep trying to out do themselves to have the least viewed show, not recognizing the results of the other woke series, Or recognizing it and trying to out do it.
Like they're totally oblivious. Lemmings.

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Could you articulate your criticisms of the Hobbit movies?

The writing was pretty tone-deaf to their own story much of the time. The insanity around the goblin king was stupid. The goblins were de-fanged and cartoonish, and presented ZERO threat to the dwarves. The ride down to the the bottom of the goblin cave and then the giant ass carcass of the king falling on them was stupid. The forbidden love story was stupid. Legolas being a thing felt like a shoehorn. The dumb-ass jokes about salad were stupid, as was the fat jokes.

There was just so much nonsensical writing. Made no sense and completely eliminated ANY sense of peril. It's one thing to make a prequel, because you know that at the very least Bilbo and Gandalf survive (for those that didn't read the book) but it's another to turn everything into a goddamn joke, like the barrel ride down the river. Did it NEED to be a circus? Why make it so stupid and circus like?

Plus the entire ice fight. Plus the entire forge fight against Smaug. I guess it's been a long time since I've read the book, but did they have the boring worms in the books too?

I am NOT a The Hobbit scholar though so I fully expect to be schooled a bit should this stuff all be ripped from the book.

Will not watch equity Tolkien!

quote:

Originally posted by mark123:
Maybe I should have picked up The Hobbit first or anything lighter.

The Hobbit is an excellent read.

You make some valid points, Veeper. I guess I mostly ignored much of those negatives and really enjoyed the way the story was tied into the rest of the LOTR movies. I also would have preferred the Dwarves to look more like Dwarves but I understand the need to make each one look more unique so the characters could be followed.

quote:

Originally posted by Chris17404:
You make some valid points, Veeper. I guess I mostly ignored much of those negatives and really enjoyed the way the story was tied into the rest of the LOTR movies. I also would have preferred the Dwarves to look more like Dwarves but I understand the need to make each one look more unique so the characters could be followed.

Yeah I get that they needed to set them apart, but I also think they cut a lot of corners for brevity. I would imagine someone was like, "Oh shit, we need to do TWELVE John Rhys dwarves? That took FOREVER. Can we just pretend they're small and not swap out midgets? That body-double swapping smacks of effort."

And like that... *poof* you get a cheap-looking production where everyone is pretending to be small, but they don't actually look small because there's no body doubles so the people playing the dwarves ALWAYS interact with their environment like they're fully grown humans. Immersion busted! Good job.

It even made their fighting look like full-scale humans fighting with weapons that were just a bit too large. Their bodies moved un-dwarfish.

They had the budget and ability to make an EPIC version of The Hobbit. They had the acting talent and the the director who could have had a second homerun, but stretching it to three movies and hiring shit writers or allowing shit-people to have input in the writing room, made the movie forgettable.

It's too bad.

(My opinion anyway.)

Huge pass based on the trailer. (yes, I know, it's only 2 minutes)

I enjoyed the previous 6 movies and I will park it there.

Hope those that watch are pleasantly surprised.

Hey guys, since we're mentioning The Silmarillion, I have to bring up The Children of Hurin. It's subject matter from The Silmarillion, but fleshed out more like The Lord of The Rings. It got published, oh, around 2007. If you read all the other stuff and you haven't read Children of Hurin, I'm pretty sure you would enjoy it. Very well done. If I remember correctly, it's edited by his son Christopher, but it's all source material his father left behind, the way The Silmarillion was.

quote:

Originally posted by mark123:

quote:

Originally posted by P220 Smudge:
If you're not totally ruined for all of it now, ...

I am. I’m more of a Sci-fi geek anyway.

Probably myself as well, but I guess I'm glad Tolkien didn't get ruined for me.

The LOTR movie series by Peter Jackson had some wonderful scenes but it was Jackson's vision of the LOTR books. He did an admirable job but imho the errors and omissions from the original works was what many of us found to be distressing. The hobbit movies were barely worth the film used to record them, imho.

I have to agree with the geeky girl overall assessment - it's woke (although I don't recall her using that word.) All Amazon had to do was follow the books, it's all in there, everything, an entire mythology. Sigh.

If only Tolkien knew how much better his books would have been if had consulted with special interest groups and activists. He could have traded a racist, white dominated, patriarchal, misogynist, homophobic mythology of oppression for an uplifting tale of diversity and social/economic justice for all of Middle Earths oppressed people of color and identity.
Now, Amazon will right that wrong.

Just to piggyback off of Veeper's observations... the orcs rose from the mountain and are rushing the elves, dwarfs and men. The dwarfs create a shield wall with long spears andddddd.... the elves jump over the protective barrier and engage in hand to hand combat instead of letting the spikey shield wall do its job.

It would have been so much better if a hail of arrows came crashing down on the orcs before they hit the wall, then the wall withstands the rush then the dwarfs run over the survivors ragged.


Don't get me started on the crappy CGI armies that has 1 solider model multiplied by 10,000 and everyone does the exact same movements at the exact same time. LOTR had vast armies that didn't look like shoddy CGI so there's no excuse for that in the Hobbit.