Interesting perspective on the Central and North Americas. LaCorte disclaims that he is a 'researcher', not a historian.



Elephants in Rooms - Ken LaCort


682,558 views Sep 16, 2025


"If you were taught the kinder, gentler version of Native Americans, this will open your eyes. We don't honor them by pretending they were eternal victims."
---
"Now, that doesn't make European
settlers the good guys. The frontier was
a clash of two brutal systems, and the result was a cycle of massacres and reprisals that stretched over hundreds of years. Nobody walked away clean from this one"

The diaries of Lewis and Clark regarding the various Indians they encountered are educational. As they were the first Americans to pass through various tribal areas that were still fully tribal culture, the descriptions are valuable.

The tribes were violent, misogynist, undemocratic, abusive to their environment, and dishonest. They were thieves. They were expansionist into neighboring tribal lands. They captured women and children, turning them into their own property. They pimped out their women (including young teens) for favors.

Given the harsh realities of survival they faced, it is understandable, but we shouldn't whitewash the negative aspects of their cultures. Certainly some aspects of their skills and tenacity are admirable.

That's not to say that the government always dealt fairly or honestly with Indians as the inevitable westward expansion unfolded. This isn't an either-or situation.

The book Undaunted Courage by Stephen Ambrose is a good read about the expedition, with many direct quotes from their diaries.

Watched this one the other day. It’s a good one.

In college, I had to fill some sociology credits for my anthropology major. I took a class called “Indian Images,” which was taught by an Awkwesasne Mohawk lady. Super lefty for the time. It was all about the reality of natives vs how they’ve been portrayed over time. The “noble savage” and perpetual victim thing wasn’t talk about at all. I told her what she wanted to hear in my papers and did well in the class, but what I took away from it was that these really were brutal, ruthless people, taken as a whole. There were no good guys in the story, basically.

One story from early European contact that we covered in depth one day was an account of a white family taken prisoner and tortured. They were tied to rocks or posts or something to hold them in place, scalped, and had glowing coals piled on their scalped skulls. Their screaming unsettled and really bothered the Indians who did it, seeing it as dishonorable and a total failure to show how tough and brave they were, so they just killed them out of disgust. Men, women, and children. In class, it was related as a story about how tough natives were (are) and how weak whites were (are). While I can appreciate that it was a mismatch in cultural perspectives and norms, my own was utter revulsion and anger. Even in that class, the professor tried to say it was the whites who took scalps first.

A number of years ago I dated a half Comanche/Irish girl (heck of a mix). Spent some time amongst her family both on and off their reservation (we lived in CT, but went with her to visit a couple of times). They themselves never viewed themselves as the “hippie like people” people said they were nor as “noble savages”.

Those characterizations were invented by white people, both liberals and conservatives, for various reasons.

The duality of man applies to all.

Cortés didn't conquer the Aztecs solely through superior firepower. Understandably miffed about the Aztecs constantly raiding them for sacrifices, the neighboring tribes gave him considerable help.

Good post, Fly-Sig.

Sorry, you guys are about to hear a pet peeve of mine.

Why are they "Native Americans"?

Is it because the people alive today were born on North America?

I was born in Wyoming, just like a bunch of the people being called "Native Americans." Why am I not also a "Native American"?

Because their parents or grandparents were born on North America?

My ancestry in North America dates as far back as the mid-1700s (great-great-great-grandfather).

So all we are arguing about is when your ancestors came to North America?

If you buy into hominid evolution, we all came from Africa, so no one is truly a "Native American."

We are all descendants of Africans, making us all African-Americans.

So the IIDPOL assholes out there, can we drop this labeling bullshit?

Savages gotta savage...by their acts, you shall know them.

What the hell is this "liberal guilt" thing? Why those of European descent haven't gotten credit for human civilization becoming more moral, peaceful, kinder, and prosperous than has ever existed before in recorded and unrecorded history? We should be profoundly proud of what we have accomplished in leading the way!

When you contrast our world, with all its faults and foibles, against any other preexisting conditions, the differences are profoundly in favor of the current realities. That some refuse to admit this speaks only to their own failings. That it isn't universally recognized that the USA is the most worthy of these boggles the mind.

"Minorities" and "native Americans" should be kissing our lily white hairy asses in thanks for all the good that has come to them by our efforts! Even darkest Africa has profited immensely from European "exploitation." To imagine that they could have done better without assistance ignores the lessons of history and observations of ongoing failures.

It isn't the color of one's skin, but the nature of his character, including the culture and traditions that inform it.

Well, the French taught them scalping (that's how to earn the bounty the French paid for killing British/Americans during the French and Indian war) so it's not like Europeans were all just drinking tea with lifted pinkies, but, yeah, 'noble savage' is an oxymoron.

Oh, and slaves? They didn't need to buy any, they just raided neighboring tribes (or, yeah, settlements) for them.

^^^^
Interesting. I didn’t know the origin of scalping.

quote:

Originally posted by joel9507:

Well, the French taught them scalping

That's simply not true. Look it up, the natives were scalping each other for years before a single white European ever showed up.

The French DID pay for scalps yes, but the idea that they "taught" the natives to do this is nonsense.

So, you're countering LaCort's assertion that scalping was part of American Indian culture long before the Europeans arrived?

The westerns of the 40/50/60's rarely painted them as good guys. It's only the recent (70's > and our never ending woke formation that changed the definition.

Excerpted text from here

Archaeologists Show Scalping Predated Columbus

There has been much debate over whether the practice of scalping originated with Native Americans or if it was introduced by Europeans. More on the importance of this debate will be covered later, but the archaeological evidence shows that the practice of scalping predated European contact.

American Antiquity published an article in 1940 which described archaeologists examining Native American skeletons near the Illinois River. One skull was found to have circular incisions around its crown with further cuts in the back corroborating with marks of what would be scalping. This skeleton dated from the Middle Mississippian culture, usually dated to between 700 C.E. to the 1500s.

origins of scalping

A later study published by Plains Anthropologist revealed ancient remains in Nebraska showing that people were scalped and likely survived with massive infections, all predating Columbus. It seems clear from an archaeological standpoint that scalping as a practice had been occurring throughout North America among many tribes with an ancient origin.

According to Rationality and Society, the greatest number of cases occurred in the East, the Plains, and the Southwest.

quote:

Originally posted by smschulz:
It's only the recent (70's > and our never ending woke formation that changed the definition.

quote:

Originally posted by 83v45magna:
origins of scalping

Yup.

A great book is Empire of the Summer Moon: Quanah Parker and the Rise and Fall of the Comanches, the Most Powerful Indian Tribe in American History by Gwynne et al.
Not for the squeamish, though.

quote:

Originally posted by Sig2340:
Sorry, you guys are about to hear a pet peeve of mine.

Why are they "Native Americans"?

Is it because the people alive today were born on North America?

I was born in Wyoming, just like a bunch of the people being called "Native Americans." Why am I not also a "Native American"?

Everyone is a native of somewhere. If you and I are not native to America, where are we native to?

According to current theory, as evidenced by various dna and archeological evidence, the tribes on this continent when Columbus sailed the ocean blue were not the first lineage to inhabit the continent. Those prior inhabitants were replaced by subsequent foreign immigrants. That is, the current "Native Americans" killed off previous "Native Americans" thousands of years ago.

quote:

Originally posted by joel9507:
Well, the French taught them scalping (that's how to earn the bounty the French paid for killing British/Americans during the French and Indian war) so it's not like Europeans were all just drinking tea with lifted pinkies, but, yeah, 'noble savage' is an oxymoron.

Oh, and slaves? They didn't need to buy any, they just raided neighboring tribes (or, yeah, settlements) for them.

I would image that any people who hunted and slaughtered animals on a daily basis would have no issue with chopping any body parts that they fancy from a competitor. Hair, ears, nose, ball sack, etc.

quote:

Originally posted by architect:
Savages gotta savage...by their acts, you shall know them.

What the hell is this "liberal guilt" thing? Why those of European descent haven't gotten credit for human civilization becoming more moral, peaceful, kinder, and prosperous than has ever existed before in recorded and unrecorded history? We should be profoundly proud of what we have accomplished in leading the way!

When you contrast our world, with all its faults and foibles, against any other preexisting conditions, the differences are profoundly in favor of the current realities. That some refuse to admit this speaks only to their own failings. That it isn't universally recognized that the USA is the most worthy of these boggles the mind.

"Minorities" and "native Americans" should be kissing our lily white hairy asses in thanks for all the good that has come to them by our efforts! Even darkest Africa has profited immensely from European "exploitation." To imagine that they could have done better without assistance ignores the lessons of history and observations of ongoing failures.

It isn't the color of one's skin, but the nature of his character, including the culture and traditions that inform it.

I like this post and a significant portion of my ancestry is Indian--feather not dot.

Cortez now strikes me as an early humanitarian for defeating the Aztecs. Western Christian culture dominated and conquered this land for many reasons, and it's not because "everyone was the bad guy". Bullshit.

I've got a family manuscript detailing an attack on the Ohio River on family member back during the colonial days. To say it was savage is a complete understatement. Printed history in school is a freaking lie at best or at least a unicorns version of truth sprinkled with fairy dust.

However, with that said, invaders invade, and those impacted will respond in kind and it will escalate on both side. There are few innocents.