the McClain County (Oklahoma) Sheriff's Office released this statement today regarding a unintended discharge at the Blanchard Elementary School. Safariland holsters for 320's with weapo-mounted lights leave a large enough gap between the holster body and the pistol's trigger for objects (including a child's finger) apparently.

https://www.news9.com/story/67...lementary-playground


"McCLAIN COUNTY SHERIFF’S OFFICE

Landy Offolter, Sheriff

December 17th, 2024 - PRESS RELEASE

Ref: Accidental Discharge at Blanchard Elementary School

On December 13th, 2024, a McClain County Sheriff’s Office School Resource Deputy’s service pistol accidentally discharged while interacting with students on the playground at Blanchard Elementary School.

The McClain County Sheriff’s Office immediately began conducting an investigation into the accidental discharge. During the course of the investigation, it was learned that a Deputy was seated on a wooden bench handing out stickers to several students. The Deputy began assisting a child in zipping up their jacket when the Deputy heard his gun discharge. The Deputy became aware of a child on his gun side and began checking this child and other students for any potential injuries. The child told the Deputy and a teacher he made the gun “shoot.”

The Deputy’s service pistol, a SIG Sauer P320, was still secured inside the Deputy’s Safariland holster and remained secured in the holster until Detectives arrived. The Deputy, with the assistance of Blanchard School employees, removed the students from the affected area while the Deputy waited for responding Detectives.

Detectives, upon inspection of the Deputy’s service pistol, learned the SIG Sauer P320’s slide was still locked in place with the spent shell casing still chambered, indicating the service pistol was seated and secured inside the Deputy’s holster at the time of accidental discharge. Detectives had to manually eject the spent shell casing.

Upon further inspection of the Streamlight TLR1 HL flashlight mounted to the SIG Sauer P320 inside the Safariland 6000 series holster, a significant gap was located between the P320’s trigger guard and the holster’s trigger guard, allowing for the trigger to be easily manipulated and gun to be discharged while the service weapon was secured inside the holster with the holster’s retention mechanism engaged.

Detectives performed a series of tests in an attempt to recreate the event. Detectives were successful in recreating the event with the unloaded weapon and holster using adult fingers, confirming a child’s finger would easily be able to manipulate the trigger through the gap in the holster. Based on the findings of the investigation, Detectives concluded the child manipulated the trigger of the Deputy’s weapon, causing it to discharge while in the holster.

These findings have also been consistent with other agencies’ accidental discharge investigations related to similar service pistols and holsters, including the Oklahoma Highway Patrol.

Currently, Deputies provide their own service pistol and duty holster. The McClain County Sheriff’s Office is conducting a thorough review of all weapons systems carried by its Deputies and will be reviewing Department-issued weapons systems options moving forward."

A while back there was a lively discussion here about weapon-mounted lights. In this area they seem to be used almost universally by the LEOs (except for me, the old dinosaur).

I think this may be quite a challenge for duty holster makers to solve.

So, whose finger was inside that "gap"? The SRO's or the child's?

It was the child's finger

https://okcfox.com/news/local/...er-gun-shot-trigger#

McClain Co. Sheriff's office reviews weapon safety after child's accidental trigger pull
by Katie ArataTue, December 17th 2024 at 2:25 PM
Updated Tue, December 17th 2024 at 3:03 PM
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The McClain County Sheriff's Office is conducting a thorough review of all weapons carried by deputies after they say a child manipulated the trigger of a School Resource Officer's pistol, causing it to fire last week.{p}{/p}
The McClain County Sheriff's Office is conducting a thorough review of all weapons carried by deputies after they say a child manipulated the trigger of a School Resource Officer's pistol, causing it to fire last week.

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BLANCHARD, OK — The McClain County Sheriff's Office is conducting a thorough review of all weapons carried by deputies after they say a child manipulated the trigger of a School Resource Officer's pistol, causing it to fire last week.

Deputy's with the McClain County Sheriff's Office say that thankfully no one was injured, and the SRO was not doing anything wrong to cause the gun to fire.

On Friday, a School Resource Deputy's service pistol accidentally discharged while interacting with students on the playground at Blanchard Elementary School.

“One of the school resource officers went over to visit the littler ones, roughly four to six years of age, he had taken a seat on a bench outside in the playground area and was passing out junior deputy stickers, like a lot of us do,” said Deputy Scott Gibbons, the Public Information Officer with the McClain County Sheriff's Office.

Deputy Gibbons says there were several students around getting stickers from the SRO when the deputy began helping a child zip up their jacket, moments later he heard his gun fire.

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“He was in a seated position on a wood bench when the firearm discharged," Gibbons said. "His was on his left side, it discharged into the bench where it remained.”

MCSO says the deputy immediately checked the child and other students, ensuring no one was injured, when the child told him and a teacher that he, "made the gun shoot."

“This is an extremely isolated incident in the sense of weapon never left its equipment, i.e., its holster," said Gibbons, "The kids were not allowed to play or touch it. This was something that happened in a split second.”

Detectives performed a series of tests during their investigation to recreate the event, MCSO says the detectives were able to recreate it with the unloaded weapon and holster using adult fingers, confirming a child's finger would easily be able to manipulate the trigger through the gap in the holster.

“The deputy was not doing anything that was inherently unsafe, that was concerning," Gibbons said, "He was going throughout his normal activities, passing out stickers, loving on the little ones, trying to send him home with a smile, if you will. So nobody's taken this harder, probably than he has.”

Seems like the issue is with the holster, or using a light which requires a holster big enough for the light. Not a problem with the Sig, as it sounds like the gun discharged when the trigger was pulled, as it’s designed to do. The fault was using a holster with a big enough gap to allow a finger to reach the trigger while holstered.

Or am I misreading it?

^^^ Yup. Thread title named the gun (you know, that evil SIG that's been going off on its own all these times), when the gun had nothing to do with it.

Yep. The Safariland 6-Series are by far the most common LE duty holsters out there, and this has been an issue with WML-compatible Safariland 6XXX duty holsters for well over a decade now, across all handguns not just the P320.

Because of the larger tunnel needed to allow the WML to go into the holsters, the light bearing versions of the 6XXX holsters have a big enough gap around the trigger that a small object - or a small enough finger - can get into the holster and access the trigger. (But it's not restricted to just Safariland holsters... Many holsters for guns with WMLs have the same issue to one extent or another.)

And every few years there's this exact news story, of another little kid managing to pull the trigger on his elementary school SRO's pistol while he's hanging out with a bunch of kids. For example:
https://www.startribune.com/ma...-s-misfire/478224803
https://www.cbsnews.com/sacram...un-at-reading-event/
Etc.

Luckily, Safariland took steps to help mitigate it on their newer 7XXX holsters, by increasing the coverage around the trigger guard area. It's honestly the only thing that the 7XXX series improved upon, as the 6XXX holsters are otherwise better in every way.

Here's what the gap looks like on a 6360 duty holster for a P320 with WML.

quote:

Originally posted by 12131:
^^^ Yup. Thread title named the gun (you know, that evil SIG that's been going off on its own all these times), when the gun had nothing to do with it.

I tried to point out the HOLSTER being the issue in the title, but apparently didn't succeed...I also mentioned the duty holster makers in the last sentence of the original post.
For what it's worth I have three 320s and just qualled with one last week. I'm pretty much a 320 fanboi.

I'm not even a fan of the P320. Not even close. Actually don't care for it (owned one, let it go). But with all the undeserved blame/lawsuits it has received over the years, there is no reason to have a title implying this model is the culprit again. It's the holster issue, not the gun.

Safariland holstered gun discharged when someone's finger was able to reach inside the trigger guard. How does that sound?

This message has been edited. Last edited by: 12131,

Still, it wouldn't have happened with a revolver or a DA/SA Pseries Sig or even a 1911/Hi Power with the safety engaged.

Just sayin'.

The P320 setup and the holster Safariland 6000 appear to be a bad marriage.

quote:

Originally posted by RichardC:
Still, it wouldn't have happened with a revolver or a DA/SA Pseries Sig or even a 1911/Hi Power with the safety engaged.

Just sayin'.

It wouldn't have happened if there were no WML on that P320 resulting in a compromised holster design either!

quote:

Originally posted by RogueJSK:
Yep. The Safariland 6-Series are by far the most common LE duty holsters out there, and this has been an issue with WML-compatible Safariland 6XXX duty holsters for well over a decade now, across all handguns not just the P320.

Because of the larger tunnel needed to allow the WML to go into the holsters, the light bearing versions of the 6XXX holsters have a big enough gap around the trigger that a small object - or a small enough finger - can get into the holster and access the trigger. (But it's not restricted to just Safariland holsters... Many holsters for guns with WMLs have the same issue to one extent or another.)

And every few years there's this exact news story, of another little kid managing to pull the trigger on his elementary school SRO's pistol while he's hanging out with a bunch of kids. For example:
https://www.startribune.com/ma...-s-misfire/478224803
https://www.cbsnews.com/sacram...un-at-reading-event/
Etc.

Luckily, Safariland took steps to help mitigate it on their newer 7XXX holsters, by increasing the coverage around the trigger guard area. It's honestly the only thing that the 7XXX series improved upon, as the 6XXX holsters are otherwise better in every way.

Here's what the gap looks like on a 6360 duty holster for a P320 with WML.

I have to disagree. I will take the7xxx series over the 6xxx series everyday.

More coverage of the weapon. Seems to take a beating/scuffing/scraping better. And does not have that stupid fake suede/velvet shit inside the holster that you have to wear off to get a faster draw w/ pistols that have forward serrations like a G17 Gen5 for example.

I started using a 7000 series holster when I switched to a P320. Had the 6000 series when I carried my G17. 7000 definitely protects the trigger area better but i find it sometimes slows my draw a little and definitely slows my re-holstering. Both were used with guns with WML's and RMR's on them.

The other part of this is why he let the child so close and wasn't aware of him sticking his finger in his holster. If it was an adult that knows the mechanics of the holster it could have been a lot worse.

quote:

Originally posted by abnmacv:
The P320 setup and the holster Safariland 6000 appear to be a bad marriage.

As stated in my post, it's not just the P320. It happens with Glocks too.

It's a holster issue. Not a P320 issue.

600 posts in 20 years?

And it's a troll post.

This is old news. In 2009 when we issues M&P with TLR-1 this issue was known. My bet is most agencies don’t read the manual that comes with their holsters. THis issue was spelled out in the holsters manual. at my agency this was gone over every year in firearms training. Officers were reminded about the large gap in the 6000 series holster. Officers were told a child’s finger, keys, debris etc could access the trigger in certain circumstances and be aware of this.

Shivworks did a video about this issue a couple months ago. As Rogue said, it's a known issue.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: CD228,

Dumb idea, but would a grip module that has a trigger guard that is substantially wider on the bottom fix this issue?

quote:

Originally posted by Voshterkoff:
...would a grip module that has a trigger guard that is substantially wider on the bottom fix this issue?

Holster makers need to make holsters that properly/safely fit the guns, not the other way around.

As I recall, one of the holsters my agency was looking at also permitted fingers to get inside and onto the trigger and there had even been reports of unintentional discharges by the actual users as a result. I think I remember the holster brand, but I’m not certain and cite it only as an example that it’s not limited to Safariland holsters.