I think that I need a new AR.
Is there a big difference between a $800 and a $2500 gun. Looked at a Geissele rifle .
Looks nice but not sure what you get for $1700 more over the $800 gun?

What does the AR brain trust say?

Thank you in advance.

Jeff

Depends on what you might be using it for. What is the purpose for your new AR?

I am not the authority on various price levels of ARs that many members here are, but the one thing I expect and have seen with higher priced guns is better precision (accuracy potential). Even at a price level somewhat above $800, the precision performance of the guns I’m familiar with has definitely not been up to the same level as those costing $2K and up. To get the full benefit of that higher accuracy quality, however, it’s necessary to use high quality ammunition and proper sights. Even the highest quality rifles won’t deliver half-MOA groups on demand with cheap blasting ammo and/or nonmagnifying red dot sights.

Otherwise fit/finish also differs, but in my limited experience I haven’t seen that that makes any practical difference in performance. If the gun works, it works—at least for a while, but I’m not sure that longevity will be any different.

It will be interesting to see what others say.

It will be used as a range gun.
Also for shooting wood chunks around the house.

Even “range gun” is a very broad category. Some of my range time is devoted to high speed engagements of IDPA-sized targets at no more than 25 yards, and some is hitting small steel plates to 600 yards. Although I could use the same guns for both types of activities, I don’t because no setup would be ideal for both.

And what distance(s) would you anticipate shooting at woodchucks?

Some are worth the extra depending upon what you are doing.
In all honesty I think FN is putting out the best rifles especially considering their price points right now.
They are what Colt used to be and needs to strive to be again.

If I were to have to buy a factory built AR right now it would certainly be an FN.

LaRue.

Next question?

quote:

Originally posted by jsjac:
I think that I need a new AR.
Is there a big difference between a $800 and a $2500 gun. Looked at a Geissele rifle .
Looks nice but not sure what you get for $1700 more over the $800 gun?

What does the AR brain trust say?

Thank you in advance.

Jeff

In general, yes there is going to be a difference between rifles with vastly different price points. There is, however, going to be diminishing returns after a point. I have real trouble trusting Geissele to put the value that they claim into their products with some of the shit they've pulled in recent years. The "G mag" thing really soured me to them

If you're looking for high price to value ratio, I think something like Bravo Company, Sons of Liberty, Sionics, and FN are great value propositions relative to what they get for their rifles. I used to lump Daniel Defense into that group, but I've watched their prices climb and some questionable things start appearing (like plastic safety levers). Still good guns, just not convinced they cover the premium they charge

For what you are planning to use it for, I would think a basic FN (M16A4), BCM, POF etc.. would be fine.

I would use the extra money for ammo, a nice optic, slings, rails, etc..

Now if you were competing, or carrying the rifle every day for work, sure I could see spending that money.

I know guys who used RRA, and Smith and Wesson for their patrol rifles and were 100% satisfied.

I know the BIA carries RRA and the agency I worked at before relocating traded in there Sig 550's for the RRA version of the Colt M4.
(I know this because I created the Patrol Rifle program and bought the rifles).


When I get a job and get re-established I would like to get the FN M16A4 and a

Stag 15 M4 16" Rifle with Chrome Phosphate Barrel in 5.56MM for something different.

quote:

Originally posted by old rugged cross:
LaRue.

Next question?

No doubt they make an absolutely outstanding rifle!
But one needs to build the lower themself since you can buy a built upper and all their lower parts and that will run you $1300.
Buying the similar rifle is up to $2200.

I got my LaRue when they were doing their builder kit specials and assembling uppers for free and it cost $1100.
Hands down the best AR deal likely ever.

The fit and finish on that rifle is impeccable and it outshoots me by a long shot!

quote:

Originally posted by mrapteam666:


I know guys who used RRA, and Smith and Wesson for their patrol rifles and were 100% satisfied.

I know the BIA carries RRA and the agency I worked at before relocating traded in there Sig 550's for the RRA version of the Colt M4.
(I know this because I created the Patrol Rifle program and bought the rifles).

I have carried a Rock River for 16 years now and it has never let me down. That was my first AR and will always be a special one. While they are good rifles their fit and finish aren’t near as good as a lot of other companies.
I am in process of building it’s replacement which is mostly Wilson Combat stuff. I like building rifles as I can put it together exactly how I want it.
It is at the gunsmith now getting pinned and welded. I haven’t done my final tally of cost yet but I may look at it and kick myself for not just buying an FN.

you can get a complete colt 6920 for 1k and a complete 6920 upper for $600. If you want to mix and match, get a BCM lower. Then maybe upgrade trigger.

FN is a good rifle as week from a few hundred now. But once cry once. But 2k for a Daniel seems excessive for a range toy.

quote:

Originally posted by ElToro:
you can get a complete colt 6920 for 1k and a complete 6920 upper for $600. If you want to mix and match, get a BCM lower. Then maybe upgrade trigger.

FN is a good rifle as week from a few hundred now. But once cry once. But 2k for a Daniel seems excessive for a range toy.

Colts aren’t worth the money anymore. The FN is a much better rifle at the same price point.

Daniel Defense makes a great barrel but that is about the only part that is worth the upcharge. But they sell and have quite the following.

Dang my writing sucked. I would also suggest the colt name will hold value especially to somebody not hard core into the AR scene. Agree on FN.

Is there a difference?

Yes- about the same as a Chase and a Corvette. Both Chevy, both will get you somewhere, but one is just a little better.

FN, old Colts, old Bushmasters, Bravo Company, LaRue, Geissele, LMT, H&K, LWRC, old Noveskis, Daniel Defense... All great weapons, but a price difference from $800/900 to $2600.

Triggers are a big upgrade on some of the more $$ AR's, quality of barrels and the bolt & BCG is another upgrade.

Last week I was banging away with a Franken-AR, that a friend built for me for about $900. Worked just fine all day in the rain, mud, grass... At 100-150 yds, it's almost just as accurate as my LMT Defender.

I'll second DabigBR. There's a jump in quality between certain price tiers, but once you're in a certain price point, it's diminishing returns until you make another big jump.

Between $800 and say $1300ish, yes, there's a jump.

The guns in the $1600-1800 class are a bit more feature packed than the quality $1300ish tier (e.g. BCM) in that they might have ambi controls, maybe more QD points built into the gun, etc.

After that point, though, I don't think you're getting a lot. You'd have to make a much higher jump in price until you get into the "more accurate" territory, and by that point, you're probably picking nits.

Top tier competition rifles might justify the top tier price, but I don't know what you really get if you buy like a 10.5" gun that's over $2000ish dollars that you don't get from one that's $1600.

quote:

Originally posted by Black92LX:


Colts aren’t worth the money anymore.

Why not? And when did they stop being worth the money? It seems like just a couple years ago people were clamoring over them then all the sudden they became trash, but I’ve never seen a detailed explanation of what changed and when.

I’m really fortunate. I get a lot of exposure to various manufacturers products. And I get to see them used hard. While Tiers exist, some are worth it, some are not. Geissele is one that I’d say that it doesn’t. DD quality is starting to slip some and a lot of the parts (gas block, barrel, etc) on the Geissele is made by Daniel. They are over gassed as fuck. I had a Hard Duty rifle in OD and got rid of it because it was over gassed. My last DD V7 went back to the factory twice for being over gassed. It blew gas back in your face so bad that it was worse than any short suppressed gun with a standard charging handle. First time they said it was an out of spec gas key, second time they blamed it on a defective charging handle. Third time I just got a refund.

BCM, PWS, KAC, are all hard to beat.

quote:

Originally posted by Pale Horse:

quote:

Originally posted by Black92LX:


Colts aren’t worth the money anymore.

Why not? And when did they stop being worth the money? It seems like just a couple years ago people were clamoring over them then all the sudden they became trash, but I’ve never seen a detailed explanation of what changed and when.

Lack of innovation and Poor Customer service would be 2 good reasons. And that they can't stop from going bankrupt. Much better options out there. But its largely subjective

Colt is NOT what it used to be...



This video was posted by Para in this thread --> https://sigforum.com/eve/forum...0601935/m/4970012284
I does a VERY good job of identifying the difference between what Colt AR's used to be, and what they have become...

quote:

Originally posted by parabellum:
If you find someone other than Chris Bartocci on youtube who knows more about AR-15 production by Colt, you let us know.

In the video I posted, Bartocci methodically goes through the rifle and details the changes Colt has made. If you have a problem with his deivery, turn off the sound and turn on closed captioning. Either way, you're not going to find more detailed information on the subject at hand.

quote:

Originally posted by nhracecraft:
Colt is NOT what it used to be...

Thanks for the video. To be clear I’m not arguing, only asking.