https://abcnews.go.com/US/wire...s-shooting-127078187.

It stopped them from using the pistol as unsafe for a while.

He may have later committed suicide.

No sidearms while guarding one of our three largest nuclear arsenals. Did a general lose his job? If not, he should have.

I was part of the team trained to guard and store nuke weapons onboard our ship. This was mid 1960's. We carried 1911s in condition 3. But, pretty loose rules of not waiting to shoot to kill if warranted.

Nevertheless, the original claim will still be quoted years from now as “proof” that the guns are unsafe.

Like countless other claims about other subjects, it doesn’t matter whether they are true, people believe what they want to believe.

quote:

Originally posted by sig2392:

He may have later committed suicide.

There were 3 Airmen involved, 1 died on scene, and one committed suicide in the beginning of Oct.

Sad outcome from playing around with a pistol.

quote:

Originally posted by Gustofer:
No sidearms while guarding one of our three largest nuclear arsenals. Did a general lose his job? If not, he should have.

If you're referring to the temporary pause in P320/M18 usage while they investigated the initial (false) uncommanded discharge claim, they weren't unarmed during that period... They just used rifles.

From the initial press release back in July (bold emphasis mine):

Air Force Global Strike Command has paused use of the M18 Modular Handgun System, effective July 21, 2025, until further notice. This decision was made following a tragic incident at F.E. Warren AFB, WY, on July 20, 2025, which resulted in the death of a Security Forces Airman.

Out of an abundance of caution and to ensure the safety and security of our personnel, the pause will remain in place pending the completion of comprehensive investigations by the Air Force Office of Special Investigations and the AFGSC Safety office. During this period, Security Forces Airmen will be equipped with the M4 rifle, ensuring no lapse in AFGSC’s security posture.

Some people don’t realize that handguns are small portions of military use.

quote:

Originally posted by RogueJSK:
...During this period, Security Forces Airmen will be equipped with the M4 rifle, ensuring no lapse in AFGSC’s security posture.[/i]

Not to be too picky, but going from pistols to carbines seems, not like a lapse, but an upgrade in security posture.

Poor leadership and management of a crisis by an AF general, who should retire over this so-called "crisis".

^^ Exactly how/why are you characterizing this as 'poor leadership and management of a crisis' by an AF General? This occurred during the period when the entire weight of the internet (including a significant portion of the 'firearms community' ) were incited into a frenzy by an ever growing group of attention seeking self-appointed experts on YouTube, seemingly holding SIG's head under water demanding they admit there's a problem with the P320/M17/M18, that again, NOBODY had been able to identify!

The Air Force Global Strike Command had paused it's use of the M18 while they performed a safety inspections of all M18 Pistols and a comprehensive investigation of the incident. The following is a copy of the memorandum/order from the General/Commander of the USAF:



The Air Force Global Strike Command completed it's inspection of it's M18 Pistols, as well as the investigation of the incident, and moved on. In the interim, USAF Security Forces carried M4 Rifles. No lapse in Security, and no deficit of leadership whatsoever!

quote:

The Air Force Global Strike Command completed it's inspection of it's M18 Pistols, as well as the investigation of the incident, and moved on. In the interim, USAF Security Forces carried M4 Rifles. No lapse in Security, and no deficit of leadership whatsoever!

Agreed. Action was taken immediately after the event, inspections were performed on A LOT of guns in a timely manner, and an investigation was conducted that resulted in multiple confessions. I don't see anything to complain about here. Job well done.

quote:

There were 3 Airmen involved, 1 died on scene, and one committed suicide in the beginning of Oct.

I believe there were four airmen involved. From the ABCNews article:

#1: Brayden Lovan, shot in late July.

#2: Marcus White-Allen, who shot Lovan, later found dead on October 8th.

#3 & 4: "White-Allen after the shooting allegedly urged the other two surviving airmen to lie about what happened, according to the statement."

“White-Allen allegedly told Badesha, “Here’s the story. Tell them that I slammed my duty belt on the desk and it went off.” White-Allen allegedly told Rodriguez to tell emergency responders that White-Allen’s “holster went off," according to the statement.“

The initial story smelled to begin with and now we find it was bullshit.

“…Marcus White-Allen, had pointed the gun at Lovan's chest in a “joking manner."”

This smells too.

So, where does SIG go to get their reputation back?

quote:

Originally posted by nhracecraft:
^^ Exactly how/why are you characterizing this as 'poor leadership and management of a crisis' by an AF General? This occurred during the period when the entire weight of the internet (including a significant portion of the 'firearms community' ) were incited into a frenzy by an ever growing group of attention seeking self-appointed experts on YouTube, seemingly holding SIG's head under water demanding they admit there's a problem with the P320/M17/M18, that again, NOBODY had been able to identify!

The Air Force Global Strike Command had paused it's use of the M18 while they performed a safety inspections of all M18 Pistols and a comprehensive investigation of the incident. The following is a copy of the memorandum/order from the General/Commander of the USAF:



The Air Force Global Strike Command completed it's inspection of it's M18 Pistols, as well as the investigation of the incident, and moved on. In the interim, USAF Security Forces carried M4 Rifles. No lapse in Security, and no deficit of leadership whatsoever!

I served on active and later reserve duty as an AF officer with both the Security Forces and the Office of Special Investigations, decades ago. Perhaps the AF has changed considerably in the intervening years due to DEI and the emergence of the internet and social media. In the past senior leadership at all levels put a strong emphasis on getting the facts first before issuing broad directives and press releases. (What we might refer to as cool, calm leadership, not prone to overreact). What is been overlooked here, and elsewhere, is the AF, like the other services, uses the Sig M18 which is a variant of the Sig p320 with an ambidextrous manual safety. While I do not know what the AF manual of arms for the M18 is, I imagine that it calls for the safety to be on when holstered, making it much less prone to the accidental firings so frequently referred to in the media. Thus, I stand by original statement. Please keep in mind that the senior leadership of all the services has become highly politicized so the quote you cite as coming from the AF Global Strike Command could be read as less than objective.

quote:

Originally posted by ArtieS:
So, where does SIG go to get their reputation back?

This IS a significant question! Unfortunately, the Sig hating internet trolls will never give up, even though they're focus has temporarily shifted to Glock's recent decision to avoid local governments bankrupting them.

If you think P320’s are unsafe, where does a Nuclear Airmen rank?

quote:

Originally posted by OttoSig:
If you think P320’s are unsafe, where does a Nuclear Airmen rank?

I see what you did there.

Based on what the original claim about the incident was, i.e., that the pistol fired simply by being “banged down,” it made absolute sense that the local command ordered temporary termination of their use pending an investigation. Regardless of how implausible the claim may have been, it could have been career suicide to just say, “Yeah, didn’t happen that way.”

When my father enlisted in the Army, rifles were kept in unsecured racks in barracks rooms, and in some places that policy continued well into the 1960s, as I witnessed myself. Later, however, after thefts from National Guard armories things became much tighter and policies far more paranoid.

When I was stationed in Germany in the early 1980s, some officers reportedly carried personally-owned replica 1911 pistols to avoid the possibility of a career-ending loss during a difficult field exercise. When a real one was in fact lost, the unit shut down all training and literally had hundreds of men walking miles of dusty and muddy (yes, both at the same time) training area roads in an attempt to find it. I cannot imagine that policies about firearms are any less stringent today.

quote:

Originally posted by uvahawk:

quote:

Originally posted by nhracecraft:
^^ Exactly how/why are you characterizing this as 'poor leadership and management of a crisis' by an AF General? This occurred during the period when the entire weight of the internet (including a significant portion of the 'firearms community' ) were incited into a frenzy by an ever growing group of attention seeking self-appointed experts on YouTube, seemingly holding SIG's head under water demanding they admit there's a problem with the P320/M17/M18, that again, NOBODY had been able to identify!

The Air Force Global Strike Command had paused it's use of the M18 while they performed a safety inspections of all M18 Pistols and a comprehensive investigation of the incident. The following is a copy of the memorandum/order from the General/Commander of the USAF:

The Air Force Global Strike Command completed it's inspection of it's M18 Pistols, as well as the investigation of the incident, and moved on. In the interim, USAF Security Forces carried M4 Rifles. No lapse in Security, and no deficit of leadership whatsoever!

I served on active and later reserve duty as an AF officer with both the Security Forces and the Office of Special Investigations, decades ago. Perhaps the AF has changed considerably in the intervening years due to DEI and the emergence of the internet and social media. In the past senior leadership at all levels put a strong emphasis on getting the facts first before issuing broad directives and press releases. (What we might refer to as cool, calm leadership, not prone to overreact). What is been overlooked here, and elsewhere, is the AF, like the other services, uses the Sig M18 which is a variant of the Sig p320 with an ambidextrous manual safety. While I do not know what the AF manual of arms for the M18 is, I imagine that it calls for the safety to be on when holstered, making it much less prone to the accidental firings so frequently referred to in the media. Thus, I stand by original statement. Please keep in mind that the senior leadership of all the services has become highly politicized so the quote you cite as coming from the AF Global Strike Command could be read as less than objective.

I can't find the link, but it has been posted previously that it is Air Force doctrine for their Security Forces to carry holstered M18 Pistols with a round chambered in the FIRE condition (Safety OFF), so the Safety function could not have mitigated the Air Force incident with the M18 anyway.