My wifes '14 Xterra with a manual transmission (which has a clutch safety switch and an override) has started having issues with an intermittent no crank. It is not the little plastic plug on the clutch pedal for the safety switch. BTDT.

Starter is good, battery is good. When the issue crops up, the starter does NOT receive power out of the IPDM under the hood to the signal wire of the starter. Everything else in the truck powers up when the key is on and a relay under the dash clicks while turning the key to the crank position.

I swapped in the same P/N IPDM from my '12 Frontier while troubleshooting and still no crank.

Pushed the Xterra into the garage and started poking around further to include dropping the column and looking at the BCM under the dash as the wiring diagram I located showed that being tied into the starting system.

Put everything back together and it started again. Not sure why as I didn't locate any definite issues. I got nine days out of that "fix", but my wife got another no crank today. I'm running out of ideas to fix an intermittent issue that won't stay broken long enough to troubleshoot and isn't throwing a code. Last thing I need is for her to get stranded somewhere.

Anyone run across this issue before? This needlessly complicated starter circuit is driving me nuts.

Thanks.

You have the control side and load side of that starter.
The control side has the windings that energize the solenoid (load).
If you check for power on the control side at the starter, with the connector plugged in, you will show none or very little voltage because it is being used up by the windings.
Check for voltage at the small wire on starter with it unplugged.
Long story short: you may have battery cable issues but unlikely.
The large contacts in the starterare worn out, causing an intermittent no start.
I used to have some one try and start it while I was tapping on the starter with a long socket extension.

It isn't the starter or the signal wire to the solenoid.

I've already verified the starter is good, the signal wire had continuity and can carry a load between the IPDM and the starter but the IPDM is not sending the start signal to the starter when the key is in the crank position intermittently.

If you supply power to the signal wire, the starter works? or how did you confirm the starter is good.

When you get the no-crank, what does the little security system light do?

quote:

Originally posted by rizzle:
If you supply power to the signal wire, the starter works? or how did you confirm the starter is good.

This an excellent question.

I do have an Xterra (wifes) but also have a Titan that did experience this problem.

> I had to rule out the ignition switch itself and IPDM Relay ~ replaced both (cheap $)
> Same issue of "intermittent starting" or rather engaging the starter.
> To solve I had to test the starter after the ignition by a direct connection.
> It still persisted

What was happening is the solenoid apparently had spots on it allowing it to start or not start (or rather engage) depending on where it was positioned.

The only alternative was to replace the whole starter (not a fun job on a Titan).

So you do need to test the starter properly.
Note: there are some minor prerequisites with the test as this only checks to see if the starter engages or not and you do not want it to actually start the vehicle in this test ~ look it up to do it right.

Luckily the replacement procedure is much easier than my Titan.

Good Luck.

The OP answered his own question when he said he had no power on the signal wire.
This refers to starter solenoids that are not run for long periods of time.

The signal wire is showing no voltage on an energized circuit because it is all used up in the solenoid windings. If you unplug the wire at the starter and try to start it and have system voltage, that would be good, on a connected energized circuit there should be very little voltage there.
So, you have to suspect the starter load contacts.

Last time I had intermittent starter problem, it turned out to be a dead segment on the commutator.

quote:

Originally posted by rizzle:
If you supply power to the signal wire, the starter works? or how did you confirm the starter is good.

Yes, that is correct. If the signal wire is powered the starter will crank, likewise if the signal wire is bypassed with a hot wire from the battery. When the no crank issue occurs, the signal wire will not illuminate a test lite as the IPDM is not sending power to the starter.

Unfortunately/fortunately depending on your perspective it has not stayed broken long enough for me to test the control side of the equation in the IPDM but having swapped in a known good IPDM and not solved the problem, my present operating theory is that the issue is in the wiring or switchgear before the IPDM.

quote:

Originally posted by egregore:
When you get the no-crank, what does the little security system light do?

Unfortunately, I don't remember. I will say, the issue happens with both sets of keys.

quote:

Originally posted by smschulz:

quote:

Originally posted by rizzle:
If you supply power to the signal wire, the starter works? or how did you confirm the starter is good.

This an excellent question.

I do have an Xterra (wifes) but also have a Titan that did experience this problem.

> I had to rule out the ignition switch itself and IPDM Relay ~ replaced both (cheap $)
> Same issue of "intermittent starting" or rather engaging the starter.
> To solve I had to test the starter after the ignition by a direct connection.
> It still persisted

What was happening is the solenoid apparently had spots on it allowing it to start or not start (or rather engage) depending on where it was positioned.

The only alternative was to replace the whole starter (not a fun job on a Titan).

So you do need to test the starter properly.
Note: there are some minor prerequisites with the test as this only checks to see if the starter engages or not and you do not want it to actually start the vehicle in this test ~ look it up to do it right.

Luckily the replacement procedure is much easier than my Titan.

Good Luck.

Starter is good, issue persists intermittently with both the original starter and another known good unit. Having two vehicles with a common drivetrain is handy for troubleshooting.

I was really hoping it was the starter the first time this happened several months ago but banging the starter with a hammer and jumping the solenoid did nothing other than make me start looking in the upstream wiring which then healed itself for about nine weeks until about nine days ago and then again last night.

I wish I had a scan tool to see what the BCM and ECM think is happening when the key is turned to the crank position.

quote:

Originally posted by M1Garandy:

I was really hoping it was the starter the first time this happened several months ago but banging the starter with a hammer and jumping the solenoid did nothing other than make me start looking in the upstream wiring which then healed itself for about nine weeks until about nine days ago and then again last night.

I wish I had a scan tool to see what the BCM and ECM think is happening when the key is turned to the crank position.

You jumped the starter solenoid and nothing happened? might want to volt drop the battery cables.

My response was poorly written.

Banging on the starter did not work.

Jumping the solenoid DID work which reinforced that the signal wire was not getting power from the IDPM when the key was turned to the crank position.

Had another no crank today while I was 10 feet from the truck. I walked over to see what the security light would do on the next crank attempt, and it cranked right over and fired up. So frustrating.

egregore most likely called what's going on, I take things like that to be looked at already. If you have a code reader there is a slim chance that there will be a history code in it for security.

He very well may be right.

Especially since I remembered this truck has one original key and the other is a clone of the original and not two original factory keys.

I'm sure I saw what the security light was doing when this first happened months ago, but I don't remember what that was and I wasn't thinking about chipped keys at that point in my thought process.

Did a little reading on it, this TSB lists the push button and key types. You should not see the security light when trying to start it.
quote:
If the Immobilizer warning light (Figure 2) remains illuminated during attempts to start the engine, this could indicate that the key was not authenticated properly.
https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/t...MC-10235707-0001.pdf

It's going to get to the point that you're going to need a scan tool. I'm not sure how to learn a key on that but some locksmiths can relearn keys around here.

That is an interesting TSB. Strange that everything was fine for years. Until it wasn't.

I've been kicking around buying a decent scan tool for several years now and just never pulled the trigger. Looking more and more like I need to.

I have a neighbor that I'm friendly with that is a part time mechanic, perhaps I can secure one on a short-term loan since he has a day job at the moment that is not running his one-man shop.