This officer involved shooting from earlier this week is just odd. It’s eerily quiet, and slow. Not what I’m used to seeing.

Perhaps what’s strangest of all, the officer doing the write up actually takes shots, one handed, with the pen he’s writing with still in his (shooting) hand . I mean ... what?! Absolutely horrible shooting.

The first officer (who got the well-placed shots off) hesitated, too. Almost like he was really thinking about it.



Article

quote:

LAS VEGAS (KTNV) - Las Vegas police said during a press conference Monday that the shooting of a suspected DUI driver appears to be a case of "suicide by cop."

Interactive Map: Shootings involving Las Vegas valley officers in 2018

Kenneth Busse Jr., 21, was killed in the shooting last Wednesday near Rainbow Boulevard and Gary Avenue, south of Blue Diamond Road.

Police had responded to a three-vehicle crash around 7:15 a.m. and determined one of the drivers involved appeared to be under the influence of alcohol. He refused a sobriety test and ran off, retrieving a gun he hid earlier in a nearby bush.

Police said Busse then pointed a gun and fired a shot at officers, as seen on the body cameras of the two officers, identified as 52-year-old Kenneth Pilette and 43-year-old Chad Betts.

The two officers fired a total of six shots at Busse. He died of two shots to the chest.

No officers were injured. Pilette has been employed with the LVMPD since July 1998 while Betts since October 1999.

After Assistant Sheriff Tim Kelly told the media that the shooting was apparently suicide by cop, he also said that there are resources for suicide prevention in the community.

Maybe I am misunderstand your POV/question/assessment.

I have been in several life and death situations and although there were differences in many of them (and some being more than a one time event), all of them carry a similar number of "same" events in the process of unfolding and "after the fact" points of clarity.

First is the "is this actually happening/shock"?

Second and almost simultaneous is the "Oh, shit, this is actually happening/shock".


Yeah, it is about as split brain/schizophrenia a mindfuck as you can imagine on a good day of licking acid laced sugar cubes, dropping a tab of "Keep on Trucking" acid, or downing a glass of mushroom tea or some purple haze mescaline.

To someone observing either second hand or by video, yeah, it looks like some unreal slow motion WTF action.


Most people, and cops included, while trained and of the mindset that some SHTF stuff might happen at any given moment, let their guard down, especially after day in/day out same ol' same ol' shit different day routine. Is it smart or prudent? No. But it affects all of us, as it is a human condition to routine.

That said, we have a couple of LEOs in a stop, trying to figure out if a crime or "greater crime" exists, and at the same time trying to make sure they do not step on some "citizen's rights" (am I gonna be in a world of shit because while simply trying to investigate crime and solve crimes, I'll find myself faced with a anti-establishment/cop hating vendetta/sovereign citizen type...) and "bang!" shit gets real.

I watched the video from the perspective of a cop making a stop and trying to see where it goes, while finding the person stopped beginning to act edgy, and yes, the guy does appear slightly impaired, and is now acting a bit oddly. Is it because he is trouble, or because he is medically altered from natural causes (diabetic, etc.) maybe slightly "off" because of his IQ/normal function (you know, what we used to be able to call mentally retarded), maybe drugs or alcohol, or who knows what.

All of that in a few seconds, on the side of the road and all the distractions...

Yeah, every-time, almost anytime, I am going to give the benefit of the doubt to the cop.

In the many years I have traveled this big round marble, I have had multiple encounters with LEO in the U.S. as well as military and LEO in multiple countries. I have never been shot, beaten, or otherwise manhandled and only cuffed and stuffed one time, and for good reason.

As far as I am concerned, given no more than your post and the video, I would give the LEOs involved a 100% "go on about your business" on this.


But, maybe I am missing the point. So, I leave it open to discuss, if I have.

And, yes, I have often "berated" myself for how I reacted in the aforementioned SHTF situations, and found a number of ways I should have been more aware, not caught off guard, reacted better and all that jazz after the fact. I'll "beat myself up" more than anyone else in the MMQB session, every time. And am always thinking of the next "What if..." that can occur. And I have been that way my entire life.

^ I’ll be the first to admit I’m not LEO and I’ve never been in a gunfight.

I’ve seen hundreds of videos like this and this particular one stands out to me as just ... weird.

I’m no expert, believe me.

Why would he shoot one-handed with a pen in his hand? ... it’s probably what you alluded to — his brain didn’t know what to do in the moment.

Now that I know what you are referring to, my observation.

Appears the LEO came upon an accident after the fact, and the "BG" had hidden the gun in the bushes before the LEO arrived.

LEO1 is talking with him, and when the guy turned and headed to the bush, LEO1 called out to LEO2 "Ken", (standing with the other person).

"Ken" is the LEO, at a greater distance and is taken by surprise and only has a second to react to LEO1's "call out" to LEO2. And LEO1 then realizes that the BG is getting the gun. (It would not be expected that he had hidden the gun there, so this is one of those points I stated that are/will result in mind process/confusion in the "moment". LEO2 pulls his gun after the BG has picked up the gun from the bush with the hand holding the pen. The "fine motor skill diminished" effect is likely a factor and the brain goes into muscle memory/training and sympathetic reaction. The pen may have resulted in him not getting a good aim, but I don't know if any of his rounds connected, or what that actual distance was from where he was. But he did react as well as a good number would in similar circumstance.

All of that plays back into the normal and expected method the brain works through what is expected, and how it tries to "solve problems" when given information that does not "make sense" in normal situations.

Couple that with the "routine" and letting down the guard, all of it does process and occur as I would expect it would.

Yes, LEO and other people in high stress, and situations where things can go wrong with dangerous/devastating results are trained and conditioned to be mindful and aware, but humans can only do this for a limited time before they suffer "breakdown" of mental acuity and sharpness.

Given the outcome, they did well as can be expected on the "low end" of the scale.

They survived, shot someone who needed shooting, and did not shoot someone who did not need shooting.

And thanks for helping me see what you saw and the questions you have.

Some of the kid's last words, "Swear to God on my life".

Those were perfect shots.

That officer didn't even flinch, just did his job.

quote:

Originally posted by Mars_Attacks:
Those were perfect shots.

That officer didn't even flinch, just did his job.

Yep..and if Pen cop didn't hit him one handed he sure as hell grazed him. You can see dead guys reaction to the shot.

"The following video contains graphic content that some may find disturbing"

In view of the dead thug outcome.....I find it quite comforting.....

Ken is a honey badger. He's going to finish his report.

Thug picks gun off gun bush? Ken doesn't care. Ken doesn't give a shit. Ken isn't putting down the pen, Ken is going to finish his report.

Be like Ken.

He's heard of cops getting in trouble because of bodycam *failure*.

He's taking notes as a backup, just in case.

He didn't hit anything with his shots except the ground. The other officer scored the hits. Just drop the freakin' pen.

quote:

Originally posted by mrmoneybags:
Ken is a honey badger. He's going to finish his report.

Thug picks gun off gun bush? Ken doesn't care. Ken doesn't give a shit. Ken isn't putting down the pen, Ken is going to finish his report.

Be like Ken.

Failing to make a good transition from something like writing a ticket to shooting is not uncommon. There seems to be some sort of psychological thing at work that keeps us from dropping what we’re holding. I run drills that require dropping an object like a clipboard before engaging a target for that reason.

What’s even odder is that the officer with the pen fires his gun with his middle finger. I’m not sure, though, that his first shot wasn’t a hit. The subject hunches forward when it’s fired as if reacting to a hit. And as we all know here, hitting someone with a pistol bullet is likely to have no more effect than throwing a snowball at him because handguns are such worthless defensive weapons. He could have been hit a dozen times or more before deciding to go down for psychological, not physical reasons.

Looks like Ken is a Motor Officer. The pen is mightier then the sword for most of them.

Both guys seemed like " Oh great, time for a merry little drunk chase through the desert with nowhere to run" until the guy picked up the gun.

Ken should have dropped everything before drawing, obviously. And the guy that scored the hits did exactly what he should have; instead of unleashing the typical shotgun spread flurry of magazine emptying finger flailing fire and and fury, he dropped the guy with a couple of deadly, center of mass show stoppers.

Brains do not transition into HOLYSHIT!!! Super fast for the vast majority of people unless they are constantly conditioned to and or in an environment where HOLYSHIT!!! Happens all the time.

I will give you a normal person example. Have you ever been driving down the highway to work, drinking your coffee, listening to talk radio like you do EVERYDAY? Well then imagine some grandma has mistaken the off ramp for an on ramp and is driving AT YOU at 55mph. I have been there and there seems to be an ETERNITY that passes as your brain argues with itself saying “is this shit really happening, nawwww can’t be happening, nope oh shit it’s happening EVASIVE ACTION HANDS!!!” Then you actually do stuff. As an aside I never dropped or put my coffee down. So I get pen guy.

quote:

Originally posted by mrmoneybags:
Ken is a honey badger. He's going to finish his report.

Thug picks gun off gun bush? Ken doesn't care. Ken doesn't give a shit. Ken isn't putting down the pen, Ken is going to finish his report.

Be like Ken.

Was the pen holder pulling the trigger with his middle finger?

Whatever the case, that pen caused a very awkward looking grip.

Glad the cops came out of it ok.

quote:

Originally posted by thunderson:

quote:

Originally posted by Mars_Attacks:
Those were perfect shots.

That officer didn't even flinch, just did his job.

Yep..and if Pen cop didn't hit him one handed he sure as hell grazed him. You can see dead guys reaction to the shot.

I think the suspect is flinching from the sound of gunfire rather than being grazed.

Good shooting by the other cop.

"Ken" also kept holding paperwork in his left hand while shooting w his right.

Can't really fault him. The BG having a gun behind a bush took both of them by surprise.

Ken reacted and took 2 sec to draw and get a sight pic, then another sec to assess things before firing first shot.

Not sure the BG ever fired a shot.

Ken got the BG's attention and gave the other officer a chance to get back behind cover.

The BG focus on Ken gave the other officer a clear deadly shot.