A surprise within.


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Kel Tec carbines? Glock or Beretta magazine compatible?

Makes sense to me.

Chazak Ve Ematz: Strength and Courage.

I am no fan of pistol cartridge long guns for such roles, but 9.9 for the type of program that I have long advocated myself, and for the sheriff’s willingness to address and explain it forthrightly.

Thanks for posting.

You will not come to our schools and kill our children.

That’s damned right.

OUTSTANDING!

Here's hoping that Sheriff Ivey's new SRO program is so successful that it becomes a model for other counties to adopt.

As some mass killers have started adopting body armor, I have some questions about the caliber they adopted, but maybe the thinking is any and enough rounds on the killer from a long gun is better than no rounds from the AR in the patrol car?

I could very well be wrong, but I suspect Sheriff Ivey made the conscious decision to avoid having his SROs carry ARs as they have wrongly become demonized and polarizing, and the Kel-Tec doesn't look so scary as an AR, while being lighter to patrol the school with, and perhaps more compact.

In related news, the sheriff of Madison county NC is now storing an AR-15 at each of the 6 schools in the school district:

North Carolina Schools to Stock AR-15s to Prevent Uvalde Repeat

The school children in Brevard county just got a little safer.

Two thoughts:

First, I think that killing these psychopaths before they have a chance to hurt/kill anyone is a good thing.

Second, as much as I like Israel I do not want the United States looking like it.

I struggle with this as I'm afraid that we have no other choice.

Could it be the pistol cartridge is used to minimize over penetration? Hopefully the magazines match the duty pistol.

But Keltec? I always thought they were the lower tier of firearms? Is that an incorrect assumption?

quote:

Originally posted by sig229-SAS:
But Keltec? I always thought they were the lower tier of firearms? Is that an incorrect assumption?

I don't know. I have a SUB 2000 with Glock mags and its a really nice little gun that runs and shoots pretty reliably. H&K's would obviously be a step up, but are likely a bit cost prohibitive.

Sheriff Ivey and Sheriff Judd in Polk County are friends and share similar views toward community policing, and I wish far more police chiefs followed their lead. Neither of these two are people to mess with when it comes to acting outside the law.

Being that KelTecs are made in Cocoa, Florida which is in Brevard County. I am going to guess that has a lot if not everything to do with the choice of weapon.

As in they are likely free to the department.

I like the thought process though maybe not the full implementation. A folding AR chambered in .300blk with a suppressor would be my choice.

quote:

Originally posted by bigdeal:
Sheriff Ivey and Sheriff Judd in Polk County are friends and share similar views toward community policing, and I wish far more police chiefs followed their lead. Neither of these two are people to mess with when it comes to acting outside the law.

They are not Police Chiefs and that is why they do what they do. You will see very very few Police Chiefs do things like this.
There is a very large difference between Chief and Sheriff mentalities.

quote:

Originally posted by Black92LX:
There is a very large difference between Chief and Sheriff mentalities.

And that is both the problem and my point in posting what I did. Ivey and Judd are loved and respected by their communities...for a reason.

quote:

Originally posted by Black92LX:
There is a very large difference between Chief and Sheriff mentalities.

Are Sheriffs usually elected and Chiefs usually appointed?

quote:

Originally posted by chbibc:

quote:

Originally posted by Black92LX:
There is a very large difference between Chief and Sheriff mentalities.

Are Sheriffs usually elected and Chiefs usually appointed?

Yup.

quote:

Originally posted by sig229-SAS:
But Keltec? I always thought they were the lower tier of firearms? Is that an incorrect assumption?

I love my Kel-Tec Sub2000 9mm carbine

It’s accurate, always goes bang and will do the job against any scumbag school shooter.

The fact that the KelTec folds for a more compact carry may have factored in the choice of weapon.

I have personal knowledge that some administrators believe that 9mm ammunition fired from a rifle generally penetrates building materials less than common 223 Remington projectiles.

That belief is wrong, IMO, as supported by various studies of varying validity, such as:

https://www.tactical-life.com/exclusives/9mm-vs-223/
https://www.alloutdoor.com/201...9mm-vs-223-vs-22-lr/

Further, if a 9mm bullet misses its human target—and most do in police shootings—it will still penetrate a long ways through common building materials. If there’s anyone on the other side of a classroom wall and the bullet hits them, it won’t be much different than if the wall hadn’t been there at all.

But even if we ignore the ability of 9mm bullets to penetrate through building material barriers, there are at least a couple of other factors to consider.

First is body armor. I don’t know how many active assailants have armored themselves, but it’s hardly unknown. According to the account of a killer at a Texas courthouse who was engaged with a handgun by a non-LEO, the killer was wearing armor and killed the good guy. The criminal was finally neutralized by an officer with an AR. 223/5.56 ammunition cannot defeat all body armor, but it is effective against almost all soft armor.

Second, the terminal effectiveness of 223/5.56 is vastly greater than that of any 9mm round. There is a tendency to assume that every shot will be “placed” Goldilocks just right, but that simply isn’t true, and because of the 9mm’s much poorer terminal ballistics, the chances of a hit’s being an aggression stopper is much higher with the rifle cartridge. If I manage only a single hit, I will want it to be as effective as reasonably possible under the circumstances.

Supersonic 300 Blackout ammunition will no doubt also defeat most soft armor, but most loads’ bullets are far heavier than most 223’s, and will tend to penetrate through building materials to a greater degree.

But none of that is up to me, and hopefully the deterrence value will suffice.

quote:

Originally posted by YooperSigs:
The fact that the KelTec folds for a more compact carry may have factored in the choice of weapon.

Pretty sure they being a FL company helps their case, also.

Folds up and is worn across the chest to make it easier to carry and deploy. They are probably banking on the fact that the average lunatic shooter will not realize it's a 9mm and be scared away from the videos.

That's not exactly the best strategy, pistol round against a potential rifle, but it does increase significantly the odds of the officer getting hits on target. And they won't go deaf firing it indoors.

This is exactly what something like a Rattler or Honey Badger is for. Rifle round in a very small package. But that's going to be 5x more per gun than the Kel-Tec.