quote:

Originally posted by bac1023:
It’s a much beefier and heavier pistol than an HP-DA, not to mention it’s not double action.

I think Il Cattivo was speaking just in terms of the similarities between the market release and the presumed fate of both pistols (market failure), not similarities in design.

quote:

Originally posted by bac1023:

quote:

Originally posted by Il Cattivo:

Is it just me, or is this really just another HP-DA?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FN_HP-DA

It’s a much beefier and heavier pistol than an HP-DA, not to mention it’s not double action.

MacGyver's right. The updates would have arguably brought the pistol up to date if FN had brought them out years ago, but I'm not sure the updated pistol is terribly competetive now when it comes to being a relatively expensive pistol that FN can hope will sell well. I think that's especially true when Girsan and Springfield Armory are selling slightly improved versions of the P35 for hundreds of dollars less.

FWIW, it seems like the pistol could stand on its own rather than have to rely on being an 'improved' version of the 1935 BHP. Again, though, it seems like it would be pretty hard to get a relatively new metal SAO non-1911 pistol to sell for $900 or more these days.

My LGS has had one on the shelf for a very long time while all the clones were selling around it.
At $1200, Why carry a 40oz gun when you can carry a 32oz one at half the price?

quote:

Originally posted by CQB60:
My LGS has had one on the shelf for a very long time while all the clones were selling around it.
At $1200, Why carry a 40oz gun when you can carry a 32oz one at half the price?

Because it’s a completely different gun and there are no Turkish clones of it.

Why carry a 32oz gun when you carry a 24oz gun for less money?

I don’t disagree it’s different gun. After all, it’s a HP in name only. I’m all for a 24oz gun

quote:

Originally posted by bac1023:

quote:

Originally posted by CQB60:
My LGS has had one on the shelf for a very long time while all the clones were selling around it.
At $1200, Why carry a 40oz gun when you can carry a 32oz one at half the price?

Because it’s a completely different gun and there are no Turkish clones of it.

Why carry a 32oz gun when you carry a 24oz gun for less money?

Bought two FM's years ago from a guy at our range that was doing a divorce sale, this was around 30 years ago so they were a ridiculously low price. One i did the cylinder and slide treatment the other still stock, and while they are good they quit being an EDC years ago, about the time when i went p228. As a novelty i don't need a FN safe queen

I’ve shot them twice courtesy of our dealer rep. I really tried to like it but it just doesn’t feel right.

I like my SA35 much more.

Remakes with “updates and improvements” seldom turn out as good as the originals. The Toyota FJ40 vs. the FJ Cruiser, modern country music, and Red Dawn 1984 vs. whatever in the hell that was in 2012 are just a few examples and this is no different. I started out years ago with a police surplus Hi-Power and when Springfield came out with the SA35, I bought one and put my old FN-made pistol into semi-retirement since internal extractors aren’t as easy to come by if mine breaks. I also wound up buying 2 Girsans that have also been pretty decent performers. These pistols addressed the originals only real shortcomings being better sights and a useable safety. Springfield went one step further by eliminating the magazine disconnect safety but that was never a problem getting rid of that thing in my Girsans or original FN. The modern Hi-Power clones have the same lines, same controls, same feel, same features and even many of the parts will interchange with my original. The new FN High Power is none of that. They tried to copy the lines of the original but never really pulled it off. I really don’t see this one selling all that well and this “Red Dawn 2012” of the handgun world will make an appearance on Forgotten Weapons.

Maybe the best way to put it is that the new FN High Power compares to the old one the same way that the M11-A1 compares to the P228.

quote:

Originally posted by MacGyver:
Maybe the best way to put it is that the new FN High Power compares to the old one the same way that the M11-A1 compares to the P228.

Similar in that the newer models use better materials with stronger, more robust construction.

The Sig is more true to the original design. The FN is completely new, mainly because it needed to be.

Correct. I just meant that both the SIG Sauer M11-A1 and FN High Power intentionally evoke the name and shape of their respective originals, but ultimately differ in functionally important details. I’d agree with you that the M11-A1 is closer to its original because it can at least still accept the same magazine unlike the new FN. But the M11-A1 still uses a different barrel, locking insert, and slide construction. It’s hardly a P228 just like the FN is hardly a Browning. Nothing against either pistol though.

Maybe somewhere there's a police/sheriff/military organization that's looking for a heavy, expensive, all-steel handgun?

quote:

Originally posted by Dawes:
Maybe somewhere there's a police/sheriff/military organization that's looking for a heavy, expensive, all-steel handgun?

Not sure about that, but there’s plenty of people that look for that sort of thing. They usually end up in a 1911 though.

I dunno...I actually like how the new Hi-Po shoots and handles. I have a T-series and it's a fine gun as it is. I also shoot it quite well and it does have a remarkably good trigger even with the mag disconnect still in place. But the 2.0(?) reimagination (thank you Singer Automotive for that catchphrase) is just a better, more complete modern pistol design. To use another automotive analogy, it's a bit like a C8 Corvette compared to a C2 Sting Ray, with the C1 being the original 1911, JMB's genesis for his own subsequent "reimagination" of the semi-auto pistol in his early High Power work before his passing. In its last years the original High Power was a kludge of a seller; compared to more modern firearms FNH really hadn't done much refinement with it, and it with its four-figure price tag showed quite poorly compared to 'lesser' all-metal pistols like the Beretta 92, CZ 75 or any base classic P-series SIG. It definitely felt its age, despite being a new production product. Most gun enthusiasts were instead shopping for an earlier iteration like a T-series rather than putting up with what felt like a compromised product whose character made it seem like its manufacturing tooling should've been replaced or at least updated a manufacturing cycle or two or three earlier. At the end of its production run in 2018 the old gun simply didn't wear the High Power name particularly well.

I think Ian of Forgotten Weapons summarized the redesign quite succinctly.

By all accounts the new HP is a well-made, decently accurate gun. It remains to be seen if it will be popular enough to sustain production. My gut feeling is "probably not".

My criticisms of the FN "reimagined" Hi-Power:

1.) I can't help it, but every time I look at one, and have actually handled it, I can't shake the S&W 3rd Gen vibes I get from it.

2.) I think Springfield Armory did a better rendering with the SA-35. At different times and locations I've asked a few different people employed with SA, if the SA-35 was completely made in America. To a person they all said yes. Take that for what it's worth.

3.) For the 1200 credit price tag on the FN, I can walk 20 feet to Scheel's version of the gun library, and see no shortage of used, and really good condition Hi-Powers from the 70's, 80's, 90's, and 2000's in the 1500 - 1800 credit price range. If I'm willing to spend 1200, I'm willing to jump up to the 300 - 600 credit additional price tag for the real deal.

In the end I don't see the FN Hi-Power 2.0 really generating a ton of excitement for Hi-Power enthusiasts. In a market used originals are not completely out of reach, and if the latter is an issue, a classic rendering of Springfield Armory, and Tisas clones are readily available.