I am just thankful they are awful. Or I would have to buy another safe. My house is not big enough for another safe, so I would have to build a new house, or an addition, or a garage or something (an Armory?). It would get even more expensive!!!!

There is a fairly new shop in Eden Prairie that hits most of the points you mentioned. Nice shop, good selection, owners (husband and wife) almost always on site. Their online inventory is quite accurate.

I've made the 1hr drive from home twice this year to buy pistols from them despite the price being a bit higher. I REALLY hope they can make this work. If guys use them as a showroom and then order from GB to save $20, then the model fails. If we want this type of shop/service, we have to be willing to reward and support it.

^^^^^ what's the name of that shop MNSIG?

Arnzen Arms

It's located right where 494 makes the turn from E/W to N/S.

OP, you are asking a lot for 11 bucks an hour.

Bob

quote:

Originally posted by MagnumU:
A local entrepreneur set up a gun store in Falls Church ("The Gun Dude") that addressed each of your points, combined with coffee. Diverse staff, online inventory, training and legal courses, outreach, etc. In terms of attitude, education focus with emphasis on first-time gun buyers. Problem is, it is still a low margin business, and they are closing later this month.

Virginia Arms in Manassas is an option.

I've been to VA Arms many times. They're who I was thinking of when wiring this post. They do some things well but it's not a place I'd take my girlfriend. I thought Gun Dude was moving, not closing?

So if it's a low margin business (about 20% markup last time I saw a dealer catalog) then it should be run as such. I know most money is made on accessory sales and firearms sales act as almost a loss leader.

- Minimal storefront
- Minimal staffing
- Low, transparent prices
- No credit card fees or other hidden charges
- Online inventory with all items in the store

And as my high school guidance counselor used to say, "It costs nothing to smile."

I've been waited on by women and a number of minorities a number of times that come immediately to mind. Are they the majority? Of course not, but they aren't unicorns either.

1) Websites are expensive to develop, require constant fiddling and
updating, and are beyond the personal capabilities of many owners. Have
you ever noticed that the majority of "store's" websites you see look
the same? That's because it is a GearFire website with direct
distributor feed. The store doesn't actually have that shit in stock
and thus isn't paying to house it.

2) The staff reflect the demographic of gun enthusiasts.

3) Agree 100%.

4) Small margins, liability, etc.

5) The most successful stores I sell to are in neighborhoods where many in
the community hate them.

6) Whether it's guns, or tiles at Home Depot, good salesman are hard to
find.

In my 20 years in the firearms industry, working from Arizona to the East Coast, on more than one occasion I have had customers smell guns and tell me that it doesn't smell right. Shake guns and tell me they don't sound right. Tell me they've killed deer at 300 yards with single heart shots from .22 magnum revolvers. And my personal favorite, ask me to look at a dozen different pistols from the same maker to find a serial number that "doesn't have bad vibes associated".

The attitude comes from dealing with the same dumbassery every single day, Ad nauseam. Loaded guns pulled out of holsters, guns pointed at your guts, lies told to your face, retarded 'facts" regurgitated because "that's what (fill in the blank) told me, and he's a gun guy."

The problem with the gun industry, and there are many, is that it's a race to the bottom price-wise. Many MFDs do not enforce MAP, and store owners have to compete with whores, basement bandits, and one-lung dealers who have an FFL, a laptop, and do this shit for beer money.

It because it is a hobby first. Ultimately, it is a big kid’s hobby shop. You could change “Gun Shop” to “Dive Shop” and the same is true (generally, there are those occasional shops, gun and dive, that are the outliers), they are filled with pseudo-experts that spend more time behind the counter then actually doing any real diving or shooting. And they feed their egos by selling to the uninformed. The shit dive shops sell and tell people is horrifying, same is true with gun shops.

I heard a saying once and it was spot on, “If you heard it in a dive shop, it’s probably wrong…”, same could be said about gun shops

Caneau, dude, DECAF!

Most gun stores are "mom and pop" operations. They know guns and don't have the resources to implement a link to a online warehouse. Give 'em a break and accept them for what they are.

quote:

Originally posted by Southflorida-law:
It because it is a hobby first. Ultimately, it is a big kid’s hobby shop. You could change “Gun Shop” to “Dive Shop” and the same is true (generally, there are those occasional shops, gun and dive, that are the outliers), they are filled with pseudo-experts that spend more time behind the counter then actually doing any real diving or shooting. And they feed their egos by selling to the uninformed. The shit dive shops sell and tell people is horrifying, same is true with gun shops.

I heard a saying once and it was spot on, “If you heard it in a dive shop, it’s probably wrong…”, same could be said about gun shops

I see what you're saying. Go into a scale model/train/RC car place and you'll see the same.

I get the feeling that most stores of this type are run by hobbyists rather than business people, and they are doing it out of passion, for lack of a better word, than as a real thought that they'll get rich.

All of OP gripes are exactly what every gun SHOW is like for me. Most shops do their best to stay with the times and try to turn a profit. But the gun show "circuit" is down right awful around my hood and verbatim to what the OP hates about his local gun shops.

quote:

Bottom line if you are in the area, give Royal Range a SHOT!

I am and I do. Been going there since before they were fully open. Their sales people are exceptional and their pricing and inventory - including ammo - are my new yardstick for this area.

I don't get treated that way and the Louisville/southern Indiana area has some of the best gun and pawn shops anywhere. Maybe it's because I'm friendly and outgoing. I don't mind being the first to say hello and I do it with a smile. I also don't whine about prices and would never run a gun down. I will, while inspecting, let my finger linger on a flaw but there's no need to be a whiner.

Regardless of the marked price, I make my own cash on the spot offer in a cheerful way. Perhaps it's because I've been an active collector for 30 years but I've found gun people to be amoung the salt of the earth and most realize that a firm cash offer is better than a thousand lookers.

Now I do stay the hell out of Bass Pro, Cabellas and other big boxes but rubber guns and new revolvers don't turn my crank anyway.

Go to Uncle Milties pawn shop by Churchill Downs or Falls City Firearms in Clarksville and you'll see old school customer service. Everything Concealed on Eastern Blvd has their guns on open display and they don't care if you handle them all. Ron (may he rip) at Ron's Guns off Chas-NA pike was a curmudgeon, a crusty old retired state trooper until he saw I was a Mason. I'm honored to call him friend and fraternal brother.

quote:

Originally posted by doublesharp:Regardless of the marked price, I make my own cash on the spot offer in a cheerful way.

How much do you typically expect to have the price discounted for cash?

I've got a gun shop just down the road from my office that I've got mixed feelings about. They have a great selection and is a family run business that's been around for years. Dad manages it, daughter runs the store and online sales, Grandma works the register, that kind of place. For the most part the store is great, its bright and open and the guns are mostly out in the open and you can pickup and inspect at your leisure. Only the handguns and a selection of the nicer rifles and shotguns are behind a counter. Great selection of ammo, safes, accessories, etc.

But: I've got two issues with them
1) The employees never seem very friendly or open to helping me. When i purchased my first pistol, I couldn't get any help. There were employees around, mostly engrossed in their own conversations. My coworker who is from the town and knows everyone goes in the store and it's like Norm from Cheers. I don't know why they are closed off to "outsiders". I've purchased three guns, a safe, ammo, and AR accessories from them, I probably drop in once a month just to kill time during lunch and I still feel like an uninvited guest half the time.

2) Support after the sale, or lack of it. a buddy bought a cheap AR from them about a year ago. we took it out and couldn't get 20 rnds through it. We tried 3 different types of ammo in three different magazines. He called the store and it was basically sorry about your luck, bro. I understand them not taking the gun back, but how about you stand behind the products you sell. Offer to handle the warranty work, cover the shipping, etc. Nope, nada. It really pissed off my friend. He has since bought 4-5 more guns and not one has come from them.

How much do you typically expect to have the price discounted for cash?

Depends on where the orig price is? And I'm seldom shopping for new guns. They are a different ballgame.

If the gun is priced right to start I probably won't make an offer but will istead ask if there is any room on a cash deal. That opens the negotiations.

If I'm interested but think it's overpriced I'll typically offer a little ($50-100) under what I want to pay. It's a cliche but it doesn't hurt to unobtrusively flash your cash. I can't ever remember offending anyone with a cash offer.

For the most part, you are right. I think it is because many stores are run by gun nuts (for lack of a better term) and not by shopkeepers. In other words, the people who open gun stores are interested in guns, but aren't interested in retail selling, people, and service.

There are exceptions, but many smallish gun stores fit this mold.

Honestly, it has nothing to do with it being a gun store.
It is all about the evolution of the brick and mortar store and retail in general.
It has been deteriorating over the years for a variety of reasons including but not exclusive to the Internet.
Mostly it has to do with poor management skills of the operator.

quote:

Originally posted by doublesharp: It's a cliche but it doesn't hurt to unobtrusively flash your cash. I can't ever remember offending anyone with a cash offer.

No, but I wouldn't expect much of a discount. A 3% credit card fee is only $15 on a $500 gun. Not really big negotiating bucks unless the guy is operating a shady business and not reporting his transactions accurately for tax purposes.