quote:

Originally posted by 12131:
Obviously, they already have the ATF's blessing (aka, the Letter). Will be interesting to see the explanation.

Its not like they have ever reversed one of these rulings. Oh wait......

quote:

Originally posted by RogueJSK:
Perhaps. But many machine guns have a "semi" setting as well, and that doesn't make them "rifles".

Well, think of an M-16. With it in the semi setting, it functions like and meets the definition of a rifle. With the burst or auto setting, it functions like and meets the definition of a machinegun. So it must be registered as a machinegun, because it's capable of functioning as a machinegun.

With the binary trigger, in semi, and on a firearm designed to fire from the shoulder, with a rifled bore, it meets the definition of a rifle. It is a rifle. While in the binary position it seems to fall outside the "single pull" semantics of a rifle under 18USC921, and outside the "single function" semantics of 26USC5845. However, it's still a rifle, because it's configured to function like a rifle in one of it's settings.

A smooth bore, with either a non permanent rifled portion, or some other way to stabilize the projectile, seems more plausible.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: DMF,

quote:

Originally posted by MG34_Dan:
I would like to see the action's internals. The rear of the barrel may be extended rearward and has a shuttle type action to insert the ammo into the barrel's breech.

Barrel length is measured from the closed breech face, to the farthest permanent portion of the muzzle.

https://www.atf.gov/file/58251/download
"The ATF procedure for measuring barrel length is to measure from the closed bolt (or breech-face) to the furthermost end of the barrel or permanently attached muzzle device. Permanent methods of attachment include full-fusion gas or electric steel-seam welding, high-temperature (1100°F) silver soldering, or blind pinning with the pin head welded over. Barrels are measured by inserting a dowel rod into the barrel until the rod stops against the bolt or breech-face. The rod is then marked at the furthermost end of the barrel or permanently attached muzzle device, withdrawn from the barrel, and measured."

Have we heard anything about how they did it yet?

quote:

Originally posted by Tuckerrnr1:
Have we heard anything about how they did it yet?

If no one, with actual knowledge, leaks it, we won't get an answer until the SHOT show.

Maybe if you "think" and "act" like it isn't a rifle, you have not "manufactured" a NFA item, in thought or mind.

Seriously, interesting to see what they have cooked up.

So, a rifle that self-identifies as "not a rifle"?

I see this causing a whole lots of clarification letters and later gets reversed.... you know, we can't have good things.

Some other speculation is that it will have a binary trigger with a semi setting that only fires with the release of the trigger.

That's my guess.

I guess I'm the only one who's more intrigued by the Martin Luther imagery in the ad.

I’m curious (and confused) about the “smoothbore” idea. Is that mentioned in the manufacturer’s advertising, or is it just speculation?

One blog discussion pointed out that having a barrel with no rifling would make it a shotgun unless it had straight (not helical) lands and grooves. But a completely smooth barrel or one with straight grooves would not spin the bullet and therefore the accuracy would be very poor, not to mention that a conventional bullet of the type used in the 223/5.56 cartridges would start to tumble almost immediately after leaving the barrel and would therefore have very short range. If only a part of the barrel were conventionally rifled, what legal difference would that make?

Am I missing something about why the gun might use a smoothbore barrel?

Wouldn’t a smooth bore barrel under 18” be an NFA item?

Franklin hasn't yet explained exactly how they accomplished it, but they have specifically stated that it's not a smoothbore.

Why does the rail (on the upper and handguard) look as if they photo-shopped some of the lugs out?

The "Gun Collective" did a video & stated that it is not a smooth bore.

Whatever it turns out to be I have to give FA cudos to the ability to get folks very interested in & talking about their product.
As well as all the free publicity that their vague presentation has caused.

I'm anxious to find out what this actually is ... & I don't even know why ! LoL

quote:

Originally posted by Excam_Man:
Why does the rail (on the upper and handguard) look as if they photo-shopped some of the lugs out?

Maybe that's how they get the approval.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/w...hands-shot-show-2018



These people apparently shot it and are not sure what loophole FA exploited. The plot thickens.

It’s straight land or lands. It is for close in defense, 25-50 yard max. A gimmick to drum up interest. It can’t be anything else.

Now suppose you could get helical cuts on some 556. Probably be more expensive than the stamp.

What a joke. Franklin Armory is going to be mocked by everyone for this. I guess this is cutting edge tech if you are a 17th century Conquistador.

Rather than jumping to conclusion, we should wait for actual details.

As to the smoothbore/musket possibility, all we have so far is speculation and some conflicting reports from the Range Day, with Franklin Armory stating that it's "not a smoothbore", some media outlets reporting that it does have rifling, and other media outlets reporting that it has no rifling. To further confuse things, at least one gun blog has retracted their initial statement about it not having rifling.

Luckily, the official reveal is supposed to be at 8:30 am today, Las Vegas time. So we'll know for sure in roughly an hour.

Even if it turns out to be some dumb gimmick, Franklin Armory has certainly done a good job of drumming up interest and getting folks talking about their product. Way more successful than other similar recent attempts that cost a lot more and resulted in much less interest/hype. (I'm looking at you, Springfield Saint...)