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Member
Picture of Lt CHEG
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Mars_Attacks:
The ATF doesn't lift a finger on gangs with converted full auto Glocks for some reason.

They afraid of dangerous people who might shoot back?


I have no love for my former employer, but this isn’t really true. There was a substantial effort placed into Glock switch investigations prior to my departure. Could they do more - possibly, but it’s not really fair to say that they haven’t taken any action against gang members with Glock switch equipped firearms.




“It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat.”
 
Posts: 5691 | Location: Upstate NY | Registered: February 28, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
No More
Mr. Nice Guy
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by kidcop:


The "They But They Did It Too" defense is something that doesn't apply past a third grade playground fight.


Actually it very much does apply to things legal and in court. The idea is that laws are applied consistently and equally to all. Either everyone is punished or everyone is let go free. If I do XYZ and you do XYZ, we should both get exactly and precisely the same treatment from the legal system.

So if, for example, Person H has thousands of classified documents illegally removed and stored in her private residence, and then somewhat later in time Person D has a some bunch of classified documents allegedly illegally removed and stored in his private residence, then Person D should receive exactly the same scrutiny and prosecution as Person H did.

Since this is the opposite of how the legal system (and federal agencies) are behaving today, we certainly have reason to complain "But they did it too, and were not treated the way you're treating us".
 
Posts: 9889 | Location: On the mountain off the grid | Registered: February 25, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Frangas non Flectes
Picture of P220 Smudge
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Lt CHEG:
Could they do more - possibly, but it’s not really fair to say that they haven’t taken any action against gang members with Glock switch equipped firearms.


Would it be fair to say their efforts have been far less visible than the multitude of social media posts, both picture and video of certain demographics wielding Glocks with switches on them, which seemingly garners no response? Just search YouTube for Glock switch and enjoy. ATF is knocking on doors looking for forced reset triggers, but am yet to hear about them going into the projects looking for Glock switches.


______________________________________________
“There are plenty of good reasons for fighting, but no good reason ever to hate without reservation, to imagine that God Almighty Himself hates with you, too.”
 
Posts: 17910 | Location: Sonoran Desert | Registered: February 10, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Fly-Sig:
quote:
Originally posted by kidcop:


The "They But They Did It Too" defense is something that doesn't apply past a third grade playground fight.


Actually it very much does apply to things legal and in court. The idea is that laws are applied consistently and equally to all. Either everyone is punished or everyone is let go free. If I do XYZ and you do XYZ, we should both get exactly and precisely the same treatment from the legal system.

So if, for example, Person H has thousands of classified documents illegally removed and stored in her private residence, and then somewhat later in time Person D has a some bunch of classified documents allegedly illegally removed and stored in his private residence, then Person D should receive exactly the same scrutiny and prosecution as Person H did.

Since this is the opposite of how the legal system (and federal agencies) are behaving today, we certainly have reason to complain "But they did it too, and were not treated the way you're treating us".


Not exactly, or AI could adjudicate every criminal case extant. You aren't me and vice versa. It's a basic principle that each individual case is just that, individual, and should be decided on its own unique merits. That applies to the decision to the decision to bring charges, also. Prosecutorial discretion is a real thing. Did anyone except for Javert really think Jean Valjean wasn't essentially a good guy?

We don't want a cookie-cutter criminal justice system. The system has flaws, but is still the best in the world, unless you are into chicom style execution vans.

I do see your point, but in my opinion discretion at all stages of the justice system is critical. I also do not believe that, whatever you want to call them, the Jan 6 incident and the events of 2020 are exactly equivalent. Jan 6 prosecutions are much more visible because they are federal, whereas we are just guessing at prosecutions stemming from the 2020 riots in terms of local charges.

Thank you for an interesting viewpoint and a challenge to my way of thinking.
 
Posts: 632 | Registered: June 11, 2018Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Lt CHEG:
quote:
Originally posted by Mars_Attacks:
The ATF doesn't lift a finger on gangs with converted full auto Glocks for some reason.

They afraid of dangerous people who might shoot back?


I have no love for my former employer, but this isn’t really true. There was a substantial effort placed into Glock switch investigations prior to my departure. Could they do more - possibly, but it’s not really fair to say that they haven’t taken any action against gang members with Glock switch equipped firearms.


I don't have the same level of contact with task forces as I did, but what I saw was them sweeping up any federal violators they found.
 
Posts: 632 | Registered: June 11, 2018Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Sigforum K9 handler
Picture of jljones
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by kidcop:
quote:
Originally posted by Lt CHEG:
quote:
Originally posted by Mars_Attacks:
The ATF doesn't lift a finger on gangs with converted full auto Glocks for some reason.

They afraid of dangerous people who might shoot back?


I have no love for my former employer, but this isn’t really true. There was a substantial effort placed into Glock switch investigations prior to my departure. Could they do more - possibly, but it’s not really fair to say that they haven’t taken any action against gang members with Glock switch equipped firearms.


I don't have the same level of contact with task forces as I did, but what I saw was them sweeping up any federal violators they found.


Of course it’s not true. About four seconds on Google and it returns dozens of Glock switch arrests in the past couple of months.




www.opspectraining.com

"It's a bold strategy, Cotton. Let's see if it works out for them"



 
Posts: 37342 | Location: Logical | Registered: September 12, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
Picture of Lt CHEG
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by jljones:
quote:
Originally posted by kidcop:
quote:
Originally posted by Lt CHEG:
quote:
Originally posted by Mars_Attacks:
The ATF doesn't lift a finger on gangs with converted full auto Glocks for some reason.

They afraid of dangerous people who might shoot back?


I have no love for my former employer, but this isn’t really true. There was a substantial effort placed into Glock switch investigations prior to my departure. Could they do more - possibly, but it’s not really fair to say that they haven’t taken any action against gang members with Glock switch equipped firearms.


I don't have the same level of contact with task forces as I did, but what I saw was them sweeping up any federal violators they found.


Of course it’s not true. About four seconds on Google and it returns dozens of Glock switch arrests in the past couple of months.


Again, no love for my former employer but most agents would salivate over an opportunity to jam up a gang banger with a machine gun. Snap them up in a Hobbs Act robbery or some other crime of violence and a Glock switch gets them 25 years mandatory minimum. Would I prefer that they spend zero effort on the Larry Vickers of the world - absolutely. But I’ve also never seen any agent pass up an opportunity to jam up a gang banger over a technical violation.




“It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat.”
 
Posts: 5691 | Location: Upstate NY | Registered: February 28, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Raptorman
Picture of Mars_Attacks
posted Hide Post
The DA just lets the banger out with no charges filed. Over and over.


____________________________

Eeewwww, don't touch it!
Here, poke at it with this stick.
 
Posts: 34627 | Location: North, GA | Registered: October 09, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
I'd rather be hated for who I am than loved for who I am not
posted Hide Post
quote:
James Sawyer, age 50, of Ray, North Dakota.


https://www.inforum.com/news/n...chine-gun-conspiracy

at least he was trying to get Sig 551's to protect the town of 706 Roll Eyes
 
Posts: 7922 | Location: Bismarck ND | Registered: February 19, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
No man is as blind as the man who chooses not to see.
 
Posts: 1900 | Location: Spokane, WA | Registered: June 23, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Lt CHEG:
quote:
Originally posted by jljones:
quote:
Originally posted by kidcop:
quote:
Originally posted by Lt CHEG:
quote:
Originally posted by Mars_Attacks:
The ATF doesn't lift a finger on gangs with converted full auto Glocks for some reason.

They afraid of dangerous people who might shoot back?


I have no love for my former employer, but this isn’t really true. There was a substantial effort placed into Glock switch investigations prior to my departure. Could they do more - possibly, but it’s not really fair to say that they haven’t taken any action against gang members with Glock switch equipped firearms.


I don't have the same level of contact with task forces as I did, but what I saw was them sweeping up any federal violators they found.


Of course it’s not true. About four seconds on Google and it returns dozens of Glock switch arrests in the past couple of months.


Again, no love for my former employer but most agents would salivate over an opportunity to jam up a gang banger with a machine gun. Snap them up in a Hobbs Act robbery or some other crime of violence and a Glock switch gets them 25 years mandatory minimum. Would I prefer that they spend zero effort on the Larry Vickers of the world - absolutely. But I’ve also never seen any agent pass up an opportunity to jam up a gang banger over a technical violation.


I agree with all of this. Machine gun prosecutions of all kinds are a big deal and an obvious priority for BATFE, but when a Glock "switch" (especially the "invisible" style) can be a single, 3D printed part in the simplest end and all of three parts at their most complex, it's hard to stop new ones from appearing.
 
Posts: 5273 | Location: Iowa | Registered: February 24, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Peace through
superior firepower
Picture of parabellum
posted Hide Post
Guys, I want you to please stop with thhe nested quotes. Look at all the real estate that post takes up on the page.

All of this- why?:
quote:
Originally posted by Lt CHEG:
quote:
Originally posted by jljones:
quote:
Originally posted by kidcop:
quote:
Originally posted by Lt CHEG:
quote:
Originally posted by Mars_Attacks:
The ATF doesn't lift a finger on gangs with converted full auto Glocks for some reason.

They afraid of dangerous people who might shoot back?
I have no love for my former employer, but this isn’t really true. There was a substantial effort placed into Glock switch investigations prior to my departure. Could they do more - possibly, but it’s not really fair to say that they haven’t taken any action against gang members with Glock switch equipped firearms.
I don't have the same level of contact with task forces as I did, but what I saw was them sweeping up any federal violators they found.
Of course it’s not true. About four seconds on Google and it returns dozens of Glock switch arrests in the past couple of months.
Again, no love for my former employer but most agents would salivate over an opportunity to jam up a gang banger with a machine gun. Snap them up in a Hobbs Act robbery or some other crime of violence and a Glock switch gets them 25 years mandatory minimum. Would I prefer that they spend zero effort on the Larry Vickers of the world - absolutely. But I’ve also never seen any agent pass up an opportunity to jam up a gang banger over a technical violation.
Please, just respond without the quoting, or quote just the person you're addressing.


____________________________________________________

"I am your retribution." - Donald Trump, speech at CPAC, March 4, 2023
 
Posts: 110260 | Registered: January 20, 2000Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Balzé Halzé:

quote:
As for the Jan 6ers. I have not lost a second of sleep over these people who decided to storm a federal building blocked off by police officers. If you were dumb enough to force your way inside because another guy in red hat (secret agent or not) said you should, then you can follow your fellow sheep right into jail cell.


You should educate yourself on a subject before making such statements.


Call me naive. Can you point me in the direction of what I should know.


 
Posts: 5492 | Location: Pittsburgh, PA, USA | Registered: February 27, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Bad Apple
of the AAP
Picture of 9mm_shooter
posted Hide Post
quote:
As detailed in his plea agreement, Vickers kept some of the machineguns and other restricted weapons in his personal collection and transferred other machineguns and restricted weapons to other FFLs and third parties. Vickers also pleaded guilty to a conspiracy to violate U.S. sanctions against a foreign firearms manufacturer between July 2014 and March 2021, in the Southern District of Florida.


How will he be allowed to keep any firearms once he is a convicted felon?
 
Posts: 7807 | Location: Central Florida | Registered: June 14, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Oriental Redneck
Picture of 12131
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by 9mm_shooter:
How will he be allowed to keep any firearms once he is a convicted felon?

He plead guilty. He's done. He won't be keeping any firearms.


Q






 
Posts: 28334 | Location: TEXAS | Registered: September 04, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
Picture of Lt CHEG
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by 9mm_shooter:

How will he be allowed to keep any firearms once he is a convicted felon?


I have to wonder if he pled to some sort of diversion agreement? Basically, you plead guilty, but if you keep your nose clean for 3 years, do well on interactions with Probation and Pretrial Services, etc. the conviction gets rolled back. I’m way oversimplifying the process, and I’m not well versed in all the details, but LAV would be the type of person that would be ideal for such an arrangement.




“It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat.”
 
Posts: 5691 | Location: Upstate NY | Registered: February 28, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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