whats that like ?
or do automatics just answer all the questions re: hitting the target enough times?


I used to use up about 150-200 rounds with a semi-auto .

there was slow fire, faster slow fire and faster yet slow fire. most of the time at 35-60 feet.

I never graduated to rapid fire /multiple targets or moving and firing.

even with a three shot burst option, on an automatic
whats a good target look like?

what does an ok target look like?

We don’t have three round burst but I have pretty much practiced enough to simulate 3/4 round burst. It rises a little so I usually start with the pelvic area and ride my bursts up the target. I recently did a 20 round mag dump with my 300blk and subsonic ammo to test my new Sandman-K and I embarrassingly admit that it got away from me.

I’m back to practicing bursts.

I've shot enough to be fairly proficient,
I think,

3 rnd burst, or just trigger control, I have both,

learned the proper lean and sling for the stuff I have shot (from Mac 11's to BAR's) from the shoulder and hip,

I practice a few times a year when I can,

usually with just the M16

This, while the highest order of rapid fire, is one way americans with automatics find a way to blow ammo. First weekend of October and April yearly.

Knob Creek Machine Gun Shoot

https://www.youtube.com/watch?...TaE&feature=youtu.be

Four belts of 250 rounds each is the minimum needed per 'practice' session. Plus, you never get off your ass. It always puts a smile on the shooter's face. I guarantee you that anything within 2400 yards will be turned into mince meat.

I use to shoot 8 25 round mags ever Thursday night with my Uzi on the 25 yard range and once a month at the 100 yard range. I did that for about 8 years.
Now it’s once a month at the 25 yard range.

While in the ARMY (M1 Tanker, left as an E5 Tank Commander with just under 4yrs) I had trigger time on .50cal autos, 7.62 autos, and M16s/M4s, all of which was leading up to, during, and immediately following Desert Storm. Full Auto practice was the rarest of all trigger time, to be sure, by a wide margin. And when we did, we mostly fired the 7.62s...

As a civilian in the years since I've fired many times more rounds downrange from full autos than I ever did in the ARMY, and I don't even own any full auto guns of my own. But I have collector friends and some in the firearms industry, and in that capacity I've fired many thousands of rounds just having fun. I doubt most units have the budget for it.

So if a fella put 18) 12 inch balloons down range,
between 75 feet and 275 feet away from the shooter.

how many rounds would it take to pop all 18 balloons ?

from the video posted above , I get the feeling that some people with auto's just like to hear the noise and feel the recoil.

I could do it in two mags

quote:

Originally posted by bendable:
So if a fella put 18) 12 inch balloons down range,
between 75 feet and 275 feet away from the shooter.

I don't claim to be the best full auto shooter. I don't own one, but have shot a few M16/M4 versions in 5.56. I find 3 or 4 round bursts aren't that hard to do with a full-auto trigger, with a little practice. I can control 3 or 4 rounds relatively well, but after that my under-developed technique allows for the POI to climb up and right -- which is typical for a right-handed shooter.

IMO, from standing off-hand, a single 3 or 4 round burst should be adequate to hit all balloons out to 200 feet for most shooters. Better shooters should be able to do this all the way out to 275 feet. Which is only 92 yards. Honestly, a decent AR-15 marksman should be able to hit 12" rounds at 100 yards with a fairly high percentage, off hand with a semi-auto AR-15. So in theory, a single short burst should do the trick for any balloon within your stated distances.

quote:

Originally posted by bendable:
from the video posted above , I get the feeling that some people with auto's just like to hear the noise and feel the recoil.

I think that's quite true. The first time I shot a full auto was pretty cool -- I just let the rounds rip. I get it.

After awhile the concept of burning a bunch of ammo with limited precision no longer appealed to me. I want to hit what I aim at, and I tend to aim at relatively small targets.

Again, this comes from experience with M16/M4/AR15 platforms. I have no experience with larger bore full auto rifles.

quote:

Originally posted by KML:
I could do it in two mags

2) 50 rd mags ?
2) 100 round mags?

quote:

Originally posted by bendable:

quote:

Originally posted by KML:
I could do it in two mags

2) 50 rd mags ?
2) 100 round mags?

a couple of 20 rnd mags

When a friend of mine brings out his MP5, we sometimes play a game.

Silhouette target, usually some ‘bad guy’ silhouette. 7-10 yards. Mag dumps.

If you have a flyer outside the silhouette from your mag dump, you’re in for one box of ammo. When it was the .40 MP5, that got pricey, quick. But fun.

I could keep most of the mag on silhouette, with maybe one flyer.

quote:

Originally posted by bendable:

quote:

Originally posted by KML:
I could do it in two mags

2) 50 rd mags ?
2) 100 round mags?

Two 32 round mags,trying for 2 or 3 round burst

Keeping all rounds on a man sized silhouette at 100 yards isn’t all that hard with practice.

One thing for sure, shooting full auto results in 100% grins.

Really depends on the platform, and the range. My buddy has an MP5 that anyone within 25 yards would be shredded. I’d need to be a bit closer with my SWD M-11, but at respectable defensive range, bursts are easily within the silhouette. Full mag housings have some strays, but not many. Sadly, I don’t get the opportunity to shoot any other platforms.

Absolutely.

With subguns at 7-25 yds, my goal is all shots in the head and/or center mass. With UZI, MP5K-N, MP5-N, I can typically put everything into a 4-6” diameter, sometimes better.

Shooting at farther distances, 50, 100, 200, 300, 400 yds has been on steel (6-12” plates) and “Angry Ivan” poppers that are basically an IDPA type silhouette. I tend to focus on hits on target at distance vs group size when shooting FA at distance.

If you look at my linked video of me on my mp5, you can see 3 shots within 1-2 inches of one another on steel plates at roughly 25 yds.

Practicing one’s effectiveness with FA on target is very very fun.


https://youtu.be/-GKpTZwwkQ0

https://youtu.be/d5eI8TswUFg

This message has been edited. Last edited by: JoshNC,

Even back when we could still do it over here in Switzerland:

rarely. As said before: depends on the platform.

Fullauto MP5: sure, works, not even bad. But still nothing that can't be done with single fire only.

Everything else: no way.

Fired Glock18, Beretta 93R's, Ingram's and the like: they're all a waste of ammo. Put a smile on your face though.

Rifles: don't get me started, waste of ammo. Even if someone brings a FA rifle to the range, which rarely happened in the past, FA was never fired, except for some "fun time".

I don't even own FA's anymore, even though they're quite cheap over here in Switzerland. MP5 for less then 3'000, Uzi for around 2500.

But of course, shooting them has become a legal and administrative burden as well.

I run about 250-400 through my FNC each time I shoot. 10-15 mags worth. We don't do mag dumps but burst fire.

Learning to control automatic fire is essential for accuracy, muzzle climb, and the life of the barrel if not the action as well. Depending on what you're shooting.

While I don't own any autos I've had the luxury of plenty of time behind a variety. Proper machineguns, and subguns.

Burst fire from a happy switch is a convenience, and there are loads of firearms where you've got to learn how to "ride" it, only by putting rounds downrange and learning how the trigger responds, muzzle rise etc.

If you're trying to stay on target, sustained automatic fire from just about anything will turn "on target" into "pretty much on target, plus the surrounding area and climbing."