@Smudge, that’s really interesting about the ekron 30 and 556. Based on the juicey vids, I was planning on getting one of each, but if you’re saying the 30 is a bit quieter I was thinking maybe two ekron 30’s. Your comment about something new you can’t discuss has me wondering if I should wait - any hints? Is it a 556 k can? Is it from stealth additive?

quote:

Originally posted by Chowser:
I am sooo old and out of date after watching that video. I'm at 27 stamps, 11 are sbrs, the rest suppressors. my last can was a huxwrx 556k flow. that's out of date. lol

The industry is moving very quickly now, and it's all in the 3D printed space. The pistol forum thread about the firearms industry stagnating has me shaking my head. There may be nothing new under the sun with guns and guys inexplicably thinking the market wants blued 5" revolvers, but things to do with suppressors are innovating and changing at a shocking pace.

quote:

Originally posted by xmod:
@Smudge, that’s really interesting about the ekron 30 and 556. Based on the juicey vids, I was planning on getting one of each, but if you’re saying the 30 is a bit quieter I was thinking maybe two ekron 30’s. Your comment about something new you can’t discuss has me wondering if I should wait - any hints? Is it a 556 k can? Is it from stealth additive?

I can't say anything more yet. If you're asking what I would do knowing what I know right now, I would buy one .30 cal Ekron. I don't regret buying mine. It's quieter at the ear than the 5.56 and less backpressure, which is kind of saying the same thing - less port pop, which is already basically nothing with these cans anyways. I'll also go ahead and admit that I did that test with no ear pro (I know, I know!), and there was no bite and no ear ringing the next day. That, after a whole day of being in a tent having customers shoot suppressed rifles and pistols next to me. I wore my Peltors, but still. I should've had my bell rung and I didn't.


I had a very interesting phone call with their lead sales guy last night. I will explain everything I know the instant I get the go-ahead, but for now, all I can say is some really neat stuff is coming very soon. If I'm reading the tea leaves right, this brand is about to take off in a really big way.

Sounds good. I appreciate the advice, I’ll just get the ekron 30 for now and stay tuned.

I'm not doubting this, but the only number I care about is at the shooters ear. And I don't think I have ever seen a measured test where a .30cal can was quiet enough to beat the same design in 5.56. I know this is true for the cans I own. Do any of these Ekron's have 3rd party numbers like pew?

quote:

Originally posted by hrcjon:
Do any of these Ekron's have 3rd party numbers like pew?

I'll be honest, I don't put a lot of stock in Pew Science. I know that's heresy to a lot of guys, but hey.

Yes, they have submitted some cans for testing. I'm not sure exactly which ones or when the results will be available. I told the sales guy that was a smart move, because there's a huge chunk of the suppressor community that won't pay any attention to them whatsoever if they don't pay the Piper. I mean Jay.

quote:

Originally posted by P220 Smudge:
I'll be honest, I don't put a lot of stock in Pew Science. I know that's heresy to a lot of guys, but hey.

....there's a huge chunk of the suppressor community that won't pay any attention to them whatsoever if they don't pay the Piper. I mean Jay.

I'll say I put some stock in it, as I think it is the best data we have, but I do not take Pew Science as gospel.

Pew for is sure using scientific method, but I don't think the mil standard measurement setup tells the whole story. 1) We hear in stereo and the mic setup is in mono. 2) He's always measuring free field, which is important and I think the right way to do it, but leaves some context out.

There's been one thing bugging me and for example Huxwork flowthru suppressors measure at a high score, but anecdotally people report they are loud as heck. I think there is a disconnect between the equipment measuring and our actual human hearing. I think it's possible to measure well, but send so much blast out the front that if it bounces off of anything it reverberates/echoes like crazy.

I've spent a lot of time listening to Jay's podcast and thinking about this stuff and he's been hinting that he was working on something that would be a measurement of reflections. I get spooked when I see Rob on Silencer Analytics or other influencers shoot a SBR with a K can, standing on a concrete slab and shooting under a tin roof without ears. I KNOW that can't be hearing safe.

Interestingly, Jay came out with Pew Soft HD today. He's now measuring suppressors a few feet away from a brick wall. This is really going to give us more information. I only spent 3 minutes reading it so far, but the Surefire RC2 and the Huxworx 556k both drop 10 points next to a wall. I'll be interested to what the rankings look like when he has 20 or 30 cans under this new test. I don't think the Huxworx cans are going to fare so well.

I'll debunk one more idea on PEW, this one that says, "any manufacturer afraid to send their can to PEW is scared and I don't trust them." I do not buy this argument. My understanding is Pew is charging $8k to get a can tested. That might not be an unreasonable fee, but I don't think a company should be compelled to pay it. There are several new companies (CAT, Otter Creek, etc.) that have really benefited from high scores. If you are a brand new company that no one has never heard of and you make good stuff, the fee is worth it. By the same token old school companies like Surefire and SilencerCo haven't paid him and why should they feel compelled to? Pew tested the RC2 and the Omega 300 because he had to, he wouldn't have any credibility at all if he hadn't tested some of the highest selling cans of all time.

There's my ramble for today Silencers are fun! I'm going to go put together a 12.5" 5.56 SBR now

I like Pew in the sense that you get consistant and comparative testing but wrapped in a small amount of total BS. I like it better from people like TBAC in the TBAC test who pretty much give you all the details. Me personally my purchase decisions don't revolve around PEW, but heck I like to see some numbers and so what bugs me on this can (and of course other new ones) is that I can't see that anyone has tested it and said the actual numbers for a std. noise test. I see the lets shoot a bunch of stuff and listen comparatively, but actual numbers using some standard method and decent tools seems to be nowhere. I would at least like the mfg to give me some meaningful data (example again see TBAC), but ok maybe it has to be one of the many reviewers that has that capability and you have to give them stuff to make that happen but does any actual reliable data exist? I can't find it...and it bugs me the mfg. doesn't either have the capability (weird) or is unwilling to say the results...

since you also know the priciples I am passing along a minor irritant in the web presence.
(note they are not alone in this and I have written several other mfg. about this disconnect).
On the web page we have:
Mounts: DO NOT USE KEYMO on S.A.W. suppressors, this is not something we warranty.
Which sort of implies to me that its not a really good idea (which we know is true).
But then they make a decent attempt to discuss mounts and here we go:
Dead Air KeyMo System: KeyMo provides a robust and reliable QD mechanism compatible with several suppressor models.

It seems it either reliable and robust or its not. and its not.

I get that with Pew, it's data, and it's supposedly measured in a consistent way. The question for me is whether that data actually translates into anything meaningful for the shooter. As mentioned, the Hux cans score really well, but they're... well, loud. The stuff with echo and measuring that at least says to me that Jay realizes there may be some translation issues with the data to the shooter experience and he's trying to account for that. I guess we'll see what develops there.

I do like the TBAC yearly summit testing. It's allll the data. How meaningful that is to the shooter is also up for debate, but at least with them, you're getting all the raw output.

One thing I keep running into is videos and mics vs. stuff like Pew and TBAC. At least with video, you're getting an impression of A vs B. It's not totally meaningless like some people say. Yes, you're limited by how good the mics are and how good your speakers are, bitrate, compression, all that stuff factors in. I think it's all stuff we can use to try to get a big picture of how a can performs, especially vs other cans. With Pew and TBAC, you almost need a degree to decipher what the fuck you're looking at whereas a quick video could show you that a PTR Spiritus is nearly as loud at the ear as a Hux Flow. Really, I think it's all just general guidance stuff and often enough, I have had some serious surprises trying some particular cans in person.

I'll pass along the inconsistency about the KeyMo stuff, thanks for pointing that out. They definitely don't want customers using it with their cans lol.

@Smudge - hey, at the range day did you get to shoot the Jaguar 556 can? I just saw it at EVT and ordered that, along with the ekron 30 and shiv.

quote:

Originally posted by xmod:
@Smudge - hey, at the range day did you get to shoot the Jaguar 556 can? I just saw it at EVT and ordered that, along with the ekron 30 and shiv.

Nope, sure didn't. I just looked it up, though. Printed inconel, so it should hold up to a lot of abuse. Looks like a great can.

You're gonna love the Ekron .30 and the Shiv. I had a real hard time not just buying a Shiv on the spot, but I'm trying to budget out a few things. Definitely going to be buying one, though. It does basically everything I want a pistol can to do at half the size and a fraction of the weight. My only complaint is the one I tried out on all my hosts kept wanting to walk off, but that's a pistol can doing what pistol cans do. I plan to make liberal use of plumber's tape when I get mine.

Good to hear. Oh, and I ordered a genesis 12 7” sbs. They said that was also at their range day. Been wanting one since seeing the juicey media vids.

What I want and use the best is tests that have a consistent repeatable methodology and have at least some of the (what I am calling) reference cans. So if I have can A and they compare it to can B i have some idea if its maybe better or worse. Under some controlled conditions. I have lots of cans so when I see a table of results that has some of the ones I already own compared to some new ones, I have an idea of what I am signing up for. In the case of your Ekron friends I cannot find any data at all. any. forget who did the data, does it exist? A mfg. can do what I want by themselves, for example, if TBAC tells me a can I already own is X and the K version is Y or the newer longer one is Z then I have a good idea what I am getting into because I know the baseline. In any case I think you get it.

I guess this is the official announcement of their new can.

https://www.instagram.com/reel/DSBV1g-EnUd/

Things he didn't touch on: It's shorter, lighter, and quieter than the Ekron in equivalent calibers. PEW Science testing is done, that data will be coming out soon. I should have a slightly different version coming to me soon with added trick up it's sleeve that Micah's does not.

It's funny, a couple months on the market and that Rhino S is still performing at the very top. I should have gone ahead and ordered one when they were $600 lol. I would liked to have seen the Tisha in this comparison, maybe he'll do another video before long.