quote:

I'm not sure a longer barrel would reduce the noise going on right in front of my nose by much.

Not in that case. This discussion has been focused on supersonic 5.56x45 rifles, where the bulk of the noise is at the muzzle. I am familiar with what you're referring to though, and that phenomenon definitely affects the way we consider silencers when "stealth" is a primary objective.

But this thread is about weighing the pros of short barrels against their performance cons at "extended" ranges, and we best not digress.

I've read of anecdotal reports that soldiers issued a 11.5" barreled weapon were able to hit the enemy out to 400m. That is considered a stopping shot - which is the goal. The enemy not returning fire is the objective, not what other results many think are required. Being DRT vs unable to return fire has virtually no tactical difference.

That is usually a hard concept to grasp in a lot of circles.

The ethical force required for game, tho, is a different matter. I've got a 10.5" and shooting typical game rounds I've estimated that 1000 pounds of force with typical hunting ammo will extend to 85 yards, which is about how far I can see in Ozark woodlands on average. So, it works. Shoting at a deer at 400m across a bean field, a 10.5" isn't the best choice. That might be a survival issue but not a fair chase practice during the season.

For the military, tho, one major factor is that the squad has other assets available, and their instructions in the ROE may require using them over their own organic firepower. They call for fire using armor, artillery, aircraft, even naval guns if within range. The Call For Fire is part and parcel of what ground forces exercise if the enemy is out of rifle range, and those soldiers and airmen are out in the sector, too, as support to the operation. It is the more important coordination a team or squad leader does before even leaving the wire - letting others know where they are oparting to reduce friendly fire and who might be at hand to assist. The daily call signs, frequencies, and how to interact with units gone astray are very much what must be covered.

There's a lot more to it than deciding to pull the trigger on "enemy in the open" when it could just be an exhausted team trying to get home after a long patrol. Which is the reason somebody has to carry a 6 or 8X set of field binoculars to identify, much the same we use a flashlight to see who's banging around the house at night. We don't shoot first and ask questions later, despite the Infantry motto.

Be like the MP's, ask questions first, then . . .

Big guns burn big C.O.A.L cartridges and it's all about the teamwork, not the single rifleman.

Laid down at 500m this morning. 11.5" Colt 933 with a Gemtech Titanium Trek, GI trigger, Elcan Specter, shooting 55gr M193, resting on nothing but the mag. 4/5 hits (1st round was a hit) on a torso-sized target. As previously discussed, performance out of this setup at 500m is certainly compromised, and I have been scheming a longer setup lately, as I consider adjusting my "happy medium". Ballistic performance aside though, it's damned confidence inspiring for the shooter and his weapon, to know that, if he can see it, and the wind isn't too wild, he can likely hit it very effectively.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: KSGM,