I am wearing my dads old model 19 cannyou recommend a good PD load, Are used to run the old federal 125 grain hollowpoint’s I’m wondering if any of this new fancy bonded ammunition out does the old stuff

Awsome thanks!! Ilike keeping it old skool

I remember in the past there were warnings against use of 125gr .357 magnum ammo in K Frame revolvers because of damage to their forcing cones. Because of this I use 158gr .357 ammunition in my M19 revolvers.

Arfmel, is this supposed to be a problem with just the K frames? I shoot a box of 20 through my jframe(649) about 3 times a year. So far, no problems. Except for the snappy recoil!

quote:

Originally posted by arfmel:
I remember in the past there were warnings against use of 125gr .357 magnum ammo in K Frame revolvers because of damage to their forcing cones. Because of this I use 158gr .357 ammunition in my M19 revolvers.

I ordered some 125g before i refreshed this page , do u have a link for that article on the k frame cones and ammo??

If you open the cylinder of a S&W K-frame 38 or .357 you will see that the bottom of the forcing cone has a small flat area where it has been thinned to make clearance for the front of the cylinder. There have been cases where the thinner metal breaks off and jams the gun.

It does not happen often, but when it does it has been attributed to full .357 110 and 125 grain loads.

As a result, prudent S&W shooters stick to 158 gr in .357 Mag or 38 +P for lighter bullets for M-19 and other K-frames chambered for .357 Mag.

quote:

Originally posted by golddot:
I ordered some 125g before i refreshed this page , do u have a link for that article on the k frame cones and ammo??

If you do an internet search of “S&W K frame forcing cone damage from 125gr .357 ammo” you’ll find lots of discussions about the issue.

Here’s a Gun Blast article on it:

https://gunblast.com/Butch_MagnumLoads.htm

Here’s a discussion on S&W Forum:

http://smith-wessonforum.com/a...mo-model-19-3-a.html

I’ve seen a couple of cracked forcing cones on Model 19s. I can’t prove that they were caused by use of a particular type of ammunition, but I’ve decided not to use the light bullet .357s in my old K Frames, just in case.

I don’t have a .357 J Frame close by, but my 442 in .38spl has a full thickness forcing cone all the way around its circumference, unlike the K Frames.

quote:

Originally posted by golddot:
I ordered some 125g before i refreshed this page , do u have a link for that article on the k frame cones and ammo??

Mas Ayoob mentioned this information in his book on S&Ws in the chapter on the 686. He claimed that the L frame was specifically created to deal with this issue. The Standard Catalogue of Smith and Wesson 4th edition also makes reference to issues with K frames and .357 magnum O/A page 296 in a short passage on the emergence of the L frame. It did not specifically mention the forcing cone. I would also look at the design of the new 2.75 inch model 66, both the forcing cone and cylinder lock up have been changed.

Anecdotally, I've read that the old Remington 125 gr .357 magnum ammo was particularly hot and might have been to blame for some of the reported issues. I've shot the current version of said ammo through my 686 and it had noticeable recoil.

Also, S&W redesigned the J frame for the .357 magnum cartridge. It's talked about in the Standard Catalogue of S&W in the section on revolver frame sizes. As I neither own, shoot or am terribly interested in J frames, I cannot comment about how they hold up with .357 magnum cartridges.

Shooting a couple of cylinders of 125gr 357s won't kill a K-frame, but as a matter of course I use 158gr rounds in mine when I shoot boomers out of it.

For those interested there is an interesting thread on the S&W forum discussing .357 in a k frame. It's titled "Smith, Bill Jordan Got It Wrong".

Golden Sabre 125 grain is my go to for small frame 357 wheelies.
Winchester 145 grain Silvertips for my N frames.

I still like Remington 158 LSWCHP in 38 +p in these.

quote:

Originally posted by RHINOWSO:
Shooting a couple of cylinders of 125gr 357s won't kill a K-frame, but as a matter of course I use 158gr rounds in mine when I shoot boomers out of it.

I do the same. Shoot 158 grain in mine. 158 grain has plenty of velocity and kick out of a .357 anyways. No need for 110 or 125 grain on 2 legged animals anyways IMO.

thx fellas, i got it handled!

For what it's worth, when I wrote to S&W about this issue for my 19-6, they told me that the gun is safe to shoot with any factory .357 ammo.

That said, I only buy 158 grain as I don't want to tempt fate.

I also find I don't shoot all that much full house .357 from the 19. My Ruger GP100 handles the hard stuff better, and the 19 is too pretty to screw up.

Obligatory pic...

I won't shoot magnum 125 grains in my K frames. If I want lighter bullets, I shoot plus P .38's.

It was a constant diet of 125 gr full power 357 Magnum loads that caused problems in the K frame. When Bill Jordan convinced S&W to make the Model 19, it was to use 38 Special for practice, and carry 357 Magnum for “serious social purposes”, which was common among Police Departments at that time. Carrying your 19 with 357 loads, while using 38 Special for practice, with a cylinder or two at the end of practice, will not cause undue wear and tear on your gun. And your hand will appreciate it- the light weight 19 is a pleasure to carry, and not much fun to shoot magnum loads.

I run Federal Personal Defense 125 JHPs in my 686 and my GP100. I would feel good with these for just about any conceivable need in my area of the country.

Yes I know the L Frame handles these a little better than the K, but the post was for PD use not range use.


+

I think my ideal would be 140 grain bullets. Since I reload I can have them anywhere in the spectrum, 38 to max 357 loads.

The 125 grain bullet is shorter, it exits the cylinder with a lot of hot gases still ramping up. This earlier exit with the hot charge ‘may’ contribute to ‘flame cutting’. That’s not gospel, all or part could even be urban legend.

Like anything, 25 rounds may be just fine, 1000 rounds may start to show evidence.