quote:

Originally posted by MikeGLI:
I agree theres a lot of value in the M&P or Rugers. I also would 2nd the midlength gas system.

In order of less money to more money, I'd look in this direction:
M&P
BCM
Geissle

I'd stick with an M-lock rail system and get a red dot.

So Geissle is the top of the tiers? Is LMT still well respected? I recall the chrome lined barrels and MPI inspected was a big deal years ago.

Seeing the copper tone of the coating, I'm wondering if this is a Geissle? I see one online that is the same coloration.

Yeah, that looks like a Super Duty.

quote:

Originally posted by r0gue:
Is LMT still well respected?

They went all in on their heavy monolithic receiver that takes proprietary barrels. Some people want that. For serious guns I place a high priority on ease of working on and stocking parts for them.

A 16" Geissele Super Duty is a good choice for a higher end production complete AR15, if you're wanting to buy in that ~$2000 price range.

Or the BCM Recce 16 is a great option at a slight step down in price, around $1600.


You can also buy a complete upper and a complete lower from your manufacturer of choice, and stick them together yourself by inserting 2 pins. That will often knock 10% or more off the cost of buying the complete rifle at once.

If I were in the market for a 16” carbine with a front sight post, I’d be looking at the SOLGW Patrol.

quote:

Originally posted by r0gue:
So Geissle is the top of the tiers? Is LMT still well respected? I recall the chrome lined barrels and MPI inspected was a big deal years ago.

I think that depends on how you frame the question. I was simply giving you 3 basic options at 3 different price points. I'm sure we can get in the weeds on it, but that's not really necessary. If you had a price point, that could help narrow things down. For your intended use, I'm not sure it matters much. I'm a BCM guy. I've owned SOLGW, which I think are great rifles. I own a KAC, a 6920, a franken gun or two, and several BCMs. I like BCM and that's what I shoot. I shoot 2-3 classes a year and shoot with a bunch of different dudes, I see a lot of Geissele stuff.

LMT makes good stuff, but Christ on a crutch, last LMT I picked up was quite heavy.

Also, Rogue is on point about the zero. I'm a tried and true 100yrd zero guy. All my LPVOs and red dots are a solid 100yd zero I would not suggest zeroing at something like 25yds.

Trijicon recommends a 100 yard zero for its LPVOs (their BDC is calibrated for this zero), so that's how mine are zeroed.

Iron sights- that's different. 50 yard zero for irons.

Look into the Siconics and Bravo Company rifles.... Sionics are making decent headway into the LE market and are proving to be exceptional rifles for the cost.

And I'm a Colt guy....

I legally gifted an AR a number of years ago. This was to be a budget level gift, nothing crazy. After all, even if someone gave me a 20 ga H&R ‘Topper’ single-shot, I’d appreciate it.

I watched & grabbed some sale at PSA, it was less than $600. I got the gun, disassembled, ensured clean & lightly lubed. With my testing, then the follow-on years it has been working fine.

Am I going to post it’s shooting 1/4” groups at ‘100 meters’, no. Many ARs live a life regulated to plinking at 25-100 yards.

As to reliability, if I shoot 500 rounds without any problems, it’s likely to work fine picking it up to check a noise out back.

None of this may apply to you, just general comments.

I own 3 of the 2012-2013 era LE6920s and they’re perfectly fine in my opinion. Not sure if I’d buy one in today’s market, but back then they were a really good choice with a traditional feature set. I think it really boils down to how much you want to spend. In my area I regularly see clean, used rifles in these brackets:

Ruger and S&W - $500
Colt and FN - $750
BCM - $1000
Daniel - $1500
LMT, Geissele, Noveske - $2000+

I would honestly set my top price and then decide what features I want (barrel length, carbine/mid, FSP/no sights, ambi/traditional, which rail system) and go that way.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: stormin,

quote:

Originally posted by inspcalahan:
Sionics are making decent headway into the LE market and are proving to be exceptional rifles for the cost.

I have a Sionics Patrol rifle and am extremely impressed by its level of quality per dollar. Their NP3-coated BCG is arguably the best in the industry.

Sionics is a sleeper, b/c they don't market, and they prioritize their LE sales over sales to the general public. If you order a firearm on their website, be prepared to wait. That's another reason why you don't here about them much, b/c their ARs aren't readily available.

Another sleeper is the Andro Corp ACI-15, which many AR enthusiasts believe is the best AR you can get for <$600. They're frequently available at or a little under $400.

It's a buyer's market currently for ARs, so as stormin posted, decide what you want, how much you want to spend (budget for accessories, upgrades, & ammo), and be patient. There are deals aplenty on new & lightly used.

For example, here's a 16" Daniel Defense DDM4V7 for $1299.99 that'd make a great all-around duty/battle rifle.

https://www.sportsmanfulfillme...-16-barrel-30-round/

For the money I think the Q Sugar Weasel 16" 5.56 is great option as well.

Ok, I'm making a decision to move things along. After a bit of study, I like the Geissele suggestion made early in the thread by Voshterkoff. Made in my home state, not overly "skulled-up", but still tactical-premium enough to make the gun nerd in me happy. As Voshterkoff said, "if I were to buy one", which is my intent. One and done, and I'm back in the .556 game.

Now for the sights. I own one of these: Discontinued: Trijicon MRO® 1x25 Red Dot Sight 2.0 MOA Adjustable Red Dot. I bought it for a 9mm carbine, and as it turned out, I never really used the thing. Still in the box. Are there any Trijicon/red-dot aficionados here that can help me understand the key elements of what my discontinued Trijicon has/lacks vs. the wide array of versions that they now offer? I'm assuming it's just normal product drift over time and that there's been no substantial advancements in the last five years to be chasing -- other than that it seems GREEN is the new RED!

The original MRO has some pretty bad parallax issues compared to other red dots. Can be as much as a few feet at a hundred yards if I remember right. The new version of it has supposedly fixed that, but it has some other issues the original didn’t have.

Video about the MRO issues:
https://youtu.be/4DmoHsQN9i4?si=wh976M97sjPUUB8f

Video talking about the new MRO models:
https://youtu.be/4DmoHsQN9i4?si=HdBoeRUUVrPafgmS

Oooofff! That's a bummer! I suppose the parallax is diminished at much closer distances.

My last full time agency had enough issues with the MROs that they purchased that they got rid of all of them and sprang for aimpoints, and that wasn’t a small expense. The parallax issues were severe and there were some other problems as well. I would not recommend an MRO based upon that experience.

Ok, great sounds like you need a new red dot! I'm gonna be that guy to throw Holosun in the mix. People shit all over them, which doesn't bother me, but Ive had good experience with their products. In fact, I switched from an RMRcc to a EPS carry and I think the EPS carry is a far superior optic...IN MY EXPERIENCE.

If you wanted to get squirrely and look for some red dots to replace the MRO, check out the Holosun AEMS.

quote:

Originally posted by Lt CHEG:
The parallax issues were severe and there were some other problems as well. I would not recommend an MRO based upon that experience.

I was gifted one and I agree. I can't believe Trijicon put out junk like this.

OP,
You can't go wrong with a BCM 16" mid-length.

quote:

Originally posted by P220 Smudge:
The original MRO has some pretty bad parallax issues compared to other red dots. Can be as much as a few feet at a hundred yards if I remember right. The new version of it has supposedly fixed that, but it has some other issues the original didn’t have.

Video about the MRO issues:
https://youtu.be/4DmoHsQN9i4?si=wh976M97sjPUUB8f

Video talking about the new MRO models:
https://youtu.be/4DmoHsQN9i4?si=HdBoeRUUVrPafgmS

I have the new and improved version and it's still junk.