GAP finally opened their Pinnacle Production Rifles back up for sale after waiting months for receivers. I was lucky enough to order one on the day they were back in stock.

https://youtube.com/shorts/cyL...?si=TnPs7Ea4yYGHB5KF

My question is on optics. I have a SWFA 5-20 HD that I plan to mount on this rifle. My max shooting distance around here is 850yds. Would you guys run this optic or pony up for a Leupold MK5 or NF NX8? Im currently running the scope on my WOA .223 gas gun and it is too much optic for that rifle. SWFA has their new 3-15 Gen 2 models with their new Christmas tree reticle on sale for $599 which I think is a steal at that price for what you get. I plan to order one for the gas gun as I feel it will be a better fit.

What are your thoughts on the 5-20 for the GAP rifle?

This message has been edited. Last edited by: usncorpsman,

Wow! That looks like a nice rifle. I have seen only good reviews of GAP rifles, and the 6 GT cartridge attracted my attention at one point (but I must draw the line someplace ).

I will be very interested in range reports.

As for a sight, I know really nothing about SWFA scopes other than that many people believe they’re good offerings for the money. Based on what I know in general, if you’re not planning to use the rifle for PRS-type competitions, I would imagine that your 5-30 would be fine. For competition shooting that requires continuous elevation dialing for different ranges and good optical quality for a couple/three reasons, including finding hard-to-see targets, I can only guess that it wouldn’t be as suitable as the Leupold or Nightforce you’re considering. But I could be wrong.

FWIW, have a Leupold 5HD 5-25×56mm that I like, has good reviews, and is popular among competitors. I don’t really need it for the way I use it, but I have many scopes in that category, so it’s not alone.

In your situation and as you already have the SWFA scope, I’d just try it for a time to see how you like it. You can always upgrade later (unless, of course, you need to take advantage of a BF deal right now. )

You can do better than a SWFA scope on a GAP rifle. If you have the funds at least get a Leupold Mark 4 HD. The new Vortex Razor 4-24 is getting good reviews as well.

quote:

Originally posted by 2Adefender:
You can do better than a SWFA scope on a GAP rifle.

Yep.

Much depends on what you intend to do with a precision rifle with a precision chambering. If you intend to compete in some kind of steel-target matches with this rifle, your SWFA isn't the right scope. If you intend to really learn how to shoot the rifle -- elevation, windage, multiple targets, multiple positions, on the clock -- your SWFA isn't the right scope. If you intend to shoot this rifle for years, wearing out some barrels -- your SWFA isn't the right scope.

If you intend to bang away at a target once in a blue moon, then let the rifle hide in the safe -- your SWFA will do the job.

If you intend to shoot the GAP here and there on occasion, then sell it when the "next great rifle" comes along -- your SWFA will do the job.

I'm not impressed with SWFA's zoom optics. Their fixed magnification scopes seem to be reasonable for the price, however. I've not looked through your SWFA model. But going by past models I've been behind, and by some webz reviews:
- The reticle's lines aren't crisp.
- The glass isn't all that clear. This becomes more critical as distances increase, and as lighting conditions aren't optimal.
- The reticle design isn't that good. If you intend to compete in steel-target matches, it really isn't good at all.

Not as any sort of recommendation or discouragement, but something to be aware of about Nightforce scopes that doesn’t get much attention is that some models exhibit “tunneling.”

If you’re not familiar with the term, tunneling refers to how a scope’s field of view that normally increases as the magnification is dialed down will stop becoming larger before the lowest power setting.

For example, the Nightforce ATACR 7-35×56 scopes I have show tunneling when the magnification is turned down to (an estimated) 8.5-9× setting or so. I.e., the field of view increases as the power is turned down from 35× but then stops increasing at the tunneling point. The image becomes smaller and the first focal plane reticle apparently gets thinner past that point to 7×, but the field of view does not get larger. What that means is that the 7-35 scope is in vision terms more of a 9-35 scope, or 1:4 rather than 1:5.

Does tunneling matter? Only if we want the field of view that the lowest magnification should offer and that would normally be the reason for decreasing the magnification. I see many of the ATACR 7-35 scopes used in sniper and precision rifle competitions, but those shooters probably never shoot using under 10× magnification and therefore it doesn’t matter to them—and assuming they’re even aware of the phenomenon.
Based on the pictures I have seen, the Secret Service snipers providing overwatch during the Trump assassination attempt appeared to have been using the 7-35 ATACR model.

I seldom use my NF scopes at less than 15× or so, and therefore it doesn’t matter to me either, except for the minor mental speedbump when I remember that I paid for a 1:5 magnification range scope, not 1:4 as the ATACR really is. (As a military vet I got a great deal and excellent customer service from NF, so that’s not really a complaint.)

Do NX8 scopes exhibit tunneling? I don’t know personally, but a search for “Nightforce NX8 tunneling” will produce claims from users that at least some do, for example the 4-32× model.
And FWIW Nightforce is not the only high tier brand whose scopes exhibit tunneling.

Good snag! I was looking to grab one as well but sold out, again.

Personally, I would put an NF or Leupold on but that's my preference and what I have in my safe available. Enjoy your new 6GT!

Thank you guys for the replies. They are much appreciated.

My plans for the rifle are just shooting with a group of buddies. We meet up on Wednesday’s and shoot steel for bragging rights. 850 is our longest shot. I will not be entering any competitions, shooting on the clock or running and gunning. In that respect, the SWFA should work well,

At one point the 5-20 HD was well regarded and sought after. They are now getting long in the tooth, but still quite a nice optic, especially for the $400 I paid for it. I’m going shoot it on the GAP till I decide if I need to or want to spend 2K plus on a new optic.

The Leupold MK5 is calling my name and sometimes I am weak to resist when something I like is out there…..lol.

I’m moving a scope now to a Howa ultralight rifle, 243. This one is a Nikon 2-7 Monarch, ok for intended use.

Seems to me ‘most’ manufacturers have various quality levels, no surprise. There’s the entry end, then on up.

Often the ‘rebranded’ scopes are made by a known scope company, then labeled whatever. With my use, I don’t feel every rifle I’m using needs a $700+ scope. I’m a more casual shooter, then most any shot while hunting is inside 150 yards.

Just general comments.

Congrats Usncorp. I had a Gap once and like a dummie. Sold it. Big regret.

On the optic thing. I have heard good things on the bushnell optic line as an intermediate line of scopes without going to the top of the market.

Best of luck.

Congrats on scoring that GAP Rifle! And honestly, I think you made a wise choice re: the scope. You can always upgrade the glass to something else later if your needs change, and you can get behind that GAP rifle right now at no add'l cost.

Sooo, did you take advantage of the SWFA Black Friday Deal and pick up the 3-15x42 Gen 2 Scope for the WOA .223 gas gun?

I've been waiting for the SWFA Black Friday Deal(s) since late August! I grabbed two SWFA Scopes at 12:01 AM CST on Black Friday; a 10x42 MOA Gen 2 w/ Side-Focus Parallax (NOT the V2 'Christmas Tree' Reticle...I hate those things!) for my Ruger 'USA Shooting' 10/22, and a 1-4x24 Illuminated MIL-Quad DM LPVO for a Larue AR I put together w/ the UUK (Ultimate Upper kit) a couple of years ago. I like that SWFA threw in the mounts as part of the Black Friday deals (Scope Rings for the 10x42 and a Cantilever Scope Mount for the 1-4 LPVO) for free! Even if I end up with a different mounting solution (I probably will on the LPVO), at least they will allow me to get the scopes mounted and determine the correct/preferred heights, etc before I spend any more money. They should be here on Monday!

This message has been edited. Last edited by: nhracecraft,

This is for a specific type of competition, so take from that what you will.

Targets are typically from 300 yards min to 1400 max.

Average target distance of engagement is usually around 600 yards.


Magnifications discussion:


https://precisionrifleblog.com...g-what-the-pros-use/

Optics brand and model discussion:


https://precisionrifleblog.com...g-what-the-pros-use/

For clarity, I didn't share the last link to suggest that you should drop $5000 on an optic. Just to give you an idea on who is making optics tough enough for PRS.

Leupold, Vortex and some others have some great options especially on some of their older models. Nightforce is of course always a solid choice.

Carefully consider what reticle you want as well, before you buy.

quote:

Originally posted by usncorpsman:
Thank you guys for the replies. They are much appreciated.

My plans for the rifle are just shooting with a group of buddies. We meet up on Wednesday’s and shoot steel for bragging rights. 850 is our longest shot. I will not be entering any competitions, shooting on the clock or running and gunning. In that respect, the SWFA should work well,

At one point the 5-20 HD was well regarded and sought after. They are now getting long in the tooth, but still quite a nice optic, especially for the $400 I paid for it. I’m going shoot it on the GAP till I decide if I need to or want to spend 2K plus on a new optic.

The Leupold MK5 is calling my name and sometimes I am weak to resist when something I like is out there…..lol.

I made my previous post before I had scrolled down to this post.

Your SWFA should do fine.

A lot of what you pay for in the higher end scopes is durability for a lot of dialing, as well as nearly perfect tracking where if you dial 1.8 mils you get exactly 1.8 mils. And when you dial back to zero, it truly goes back to zero.


Once piece of gear you might consider is a Kestrel with the applied ballistics software.

Takes out almost all of the guesswork regarding atmospheric conditions. If you have a dope chart that you work up in December, it will be incorrect at longer distances in August, just due to air density.

Although:

Leupold 5-25x56 auction.

Hello guys. Again, thank you for the replies. I did not get one of the 3-15 SWFA’s on BF. I have an extra Vortex Viper PST 2-10X32 that should pair up well with my WOA gun.

My plan is to use the 5-20 SWFA until I decide if I need to buy a better scope for the rifle.

Sigfreund……you are not making this an easy decision

quote:

Originally posted by usncorpsman:
Sigfreund……you are not making this an easy decision

“Join us … don’t be afraid.”