You know the story; I just turned 60, can't focus on front sight without reading glasses. I've been looking at reviews and thinking about a mini optic, but just got an email with an ad for a Viridian laser. Rail/trigger guard mount specific for the gun model. I realized I haven't seen much discussion of lasers in a while; don't know if I've missed it or what.

I've read a lot about training to pick up the red dot on the draw. It seems like this wouldn't be an issue if a laser is just putting a nice green dot on the target right where my irons line up. Also, if reliable, it seems that the laser would not have the cleaning issues or potential dirty glass, etc., that can be problematic with a red dot. Is the "chasing the dot" issue any different for laser dot vs optics dot? Seems both are subject to the same issue, but no experience here.

Anyone using a laser? Experience with laser and a red dot? Any pros and cons that I haven't mentioned?

quote:

Originally posted by honestlou:
I've read a lot about training to pick up the red dot on the draw. It seems like this wouldn't be an issue if a laser is just putting a nice green dot on the target right where my irons line up.

An optic cowitnessed with iron sights does the same. But with practice, an optic can be faster to pick up than aligning front/rear sights, so relying on using your sights to find the dot is counterproductive over the long run.

With either an optic or laser, if your grip, draw, and presentation are sloppy, you'll end up chasing the dot.

Lasers are only useable at short ranges, and in lower light. They're often not visible in bright light, or past ~10 yards. They can also be hard to pick up on patterned or textured backgrounds. There are reasons laser sights haven't really caught on, outside of very specific uses (like IR lasers used alongside night vision devices, which actually function quite differently than that type of visible laser).

Of the two options, the red dot optic is a better solution as an alternative to iron sights. Just understand that there's a learning curve, so you have to be willing to put in sufficient practice to master it (just like you did when learning to shoot handguns with iron sights).

There was recently a thread on this.

https://sigforum.com/eve/forum...601935/m/4080063284?

Here were my thoughts:

Issues with lasers:

Visibility: Red are not bright enough to see in most daylight outdoor conditions. Green can be distractingly bright in some lower light conditions.

Switchology: How is your laser switched? Is it attached to a light or standalone? If it is attached to the light, is it activated with the light or via some weird multi-press switch? If grip activated, do you have the discipline and consistency in your grip to activate it reliably? Under stress? In austere positions? A red dot is theoretically always on.

Zero/Consistency: Most lasers that I have seen have relatively crude adjustment screws. The visibility issues above can contribute to making them harder to zero. Many pistols use polymer rails and rails of questionable spec that may not return to zero if the device is removed and reinstalled. With adjustment screws that are often recessed and don't have "click" adjustments, how do you know they haven't moved?

Offset: Lasers that are combined with a light or otherwise attach to the rail have a built-in mechanical offset. So do red dots. And iron sights. But the offset with a laser is often greater. Moreso, at many distances, sights and lasers are mutually exclusive things... If you're on the sights, you can't see the laser.

Durability: More of a concern with guide rod lasers, but many laser devices simply are not very durable. Every Lasermax guide rod laser I've seen has failed at some point. Laser Grips have been a mixed bag because of the ribbon cables that attach everything.

Holster Compatibility: Does your holster accommodate the laser? Many do not.

All of that said, they're not without their place. There are reasons, however, that visible lasers on handguns do not see large military and law enforcement use. In LE the biggest place for them is with a ballistic shield. For a bad breath distance scenario, I question whether somebody is better off trying to find a laser dot that is projected onto the guy and might be blocked by the gun itself versus using the back of the slide or optic window as a large, gross sighting system.

Just some thoughts.

I bought a Streamlight TRL-8 with a green dot.
Waste of money for me as I tried it and never use it, should have just got a TRL7 instead.

A red dot was money well spent for me.
I only have one pistol with a RD but plan on getting another for my P226.

Turning 61 next month and know where you're coming from. I can still shoot without my reading glasses but not nearly as well or as quickly as with them. I've put optics on a few pistols and couldn't be more pleased with them. For aging, tired eyes I personally think they're great once you learn to use it and get your presentation down.

I have an LCP with a Viridian green laser that I should just remove the laser. I can put a new battery in it and a few weeks later the battery will be dead even though the laser's been turned off the entire time. It's an older one and takes a 1/3n battery, I don't know if it's a common thing or if I just wasn't lucky with it. I bought a TLR8 with a green dot for my bedside gun because green dots are still cool at my age but also should have saved the money and just bought a TLR7. I figured the laser on that one was one more redundancy added to the night sights and rmr.

Viridian products are known for their parasitic drain, unfortunately.

My one experience with With the laser Max was very very unsatisfactory the product and the customer service did not meet my expectation
On the other hand crimson trace laser grips are on many of my defensive of handguns I've used them for years I am totally satisfied with them and the one time I needed customer service because of my own fault they went way beyond expectations and got me back into the game I would totally recommend crimson trace laser grips
I apologize for the voice to text post.

When I went to buy my LCP it turned out they'd just gotten one in with a laser. I asked to try it. I was fascinated by it, so I paid the extra for the laser.

It's a cool thing, but I suspect its primary value is one of a deterrent. I shoot better using the iron sights.

I wear tri-focal lenses (readers at the bottom, drivers at the top, neutral in the middle). The sights aren't crystal clear to me, but they're good enough.

Perhaps in the dark or near dark, in a combat/SD situation, where you're not shooting in a more studied manner, just trying to hit center of bad guy, the laser would be more useful?

As for laser vs. optics on a pistol: Can't comment. I've never tried pistol optics. Maybe someday.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: ensigmatic,

One thing cannot be stressed enough with any red dot or laser you must fully completely ignore the irons

Stick with the red dots because they are consistent once you zero them in. You can bash the gun, the red dot and it'll still hold zero. Lasers are a waste of money because they don't hold zero. You shoot the gun a few times and the laser is already out of zero. I've tried many lasers and they all suck. Red dots are the way to go because they hold zero. Lasers are just for show.