I am a youth adviser for 14 and 15 year old young men at Church and go camping with them often. I am always armed and ready with a shotgun when we go camping and we do all the appropriate bear precautions all the time, but I feel like I never have enough handgun with me when camping. Black bears and mountain lions are prevalent where we go.

So what does the collective say? My mind always takes me to a S&W 44 mag but is that really the best thing for the critters I am protection the boys from?

Thoughts on 10mm, 454 Casull, 41 mag, others I have not thought of?

Several recent threads on this topic. Your shotgun is a fine solution.
For me in cold / rainy / snowy weather: 4.5 inch Ruger stainless Super BlackHawk .44 Mag with Underwood ammo.
Warmer weather: Glock G20 10MM with Underwood.
Both guns usually carried in a Gunfighters Inc Kenai chest holster.

quote:

Originally posted by YooperSigs:
Several recent threads on this topic. Your shotgun is a fine solution.
For me in cold / rainy / snowy weather: 4.5 inch Ruger stainless Super BlackHawk .44 Mag with Underwood ammo.
Warmer weather: Glock G20 10MM with Underwood.
Both guns usually carried in a Gunfighters Inc Kenai chest holster.

Ya I will always have the shotgun up there, but it's not always practical to lug around while hiking and such so I am hoping to find a more appropriate handgun.

I did think about a 10mm, and I supposed that would do the trick too.

quote:

Originally posted by amhaynie:
Black bears and mountain lions are prevalent where we go.

So what does the collective say?

Carry a P320. When attacked by a bear, drop the 320.

The sky will fall and kill the bear.

In the meanwhile, rifled slugs and a 12 gauge are a good start, though inconvenient to conceal.

I hope GJM AK posts here because I believe he's been using an unmodified USPF with .45 Super loads because there aren't really any appropriate 10mm bullets for Alaskan bear. Seems like a very practical choice.

For black bears and cougars, I switched from a .44 mag revolver to a G20. I like the 16 rounds of Underwood.

I think a Ruger GP-100 with a 4" barrel would do the trick. You could load it with some 180gr Buffalo Bore bullets and be all set. If you're doing a lot of camping, get the stainless model - it will hold up better against the elements.


(not my picture)

The most powerful thing you can shoot well that isn't so big you that you'll actually keep it with you.

quote:

Originally posted by amhaynie:
Black bears and mountain lions are prevalent where we go.

I've done my fair share of climbing, hiking, and camping in the West -- including Arizona. Gone face to face with black bears twice. Never have been able to get close to big cats, even when I've seen & followed their tracks.

Animals, even big animals, don't like to be around humans. We scare the bejeezus out of them. Your mere presence and your voice will generally scare them away. The more people in a group, the more scared they are. Any gun, any caliber, will make so much noise that they will be in the next county before your spent brass is cold. You're not in griz country, where bear issues are different.

It's not the strong that survive, it's the ones that can adapt. There was a recent study of Grizzlies that learned that gunfire meant a dead elk. They would follow hunters (collar tracking used to show this) and wait for an elk to be shot. Others would go to the sound of gunfire.

More exposure to humans (that did not lead to lethal results for the animal) means less fear, and more risk to the humans.

I bought a used Glock 29 for hiking, powerful but bulky.

quote:

Originally posted by MagnumU:
There was a recent study of Grizzlies that learned that gunfire meant a dead elk.

I haven't seen that study. Can you provide the source?

But let's say we do have some grizzlies that are pretty darn adaptive to the sound of gun fire from elk hunters. The current southern boundary for griz is roughly southern Idaho or northern Wyoming. Grizzlies run really fast. The OP lives in Arizona. Boo-boo bear is going to have a long run getting to the sound of the shot. Well, assuming boo-boo's hearing is up to the task.

I am a sucker for a bear thread.

If you are concerned about black bears, as opposed to grizzly bears, that simplifies things, and I would just bring your regular pistol. Compared to a heavy caliber revolver, it will be lighter to carry, easier to shoot, and have more capacity. It will be acceptable if not optimized for bears, but be useful for a wide range of threats. For the shotgun, Brenneke Classic Magnum slugs, which is the historical load used by AK Wildlife Troopers.

If you are discussing grizzly bears, we can begin a ten page thread.

I have been in close proximity to black bears 8 times while hiking or on horseback. They didn't get bothered by human presence and continued to eat or wander along.

I always had bear spray and a 9mm pistol (usually either Glock 26 or Walther PPS with HST 147 gr +P) on hip holsters at all time while in black bear country. Weight is a consideration on these long hikes. When my daughter was along for the hike, she also had her own spray can (on hip holster).

When ran across others on the trails, no one I saw had any spray or firearm.

We saw this guy last week at Lake Tahoe. He wasn't frightened of our group of 45. He checked us out for a few minutes, then wandered over to some apartments and jumped on a car.

I'll second the G29 for "bears" but thats typically the larger brown variety. AZ black bears and lions are routinely dispatched with non magnum caliber guns. The shotgun would suffice. Id be more leary of the cats than the bears in AZ.

A 9X19 isn't going to concern, or hurt a bear. Not in any meaningful way during the time you have an encounter. You might piss it off a bit, but rest assured you'll be more impressed with the 9mm than the bear.

You're better off with bear spray than a 9mm.

Don't count on scaring off a cat. If you happen to be startling the cat and it doesn't want to be seen, it will move away. They've also been known to double back or reposition and wait or you. They're ambush predators, and they don't face off.

Bears may move, or they may not. They usually don't feel inclined. The notion that they don't like being around people is incorrect. Often people attract them, often it's the scent of food, and not necessarily you. They're an apex predator, though, and you're not intimidating to them.

The old joke is that hikers are warned to wear bells to make themselves heard, so the animals know you're coming. Look for signs of the animals, particularly the bear scat. You know it's bear scat because it smells like pepper spray and it's full of little bells.

Pepper spray, a full size, formulated spray, is effective, though it's not going to stop a charging bear.

10mm, for the most part, not particularly effective. .44 magnum, marginally so. Bigger is better, and a 12 gauge rifled slug is a start. A lever gun or larger game rifle, better, but you're still not likely to be effective or see a rapid stop if attacked. This is particularly the case with grizzlys.

In Arizona, black bear are what you may encounter, and there are cats which you'll be very lucky to see. Bear aren't common. Black bear aren't known to attack, generally, and cat attacks are rare. The question is whether you're carrying to make yourself feel better, or the animal feel worse, and if the choice is 9mm or something of that nature, you're only making yourself feel better if you're carrying it for bear protection. You'll feel worse if you need to use it because it won't help.

Even in the woods, especially in some parts of AZ, two legged threats are a far bigger concern than cats or bears. In those cases, your favorite service caliber and firearm is a better choice...but those threats you encounter, particularly in the southern forests, are likely to be better armed than you are, and far less concerned about who they hurt to protect their cargo.

http://www.shootingtimes.com/f...bigbore_091906A1.jpg

These were good for around bears but are out of production.