I bought a 1982 P220 with the heal release and made in W. Germany. All of the markings are on the slide except for the serial number on the front strap of the grip, which matches the number on the "dark" side of the barrel breach. Was it normal for W. German Sigs to have only the S/N on the frame and no other markings? From other pictures I've seen, that appears to be the case, but seems odd from an American point of view.

I found a couple of used .45 magazines as I had read they would work in the 9mm. Upon first insertion, the magazine got stuck about 1/2" in. I removed the left grip and freed the magazine, which made me realize the lower left-side screw was missing its washer and therefore protruding into the magazine channel. Co-incidentally, it looks like this is the screw that would also have held the lanyard ring. The left grip has the cutout for the lanyard ring. Is it safe to say that Sig used the same grip regardless of if they provided a lanyard? That I was missing this washer was a coincidence? Would the lanyard ring normally be held in place by the lower left-side grip screw?

Or (now maybe the Bubba part) there is an extra drilled-and-tapped hole behind each of the grip screw holes in the frame. They are a smaller diameter than the grip screw holes. Did somebody try to install some other model of grip and had to drill the frame for it. They don't look original as they are not blued.

I'll give the seller the benefit of the doubt and believe he didn't know about it. I bought it without magazines or box, so it was a good bit less than the collectible ones I've seen on GB or other sites.

TIA

Maybe someone had set screws in the holes to tighten up the mag fit? I wouldn't sweat it since you cant see it. Would love to have a 220 in 9mm!

quote:

es the number on the "dark" side of the barrel breach. Was it normal for W. German Sigs to have only the S/N on the frame and no other markings?

That's normal for the early P220s.
The frame serial number is on the front strap, the Nitro proof mark is on the right side of the frame just above the trigger guard. Yours should have the proof mark there, also. My ex-JF('85) P220:

quote:

Originally posted by anothercuervo:
Is it safe to say that Sig used the same grip regardless of if they provided a lanyard? That I was missing this washer was a coincidence? Would the lanyard ring normally be held in place by the lower left-side grip screw?

Or (now maybe the Bubba part) there is an extra drilled-and-tapped hole behind each of the grip screw holes in the frame. They are a smaller diameter than the grip screw holes. Did somebody try to install some other model of grip and had to drill the frame for it.

All of the original heel release P220 models shipped with a lanyard loop which was secured behind the left grip panel by the lower left grip screw. The lanyard loop itself acted as in internal spacer lending support to the grip panel when installed. Grips for the later production P220-1 models featuring the American mag release are not compatible with the earlier receiver design. I suspect when Bubba removed the lanyard loop, he attempted to also upgrade the grips by drilling and tapping a few extra holes in the receiver. Other than the extra holes, it sounds as though you could return your pistol to it's original configuration. Unfortunately, lanyard loops for these early models are very difficult to locate. Should you choose to use the original grips without the lanyard loop, you may consider installing an appropriate sized washer behind the left grip panel in place of the missing lanyard loop. Caution should be taken when tightening the grips screws as these early grips are fragile and prone to cracking

Pics of these "Drilled Holes" would help. Maybe someone tried to fit mag button grips to the frame, as I don't believe the holes with the mag button grips and heel release grips are in the same place.

This is also around the time Sig went to a button mag release. Maybe Sig drilled the frames for both options of grips back then and then determined what the original config. would be later down the assembly process.

Everything else seems pretty standard with the gun.

I've loaded 9mm into my 45 acp mags. After about 5 rounds, things don't go so well. Although I haven't tried to fire the gun this way. I'd check ebay or gunbroker for proper 9mm mags. You will pay $100 to $120+ for the proper mag.

If you decide to get rid of it, hit me up. I might be interested. I have an earlier dolphin nose but want a newer style slide.

quote:

Originally posted by Dump1567:
This is also around the time Sig went to a button mag release. Maybe Sig drilled the frames for both options of grips back then and then determined what the original config. would be later down the assembly process.

The hole pattern change was commensurate with the adoption of the American style magazine release and redesigned grips. Bubba almost assuredly tried to retro-fit a newer set of grips to the older receiver.

Yeah, as others have said, the grip screw centerline for the Euro and American mag release are set in different locations.

I have only seen one example of a converted P220 to the newer mag release and it was from 1985.

Here's a picture of the new holes on the left side.

quote:

Originally posted by anothercuervo:
Here's a picture of the new holes on the left side.

Yep, that was definitely done by someone after leaving the factory. As mentioned, maybe to fit standard push button mag grips.

I also just realized the grips are 1985 and the JC dates the gun to 1982.

I took the pistol out today, and the .45 magazines were anywhere in between "perfect" and "let's kick out a live round for the fun of it."

I've been looking for 9mm magazines. Canada has a nice supply that we can't get.

Would .38 Super magazines be any better than .45? They look like the have the same indentation on both sides down the length of the magazine as the 9mm.

Beyond that, the pistol shot great. Accurate and incredibly short trigger reset.

I carried one under my BDU blouse (with the Brigadier Generals permission) around then West Germany when I was a generals guard. Loved that gun. Brought it home and the local PD wouldn’t let me carry it with that heel mag release so I let it go.
Those extra holes are from a Bubba, but will be covered by proper grips. Maybe you can find some Nills?
I think the 38 Super mags may work better than the 45 ones, but that’s just a guess.

Enjoy it!

quote:

Originally posted by anothercuervo:
I took the pistol out today, and the .45 magazines were anywhere in between "perfect" and "let's kick out a live round for the fun of it."

I've been looking for 9mm magazines. Canada has a nice supply that we can't get.

Would .38 Super magazines be any better than .45? They look like the have the same indentation on both sides down the length of the magazine as the 9mm.

Beyond that, the pistol shot great. Accurate and incredibly short trigger reset.

The push button mags they made for the early 90’s .38 Super and 9mm P220’s are marked with both calibers on the base plates. So the older heel release .38 super mags may work? But that’s a lot of money to spend if they don’t. I’d just check gunbroker & eBay until you find the right mags.

quote:

Originally posted by anothercuervo:
Would .38 Super magazines be any better than .45?

They should. The feed lips on top of the .45 magazine are designed for the larger diameter case.

The 9mm Para magazines will have a spacer to make up for the overall case length go the round, but the .38 mag will hold the 9mm round in place.

There have also been positive results when one uses a 10mm magazine instead, but I've never tried it.

I ran in to this when trying to convert a P227 and Glocks to run on .38 Super.

quote:

I've been looking for 9mm magazines. Canada has a nice supply that we can't get.

Western Gun Parts used to sell the 9mm euro magazines on Gunbroker at a very reasonable price. I believe Triple K now has an aftermarket version available but that could be hit or miss.

I was told by Western Gun that they can't ship to the US anymore.

I did find a slightly less expensive 9mm magazine and here is a comparison of the .45 magazine (top) to 9mm. If anyone has a .38 Super they could post for comparison, that would help.