I’ve got a few AR’s bought fully assembled or as complete uppers/lowers and put together.

25years ago or so I did put a parts kit into a lower with basic tools and didn’t mess it up.

Have never done barrel into upper or more “involved” complete assembly but am interested in learning the skills to do so. Prices coming back down, parts becoming more avail and having time to devote, if nothing else. So thought maybe it would be good for maint. of what I already have as well as for the future.

Joe Bob Outfitters has the below “armorer’s kit” on sale for $85. I am thinking of getting one but would like some input first. Decent quality/value? Anything else needed, a better kit somewhere?

TIA for input!



https://www.joeboboutfitters.c...s-Es-p/we-156111.htm

The Wheeler Delta Series AR Armorer’s Essentials Kit contains all of the essential tools a gunsmith or armorer needs to complete a full rifle build, make repairs or perform normal maintenance on AR-15/M16 platform rifles. Each of these Delta Series tools is designed with application specific features to perform specific functions with precision and ease. Each tool is constructed of the highest quality materials to deliver the best performance at a great value. All of the tools fit inside the durable carry case for convenient storage and transport. This 7-piece Armorer’s Kit contains the best tools available and will enhance any user’s ability to work on any AR.

Includes:
AR15 Combo Tool Torque Wrench
Upper Vise Block Clamp w/ Gas Tube Alignment Tool
Pivot Pin and Roll Pin Installation Tool
Mag Well Vise Block
AR -15 Adjustable Receiver Link
Custom Fitted Carrying Case

The Wheeler upper vice is OK for barrel work. I use it and have never damaged an upper, but I accidentally bent the end of gas tube clearance check rod in the insert the other day with a GI barrel nut. Did't pull it back out enough from the nut/spring/delta ring. That was dumb. Manage to bend it sorta back and get it out of the upper but I need a new one now.

The rest of it not so much.

Get the Magpul Bev Block for both fixturing a lower for buffer tube castle nut torque, and fixturing the barrel extension in an upper for muzzle device work (can do barrel work too). I don't use the Bev Block for barrel work since 80 ft-lbs is the max spec and I always seem to hit it when timing GI barrel nuts.

Also, get the Magpul armorers wrench, it's way better than the Wheeler and does just about anything you need.

You need a quality adjustable click torque wrench, not a beam wrench. I have three Craftsman clickers - Big 1/2", Medium 3/8", and Small 3/8". Yeah, Craftsman, I know, but they don't get a ton of use and they were a good deal on sale. My torque screwdriver is a Proto Professional and goes up to 36 in-lbs for scope work, 1913 rail stuff, gas block set screws, and other lower torque applications.

Then you need Aeroshell grease for the barrel nut and receiver threads, and Loctite 609 for bedding barrels into the upper. Criterion recommends 609 and it's good. Fills the gaps and eliminates any play, withstands the applicable temperatures, but you can still tap the barrel out of the upper with a wood dowel from the back. Ideally the barrel to upper fit should be tight enough you have to tap the barrel in with a rubber mallet, or heat the upper, cool the barrel, but it varies by brand of upper and barrel. The 609 is sort of the equivalent of blue threadlocker for slip and press fits. 620 is like red theadlocker, and there's another one that's like green threadlocker.

Oh, and probably some Rocksett for gas block set screws and suppressor mounts.

That looks like a decent kit to get you going.

The Wheeler tools that I have have been good to go.

I've assembled two with no special "armorer's tools." The multifit wrench is a nice to have as it fits other things.

Installing a barrel is a matter of inserting it into the upper using some kind of corrosion resistant grease. Some will categorically state it has to be a certain kind, that is the military application and it's for weapons which got dragged thru the Mekong Delta for months, cleaned in a half cut barrel of solvent, etc. The worry is the steel barrel extension and aluminum upper might corrode. Take a long look at the rotor/rims where they mount at the lugs next time - that's aluminum and steel, too, yet even after a winter of salted roads I never see missing wheels or sold any rotors that were falling off from it. The lugs were the more abused parts right after the steel backing pads ruining them. The corrosion story is a big much to say "this is the only grease you can properly use!" I just use copper antiseize, and when I go back to removing a barrel it's no big deal.

Torquing the nut isn't hard - tighten three times to 30 foot pounds, then tighten again far enough to get the gas tube past the tooth into the upper. Don't exceed 85 foot pounds, which is indicated, not an actual value. Attached to the nut wrench it's not the same length and the exact reading anymore. Exceeding 85 is dangerous as you could strip the aluminum threads on the nose.

I did it with a large pair of crescent pliers. What came along with that was a few years of tightening lug nuts to 85-100 foot pounds changing tires working a AAA wrecker truck. Since the spec is 30-85 foot pounds, it's not rocket science or even a conventional "torque to" number - again, it's a "Don't Exceed" number. Mechanic who work on vehicles get the feel and buying a special torque wrench isn't needed - it's just a preventative exercise to stop a healthy twentysomething from ruining .Gov property. You do not torque TO 85, you torque to 30 and then don't EXCEED 85.

Roll pins are a pain and the best tool I've found are adjustable Vicegrips with taped jaws. Try to get the spiral wound pins, not the rolled half pins, as they collapse with spring action more easily and grip just as well. Beating a roll pin into a lug is a recipe for disaster, especially near the grip. Adjust pliers, grip, adjust again, and the pin slides in with no marking the receiver (taped jaws). There are plenty of folks who will say "oh thats wrong" but they aren't going to buy you a new lower, or that ugly cover up grip to hide the damage. They won't even mail a sharpy, just laugh that you scratched it up and then brag how they never have that problem. I've found roll pin punches aren't cheap or needed.

The takedown pin in front is a challenge unless you do the following - rotate it with the groove to the front, use the pin to depress the detent, slide it in and rotate, done. Why some think you need a special helper pin I don't know. And all these tips? Came from the big AR forum build it yourself from the days pre 2010 and earlier when nobody had "armorer's tools" for sale at all. Neither does Colt - there was a pictorial online of their assembly benches and for the most part it was skill, not fancy tools. Stoner designed it that way, to put parts together in the simplest way possible with as few tiny screws, NO THREAD LOCKER, stake the ones that don't need to move, and done.

The castle nut getting tightened is where the fancy wrench can help, and considering that once it's done it sits in the box doing nothing after that, well, not so much. I used it once five years ago and there is it, waiting. That's why I don't recommend special tools, use the ones you have or that will get used every weekend.

I had the 18" pliers and vice grips, when I needed to finesse a pin a little deeper, I used worn out drill bits, put the pointy end toward the hollow pin and tap with a small hammer. And then the other side when I went too far.

To hold the upper, I used vice blocks, some pin the recievers together and had a properly sized wood boock in the mag well to hold them.

It's not difficult nor is it necessary to use special tools, and many don't.

Built my first upper recently and I think the only tools I bought other than headspace gauges in the caliber I needed were this: https://littlecreektrading.com...-upper-receiver-rod/

And this: https://littlecreektrading.com...e-barrel-nut-wrench/

Already had a torque wrench and various punches and whatnot.

I have seen several people that like the Real Avid tool kits as well, but they also seem to be from China like the Wheeler kit which I do not care to buy.

The Geissele reaction rod is the right tool for the job when applying +75ft lbs. of torque.
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1007066047

Reaction rods work great for muzzle devices and such.

For barrel nuts it's better to secure the upper with a clam shell or some other to keep from damaging the pin or slot in the receiver.
If the barrel is secure and you tighten the nut the receiver can rotate against the pin.

I've only build two uppers with GI barrel nuts and my luck is always that the minimum 30 ft-lbs goes just past time and I have to keep going almost a full notch. The torque gets to 80 and I'm not quite in time. I just loosen and retighten into it's worked in enough to stay under the max. In this situation a proper torque wrench isn't essential. But on the barrel I just installed the other day, I might not have realized the nut was under spec when approaching timed at the low end. I don't like facing off the receiver (don't get me started about this "squaring" obsession I am seeing among people that don't understand cylindrical tolerances and the relationship of bore, thread, and face), and it's a PITA to put a .001" shim on a barrel with a GI nut and a fixed front sight base.

Everything else has been with a barrel nut for a handrail and they vary. I like rails where the barrel nut needs a specific torque - 50 ft-lbs for Geissele, 40 ft-lbs for Midwest Industries - and doesn't need to be timed. In this case a proper torque wrench IS needed, especially with aluminum barrel nuts (Geissele and some others).

Powermad fixes diesels that come apart in operation. I've been around when this happens in an engine test cell, or the dyno driveline breaks loose and beats the inside of the test cell to hell. Trashed engines and a million dollars of test cell out of commission for a while. EVERY SINGLE TIME it is because someone did not properly torque something - main bearing caps, conrod caps, spline adapter on the flywheel, driveshaft to dyno bolts, you name it. Improper torque and a shitload of red locktite doesn't work either. I've seen that done too.

And I agree with him about not using reaction rods for tightening barrel nuts.

Headspace gauges are important too. I have Forster gauges to check bolts/barrls with. But I've actually never had a new bolt and barrel not check out OK on the gauges. But safety says you need to make absolutely sure.

quote:

Originally posted by powermad:
Reaction rods work great for muzzle devices and such.

For barrel nuts it's better to secure the upper with a clam shell or some other to keep from damaging the pin or slot in the receiver.
If the barrel is secure and you tighten the nut the receiver can rotate against the pin.

I understood that the rib on the top of the action rod was to prevent the upper from rotating vs. an upper receiver block that would fix the receiver but might allow the barrel to try and rotate when being torqued up?

ETA: the above in reference to the MI receiver rod I used, not the Geissele action rod without the rib on top.

quote:

Originally posted by stormwalker:
The Geissele reaction rod is the right tool for the job when applying +75ft lbs. of torque.
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1007066047

The issue is that there is no TM specification to torque the barrel nut TO a number. It's a cautionary method to keep from torquing it past the yield strength of the aluminum threads on the nose. The actual torque is 30 to 85 foot pounds. That is a 55 pound acceptable range, not a precise number.

In the day there were no shims, and the nose squarer was out on the market to fix that alledged issue. I have one, and the use of abrasive tends to ruin it while "fixing" uppers. One thing it will do, however, is remove slight amounts of length and if someone has an obstinate upper they can "true" it which will change how far the nut needs to be turned. Go very slowly or it's right back to worse or worser. My second build I did that and the nut came up a tad easier.

Yes, I am the hillbilly who advises 18" channellock pliers - I don't build bespoke level combat guns that sit in safes or display cases. The little nicks on the barrel nut from using pliers are just that - anyone who's dragged their M16 thru basic understands how much abuse it can withstand and when looking theirs over years later can remember those "character marks" and the stories behind them.

Marine TM for the M16's: https://www.m-16parts.com/USMC...aintenanceManual.pdf

A copy of the TM and reading thru it reveals a lot of interesting facts not often understood well. One is that a lot of repairs are not conducted at unit level - ever. The weapon is transferred to a brigade level shop for those repairs, and worse case is that another is assigned to replace it from the pool kept to have serviceable weapons in units. Most of what we do assembling an AR is not conducted at unit level - the company armorer doesn't replace gas tubes or attach barrels. And the user certainly is not allowed to disassemble the trigger assembly to clean it. "No user serviceable parts" fits what should be engraved on the lower. One of the more common mistakes is to put the springs in wrong and not into the slots on the pins to capture them. The next thing that happens is a long string of fire - another mistake too many make - and the pins walk out of the lower. Stoner designed it so that cant happen, if it does, it was assembled wrong. The use of anti rotation pins was originally intended to prevent damage to those few full auto M16's being demostrated at gun fairs or ranges, as the lower is high value and difficult to replace now. Full auto M16 have gone past $25,000 last I checked.

https://www.rockislandauction....ully-automatic-rifle

A $130 lower with someone's roll mark is cheap in comparison, and the average owner will never fire enough ammo thru it to wear out the pin holes. There are at this writing lowers for sale for $39.99. The last one I purchased - 6 months ago - was $75 plus tax over the counter at a gun shop, about the going rate then and I saved the FFL fees and shipping.

Why do we get into building an AR? It's not cheaper. We buy all the parts at retail with few discounts as we aren't purchasing 1,000 piece lots, which is how the "manufacturers" make profit. We build them because we are putting together something that may not be available - either bleeding edge configurations, or so arcane nobody wants to be stuck with that dog in their inventory. Brutal? or Honest - I'm building a .375 SOCOM flat top, A1 stock, A2 handguard no free float - a deer rifle. Who does that? Ive got the parts left over from a previous build - evidence to the rumor they breed in the dark and out pops another AR15, a symptom of Black Rifle Disease. I've read where one left over part can grow into a complete gun without the owner even realizing it until he looks in his collection of parts and sees he owns another one, it just needs assembly. And yeah, metal trapdoor buttplate. Ouch.

Be A Man Among Men runs thru my mind the first range trip. (If you get that, yer OLD. Embrace it.)

Anyway, don't let the internet promote misinformation how easy it really is to assemble an AR15. it's not rocket surgery and we can use normal tools to do it. But that one fitzall wrench is handy. The rest? Somebody is trying to sell you something.

I’ve been buying up some tools recently as I come across them in stock. Last week I picked up a “combo tool” wrench made by Real Avid. It was either going to that one or the Magpul, I think they’re both excellent. That’s a good price for the Wheeler kit although my experience has been that ready made kits usually have some inferior tools in them. That may OR may not be the case with this one. Below is a link to the one I bought. Most of Real Avid’s stuff is quality, some has been subpar but as a whole I’m impressed.


https://www.realavid.com/produ...orers-master-wrench/

quote:

Originally posted by powermad:
Reaction rods work great for muzzle devices and such.

For barrel nuts it's better to secure the upper with a clam shell or some other to keep from damaging the pin or slot in the receiver.
If the barrel is secure and you tighten the nut the receiver can rotate against the pin.

You are absolutely right, I stand corrected. I am thankful my last barrel installation did not go awry! In this video, the review shows an example of what happens when the receiver turns into the pin.

quote:

Originally posted by Tirod:

quote:

Originally posted by stormwalker:
The Geissele reaction rod is the right tool for the job when applying +75ft lbs. of torque.
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1007066047

The issue is that there is no TM specification to torque the barrel nut TO a number. It's a cautionary method to keep from torquing it past the yield strength of the aluminum threads on the nose. The actual torque is 30 to 85 foot pounds. That is a 55 pound acceptable range, not a precise number.

In the day there were no shims, and the nose squarer was out on the market to fix that alledged issue. I have one, and the use of abrasive tends to ruin it while "fixing" uppers. One thing it will do, however, is remove slight amounts of length and if someone has an obstinate upper they can "true" it which will change how far the nut needs to be turned. Go very slowly or it's right back to worse or worser. My second build I did that and the nut came up a tad easier.

Yes, I am the hillbilly who advises 18" channellock pliers - I don't build bespoke level combat guns that sit in safes or display cases. The little nicks on the barrel nut from using pliers are just that - anyone who's dragged their M16 thru basic understands how much abuse it can withstand and when looking theirs over years later can remember those "character marks" and the stories behind them.

Marine TM for the M16's: https://www.m-16parts.com/USMC...aintenanceManual.pdf

A copy of the TM and reading thru it reveals a lot of interesting facts not often understood well. One is that a lot of repairs are not conducted at unit level - ever. The weapon is transferred to a brigade level shop for those repairs, and worse case is that another is assigned to replace it from the pool kept to have serviceable weapons in units. Most of what we do assembling an AR is not conducted at unit level - the company armorer doesn't replace gas tubes or attach barrels. And the user certainly is not allowed to disassemble the trigger assembly to clean it. "No user serviceable parts" fits what should be engraved on the lower. One of the more common mistakes is to put the springs in wrong and not into the slots on the pins to capture them. The next thing that happens is a long string of fire - another mistake too many make - and the pins walk out of the lower. Stoner designed it so that cant happen, if it does, it was assembled wrong. The use of anti rotation pins was originally intended to prevent damage to those few full auto M16's being demostrated at gun fairs or ranges, as the lower is high value and difficult to replace now. Full auto M16 have gone past $25,000 last I checked.

https://www.rockislandauction....ully-automatic-rifle

A $130 lower with someone's roll mark is cheap in comparison, and the average owner will never fire enough ammo thru it to wear out the pin holes. There are at this writing lowers for sale for $39.99. The last one I purchased - 6 months ago - was $75 plus tax over the counter at a gun shop, about the going rate then and I saved the FFL fees and shipping.

Why do we get into building an AR? It's not cheaper. We buy all the parts at retail with few discounts as we aren't purchasing 1,000 piece lots, which is how the "manufacturers" make profit. We build them because we are putting together something that may not be available - either bleeding edge configurations, or so arcane nobody wants to be stuck with that dog in their inventory. Brutal? or Honest - I'm building a .375 SOCOM flat top, A1 stock, A2 handguard no free float - a deer rifle. Who does that? Ive got the parts left over from a previous build - evidence to the rumor they breed in the dark and out pops another AR15, a symptom of Black Rifle Disease. I've read where one left over part can grow into a complete gun without the owner even realizing it until he looks in his collection of parts and sees he owns another one, it just needs assembly. And yeah, metal trapdoor buttplate. Ouch.

Be A Man Among Men runs thru my mind the first range trip. (If you get that, yer OLD. Embrace it.)

Anyway, don't let the internet promote misinformation how easy it really is to assemble an AR15. it's not rocket surgery and we can use normal tools to do it. But that one fitzall wrench is handy. The rest? Somebody is trying to sell you something.

75 lbs??


jeez,


I learned from a USAR Small Arms tech,
30-35lbs for the barrel nut, make sure it lines up, if not pull and try again,

in fact it was a good idea to tighten, then loosen, then do it again, and check alignment,



barreled literally hundreds of uppers with a simple barrel jaws in a vice, with the GI wrench on a torque wrench, then later dropped the wrench for a breaker bar, (you get a feel for it)


if you are using 75lbs on an upper, you really need to take a look at what you are doing

quote:

Originally posted by lyman:

if you are using 75lbs on an upper, you really need to take a look at what you are doing

I followed the instructions from the upper manufacturer, Mega Arms:

Step 5

Using a ½ “torque wrench, tighten to 65
foot pounds. Loosen and re-torque (Note:
Because the square for the torque wrench
is offset from the center of the wrench, 65
ft.-lbs. on the wrench translates to 75 foot
pounds on the nut. Do not try to
compensate for the offset. This has
already been calculated.)

I've had decent luck with Wheeler tools for what they are, but half of that kit is in the categories of "don't need" or "good way to get yourself in trouble.

If I needed to make an armorer/build kit tomorrow, here's what would go in it:

Armorer's Wrench: Probably Magpul's offering. Whatever you get, you want it to do GI barrel nuts, castle nuts, and muzzle devices. I've been most happy with the Tapco one, surprisingly, but they don't exist anymore to my knowledge.

Reaction Rod: The original Geiessle one is good. The Midwest Industries one looks good. This is an appropriate tool for torquing a barrel nut (30-40 pounds is appropriate). An upper receiver block, as included in the Wheeler kit, is not. If you apply too much torque, you can destroy the upper receiver by turning the barrel indexing pin within it's slot. This isn't a concern when you are building a new gun (hopefully), but when you start taking existing ones apart, you find some weird stuff. There is always some risk of breaking the barrel extension loose from the barrel, but those are going to take over 100 ft-lbs. A barrel clamp would totally obviate that issue, but you'll find them a little limited for some other tasks on the upper.

Torque Wrench: Just buy a Harbor Freight, Ridgid, or other lower price brand wrench of your choice. Most torque specs on these guns are a pretty broad range and every accuracy test I've seen done with one of these cheaper wrenches has been "good enough.*

Lower Receiver Block: A magwell block is probably adequate. I like the magwell blocks because they don't get in the way and can be clamped in the vise different ways to get to various parts. I have a Geissele Reaction Block, too, and it is useful.

Punches: You really only need two pin punches: a 1/16" and a 3/32". I like Starrett brand for this. They are very high quality and most importantly, in spec. You'll pay about $8 per punch but I've found that these last and are well made. I also suggest a 1/16" roll pin starter and if you're spending a little money, a set of flat-sided punches for the bolt catch pin. This will save you from damaging a receiver sometime.

Hammer: My Shooboy (bought here) is my favorite gunsmith hammer but any multi-tip gunsmith hammer or even a very small balpine will do. Nothing on these guns needs to be pounded on (except for factory FSB taper pins, which will likely require different punches, an appropriate block, a big hammer, and some heat).

Punch Block: There are some AR-specific ones designed to stabilize the lower receiver ears while installing a trigger guard and the bolt while driving the ejector pin. You don't "need" anything special here, but may find it saves time.

Breaker Bar: For use in conjunction with your armorer's wrench and barrel nut wrenches that come with aftermarket handguards. Torque wrenches shouldn't be used to loosen and sometimes you're going to need more power than you get out of an armorer wrench alone. Also, most aftermarket barrel nut wrenches are crow's foot style so you'll need a handle to turn them.

Beyond those things, there are a myriad of odds and ends that you will accumulate if you get into it at all.

I like a center punch and nail to stake buffer tubes.

If you are installing low-profile gas blocks, you should get SLR Rifleworks' Barrel Dimpling Jigs. I have one in each size offered (they are sized on barrel profile). These jigs will ensure that your gas block is on straight, won't back out, and is appropriately indexed. I use Rocksett on gas block set screws.

There are several specialty tools and gauges like Headspace Gauges (5.56 and .223 are not the same and you should know what you need and buy the right thing), Firing Pin Protrusion Gauge, and Chamber Mirror, just to name a few. A Bolt Disassembly Tool will save some aggravation. A Carrier Key Staker (MOACKS is a great one) is a good addition. The list goes on.

I'm sure I'm missing some obvious things that aren't coming to mind. One advantage to piecing it together versus buying a kit is that it seems easier to add stuff on and not feel like it has to match or because it doesn't fit it the bag it's inconvenient. You'll spend more building it, but you'll have better tools, a more complete kit, and nothing you won't actually use.

+1 on the reaction rod. Game changer. Another tool I use is an ACOG TA51 mount to align the upper receiver pic rail with the forearm rail while things get tightened. I bridge the two with the mount and tighten it. Then I torque the foregrip/pic rail thingy. Works great.

The most difficult part of assembling one is the front pivot pin….that’s the part that causes the most swearing as the detention and spring launch into the atmosphere. I recommend doing that part inside a gallon ziplock….or in a room with white floors so you can find the detent after it takes a fly.

Otherwise you can cobble one together with just the clamshell vise holding tool and some tape on visegrips for 5e roll pins and a small amount of masking tape to put on the receiver before driving pins. Also a small chunk of scrap wood to place under the trigger guard rollpin holes for support while driving the roll pin…don’t break those.

Light taps with a smallish ball peen hammer(3-5oz) will get it done.

We never used a torque wrench when assembling m16s and just followed the TM…put on the barrel three times to get the threads ready and then torqu it to the first hole that lines up for the gas tube.

Read thru or watch an assembly video a few ti es before doing it and it’s easy peasy

pro tip

when working on the lower, just clamp the flats where the grip goes on in a vice, (brass jaws or protectors in place)
you can do it all except mount the grip ,


I've always used the traditional barrel blocks to mount the barrel,

never torqued over 35 or so, never needed to

was taught to do them in the same manner MikeinNC mentioned,

I do know some of the match guys hand tighten the flash hiders, and locktite them in place instead of using a torque wrench (I think spec is 15 lbs or less)
supposedly helps in accuracy

quote:

Originally posted by MikeinNC:
The most difficult part of assembling one is the front pivot pin….that’s the part that causes the most swearing as the detention and spring launch into the atmosphere. I recommend doing that part inside a gallon ziplock….or in a room with white floors so you can find the detent after it takes a fly.

Otherwise you can cobble one together with just the clamshell vise holding tool and some tape on visegrips for 5e roll pins and a small amount of masking tape to put on the receiver before driving pins. Also a small chunk of scrap wood to place under the trigger guard rollpin holes for support while driving the roll pin…don’t break those.

Light taps with a smallish ball peen hammer(3-5oz) will get it done.

We never used a torque wrench when assembling m16s and just followed the TM…put on the barrel three times to get the threads ready and then torqu it to the first hole that lines up for the gas tube.

Read thru or watch an assembly video a few ti es before doing it and it’s easy peasy

You can do the pivot detent with a clevis pin. Watch it done on YouTube. Once I learned that method, it was easy.

quote:

You can do the pivot detent with a clevis pin. Watch it done on YouTube. Once I learned that method, it was easy.

Looks like the Wheeler kit has that tool.
I have clevis pins, so that's what I use.

Some stuff that you hoard does come in handy.