quote:

Originally posted by reloader-1:

quote:

Originally posted by Aeteocles:
Working really fucking hard through the best years of my life shouldn't be the badge of honor it's made out to be.

I'm happy to trade away my commute time for more hours at home with my children, or even more actual productivity at work.

This.

I know I’m going against the grain here, but I left a job because they wanted me to go back to the office.

....

Unless you threw a temper tantrum about it I don't think you're going across the grain here. You didn't like an aspect of your job and found one you like better. Not much anyone can disagree with.

quote:

Originally posted by Aeteocles:
Really, no job is safe, save for perhaps tradesmen who must physically be present to diagnose infrastructure that cannot be moved overseas.

That's one reason I moved out of Software Development into I.T.

With Software Development my entire job could be out-sourced. With I.T. only about 80%. Some things required hands-on, in person, where even "remote hands" would not suffice.

That being said: The President, CEO, and majority owner for most of my years at my last employer disliked employees working from home. So, despite the fact I could do 80% or my job from home, he wanted me on-premises. So that's what I did.

I've seen how these "work at home" people work...not.

Case in point. Arizona CCW permits and the time for renewal. Prior to covid, you sent in your renewal and in 2 or 2-1/2 weeks, you got your new permit in the mail. Now, with "work at home" workers, it takes 6 months.

Obviously these people have little to no work ethic and nobody is kicking their butt and making them earn their pay.

Vive la révolution!

I'm self-employed and run in-home appointments with people who would not buy any other way. It's a face to face business, though with some admin work I do at home. My only regret in life is how many years I spent working for idiots, even when it was from home because the company had no offices within 2500 miles of my house.

Totally your decision to quit a job because you like working in your boxers. It’s America, have at it. I for one though won’t shed a tear when we return to normal and people get fired because they got used to setting their own hours and doing the job when they wanted.

News flash. Sometimes you are sitting around with nothing to do because if something happens and needs immediate action you are being paid to do it right now. Not after you put your kids on the bus. Not after you fed the cat. Right the fuck now.

This is a bad trend. It makes lazy entitled people, basically most of us, into even more lazy and entitled people. It isn’t a good trend no matter how much you may like it personally.

If you can find that job though that rings all your bells, more power to you. I’m with Elon Musk though. Come to work or you are fired.

Link

One of the biggest landlords in Los Angeles just defaulted on $755 million in loans for two sky scrapers as remote work keeps offices vacant

This is one of the big negatives of having WFH platforms, a decrease in office space values, defaults on loans, reduction in construction.

Like closing a plant in a small town, the loss just isn't the jobs in the factory, it can wipe out massive income, jobs and close down plenty of other businesses.

Most management doesn't care for WFH, it's too easy to fake being online, active and working. Wifes office does this with rotations of in and out of office schedules as a stop gap between the everyone is at home covid policy and what's coming is, back in the office time.

You'd be amazed at the number of people who fake working, for some software, all you have to do is put a Credit card inbetween a key and the frame to hold it down and the software logs you as active while you take the dog out, wash clothes, watch Springer, or sleep off the hangover since you can go out and party and don't have to get up and get dressed to be in the office.

Some folks can handle WFH and actually are productive, my bet is 90% are not....

I've never had the opportunity to work from home. The majority of my time in the corporate world was managing areas that had my employees doing hands on work. Manufacturing, warehousing and the like which for obvious reasons couldn't be done at home.

Still I wonder, even for those "do it by yourself jobs" are employees really more productive at home with all of the potential distractions than in the office which provides all of the support (Copiers etc.) and afforded in person contact with interconnected departments? My gut feel is no, and as already mentioned this is a slippery slope as the more employees are distance from the workplace, the easier it is to source these jobs to less expensive labor without the costs of providing benefits, sick pay, vacation etc. So sometimes be carful what you wish for.

quote:

Originally posted by HRK:
This is one of the big negatives of having WFH platforms, a decrease in office space values, defaults on loans, reduction in construction.

Like closing a plant in a small town, the loss just isn't the jobs in the factory, it can wipe out massive income, jobs and close down plenty of other businesses.

The mayor of San Francisco, one of the cities with the largest amount of WFH workers, recently announced that SF's downtown economy is not coming back. And she is right. SF is the worst major city in economic recovery after the Covid shit, only sustaining a 30% recovery back to pre-2020. Countless businesses have permanently disappeared, businesses that have operated for years, decades. Gone. Restaurants, coffee shops, dry cleaners, florists, bars, etc. etc., all dependent on downtown workers. The city's tax base has suffered tremendously. Countless empty storefronts. Empty streets mean more street people. More crime. The mayor actually said it's not so bad compared to the aftermath of the 1907 earthquake .

The woke say get used to the "new economy", and I say how's it working out for America today?

https://www.sfgate.com/bayarea...ng-back-17775329.php

maybe if they put in a vegan cafe and a few foosball tables...? LOL

I was at an oil & gas conference recently, and I arrived early so I grabbed a plate of breakfast items. I ended up seated at table with people I didn't know. We made small talk and they raised the subject of "when did your company return to the office?" They were shocked that I had returned to the office in Feb '21. I was shocked when they said that they just returned to the office 2 weeks prior, and even more shocked that they were being fed the lie that they were one of the first in industry to return to the office. A lot of oil & gas returned to the office 2H21, most of the rest of US owned oil & gas returned to the office in 1H22, and the Canadian owned oil & gas returned to the office in 2H22.

With Disney planning to downsize their labor force already, this is a smart way to decrease it, without having to pay unemployment or severance.

People moving themselves on or being terminated for not coming in is easy money.

quote:

Originally posted by Underdog:
With Disney planning to downsize their labor force already, this is a smart way to decrease it, without having to pay unemployment or severance.

People moving themselves on or being terminated for not coming in is easy money.

It is, of the 2300 on the petition, maybe 10% actually are workers they'd like to keep, the rest they will be glad are gone.

It's a good way to trim out those who are really not productive.

Reminded me of this Starbuck employee. He had to work 8.5 hours.




.

I think much of it depends on home environment/work environment and career path.

I can’t get any work done in the plant office - too many people come by “to chat about X”

(And yes, “chatting about X” is important - but it makes it difficult for me to get my tasks done)

For creatives, I think being in an office is very counter productive, unless designed very differently - ideally, give a group of creatives the right environment, and “neat stuff” should happen - profitable stuff, with the right resources and mix.

quote:

Originally posted by pedropcola:
Totally your decision to quit a job because you like working in your boxers. It’s America, have at it. I for one though won’t shed a tear when we return to normal and people get fired because they got used to setting their own hours and doing the job when they wanted.

News flash. Sometimes you are sitting around with nothing to do because if something happens and needs immediate action you are being paid to do it right now. Not after you put your kids on the bus. Not after you fed the cat. Right the fuck now.

This is a bad trend. It makes lazy entitled people, basically most of us, into even more lazy and entitled people. It isn’t a good trend no matter how much you may like it personally.

If you can find that job though that rings all your bells, more power to you. I’m with Elon Musk though. Come to work or you are fired.

I agree with a lot of this too.

When I was a salary remote employee I was available the entirety of the shift I was assigned. It was always 8-5, just not always 8-5 in the time zone I lived in. As said before, my work usually only took 3-4 hours, but I was in my office with no kids around. Honestly I even hesitated to leave for lunch for my lunch hour even though when I worked in the office I almost always went out.

If I had an appointment or wanted to leave early I always spoke to my manager and got approval. This almost always came with him telling me he didn’t give a shit as long as I got my work done, but to me, they were paying me for 40 hours a week and I was going to be accountable for 40 hours a week.

I’ve seen a lot of posts on social media with kids discussing how shitty it is when you are at the store and your boss wants to do a Teams call and others discussing how to keep your mouse moving to make it look as though you are online. Too many of them to think they are all a joke. There’s no doubt most of these remote workers are fucking off for a significant portion of their day, and while they get their assignments done, as you stated, they aren’t making themselves available for last minute emergencies.

Worse, they celebrate that as though fucking over their employer and fellow coworkers is some sort of accomplishment.

That video made this entire thread. I am still smiling. So it is a dude right?

Breaking down over an eight and a half hour work day. Son, you've got a tough row to hoe.

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Originally posted by parabellum:
Breaking down over an eight and a half hour work day. Son, you've got a tough row to hoe.

An eight and a half hour shift at Starbucks too. It’s not like he/she was in the coal mines. It wouldn’t last an hour at my job.

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You'd be amazed at the number of people who fake working

No, I would not.