Got a problem with your neighbor. Fix it on your side of the fence. Don't know if the lady is on the take, but we wouldn't allow Mexican investigations on our soil without our permission. If cartels are invading the United States catch them and drop them into Gitmo.

quote:

Originally posted by P220 Smudge:
Every time I’ve brought up annexing Mexico here, it’s been a whole bunch of posts essentially telling me that I’m an idiot, but actually taking control of the country is the only way we’ll have any hope of actually cleaning out the cartels and the corruption. Everything else is a half measure. Yes, I know it will never happen. Trump’s efforts are for sure better than what we have been doing the last four years, though.

Annexing Mexico?
You mean invading, and declaring war on a sovereign foreign nation? Like Russia did to Ukraine?
How many innocent people would have to die?

The last 34-days, it's blatantly obvious that Trump is playing 3D chess while everyone else is playing checkers. He has more than earned my confidence so I'm just going to sit back and watch this play out.

If everything is as it appears (i.e. the Pres of Mexico is moving to protect the cartels from US intelligence and/or law enforcement) then Trump will sort it out without my opining.

If everything is not as it appears (e.g. this could all be a rouse to keep her alive), a Trump plan w/ Mexico has been in motion for days/weeks and it'll sort itself out without my opining.

I frequently felt "on edge" during the Biden admin as it seemed like they were trying to make the opening to Idiocracy come true. The past 34-days have been pretty relaxing watching event after event turn out better than I ever imagined.

We have sat pics of the top six cartel house locations. It would be too easy to fly a reaper and remove them.

quote:

Originally posted by chellim1:
Annexing Mexico?
You mean invading, and declaring war on a sovereign foreign nation? Like Russia did to Ukraine?
How many innocent people would have to die?

No, not like Russia did with Ukraine. And not like we did with Ukraine in 2014. Not like we did with Libya in 2011. And not like we did with Iraq, or Afghanistan, or Haiti, or Panama, or Grenada, or Nicaragua, or El Salvador, or Argentina, or Chile, or Indonesia, or the Dominican Republic, or Brazil, or the Congo, or Guatemala, or Iran, or any other countries they haven't yet declassified where we orchestrated coups to remove governments that were unfriendly to US business interests. We could offer to make them a protected territory, perhaps even offer statehood in an open vs covert bid to encourage them to overthrow the cartels and then provide all the assistance we're capable of. The pervasive mindset of the Silent Generation who formed the intelligence apparatus and the Baby Boomers who grew up with it and perpetuated it where we play fuck-fuck games everywhere else in the world except our own back yard with the vague justification of it being in the interest of protecting our homeland at the refusal to address the biggest vulnerability and threat to our country directly to our south needs to go away. It hasn't served us much benefit.

Besides, we don't fight like the Russians in the first place. Tell me with a straight face that Ukraine would've last more than a few months against us had we been the invaders bent on taking the whole country.

How many innocent people would have to die? In the long run? Perhaps less than have died and will die to drugs here or the cartel in both countries. Make no mistake, we are already at war with these people. That it doesn't look like a 20th century battlefield doesn't mean we're not fighting against a rogue government that's bent on extracting the wealth of this nation at the cost of American lives. For decades, we've been invaded and infiltrated and we've given an anemic response. If we put half of the wasted money DOGE has uncovered so far into absolutely cleaning out Mexico from stem to stern, we'd be better for it, and far more to show for it.

Whenever I bring this up, everyone says something along the lines of "Mexico has nothing to offer but problems we'd have to solve," but they have massive lithium reserves in Sonora, and significant reserves of gold, silver, copper, zinc, and rare earth elements (what we need to further distance our dependence on China). They're one of the top geothermal producers in the world, which could be maximized for local power so we could barter to extract their massive reserves of oil and natural gas. With a proper infrastructure and legal system, Mexico could provide labor and manufacturing, boosting trade for us if they were a state, all without millions feeling the need to relocate north to find real opportunity - the Mexicans who love Mexico could stay at home. Instead of all wealth flowing south and goods flowing north, it could be an influx of wealth to the whole north American continent with goods flowing outward.

We'd have to pair the total annihilation and rooting out of the cartel operations with actual, serious resources put towards addiction research and treatment for it to be worthwhile, though.

We won't do any of this because it doesn't serve the cartel, and it doesn't serve the powerful business interests in this country that sway our intelligence community to act on their behalf. We won't do any of this because the same entrenched mindset that says we don't/can't buy Greenland also says we respect the sanctity of all established borders and governments... except when they're on the other side of the world.

I know, it's not going to happen. It's what probably should happen, though. Then again, I grew up with a father who was Border Patrol and then DOJ working anti-smuggling doing undercover shit in Mexico, so I have a slightly different perspective on this. His frustration, the frustrations of the guys he worked with about us not being willing to take the gloves off against some truly evil people was a formative thing for me.

I have great hopes for how Trump is going to address things with Mexico resulting in major progress. If anyone in my lifetime was going to affect true change on this front, it will be him.

quote:

Originally posted by goose5:
Got a problem with your neighbor. Fix it on your side of the fence. Don't know if the lady is on the take, but we wouldn't allow Mexican investigations on our soil without our permission. If cartels are invading the United States catch them and drop them into Gitmo.

“If cartels are invading the United States catch them and drop them.”

Fixed it for you.

ETA: It was great to see the Sicario clip again, that came to mind reading this thread. The other clip that came to mind was from some movie that I don't recall. Clearly a cartel meeting, lots of folks milling around at the estate. Vehicle coming up the road. Good guys on the ground a distance away. Don't recall if they were lasing for an LGB (laser guided bomb), or just observing. Think it was a drone overhead, but may have been an aircraft. As the weapon was on the way down, a late arrival showed up on the road or driveway coming in, but too far away. I think that was the end of the clip I saw, but maybe I'm just forgetting the rest. Dunno whether it ended there or I just forgot what happened next.

I hope (and expect) that PDJT is three to three hundred steps ahead of whatever I think is going on with this situation and will come up with a solution that solves the problem with minimal disruption. Whether it involve giving the Mexican government cover so the cartels don't just execute and replace them, smoking the cartels with drones, just hardening the border enough to preclude them causing further problems, I don't know, but I expect PDJT has already thought and planned it out several moves ahead of anything I've imagined. I'll just settle down, enjoy the coffee, and enjoy the winning.

Edited to move the “fixed it for you” version outside the quote. As goose5 pointed out, the way it was done before made it look like the “fixed” version was his words quoted. My bad!

This message has been edited. Last edited by: slosig,

Hasn't this always been a thing? Granted there have been some good people in politics down there that have tried to change things but only to be killed by cartels or factions of them. Sadly, unless someone bigger does something, the cartels will always have power.

quote:

Every time I’ve brought up annexing Mexico here …

The time to do that was 1848. It's Polk's fault.

quote:

Originally posted by chellim1:

How many innocent people would have to die?

Ermaaghaaadd scary emotional words.

How many of our citizens have to die before libs figure out that not using force hasn’t worked. How many Americans have died at the hands of Mexico and Mexicos corrupt policies?

If a “sovereign nation” is complicit in the widespread murder of another’s citizens, does a reasonable person then worry about how many people will perish making it stop? Certainly not. If Russia, China, Iran or North Korea were killing 20 Americans a day, would you be wringing your hands about their Sovereignty? Mexico is likely killing 5 or 10 times that amount each and every day. It’s not different than the Israel Hamas war. You can’t nice words yourself to victory with a third world state

Mexico is a terrorist state. Let’s get on with saving American lives already.

quote:

I know, it's not going to happen. It's what probably should happen, though. Then again, I grew up with a father who was Border Patrol and then DOJ working anti-smuggling doing undercover shit in Mexico, so I have a slightly different perspective on this. His frustration, the frustrations of the guys he worked with about us not being willing to take the gloves off against some truly evil people was a formative thing for me.

I have great hopes for how Trump is going to address things with Mexico resulting in major progress. If anyone in my lifetime was going to affect true change on this front, it will be him.

OK. I understand where you're coming from...
But, as you know, it's not going to happen.

quote:

The time to do that was 1848.

Maybe that's right.

quote:

Originally posted by slosig:
The other clip that came to mind was from some movie that I don't recall.

Clear and Present Danger

And the idea of somehow "obtaining" Mexico is ludicrous.

quote:

Originally posted by AllenInAR:

quote:

Originally posted by slosig:
The other clip that came to mind was from some movie that I don't recall.

Clear and Present Danger

And the idea of somehow "obtaining" Mexico is ludicrous.

Thanks for the Clear and Present Danger confirmation. That occurred to me and I almost said it seemed “Clancy-ish”.

If the second part was directed at me, I have no argument. I’ve been to Mexico and don’t have anything against the place or most of the people, but I can’t imagine taking their challenges on. I would like to see the Cartel problem solved in the most expeditious and least disruptive manner. I’ll trust President Trump to figure out what that is. If it turns out to be a bunch of JDAMs, so be it. Hopefully collateral damage is minimal and cartel eradication is as complete as possible. Whatever PDJT decides on this will likely be the best solution. I’m perfectly okay with waiting to see how he deals with it.

quote:

Originally posted by AllenInAR:
And the idea of somehow "obtaining" Mexico is ludicrous.

The Chinese and Russians love this sentiment. Half this forum was engaged in a feverish circle jerk over Ukrainians blowing up Russians just a few short years ago, but when it comes to the prospect of shoring up our biggest vulnerability to our biggest global rivals, the notion of expanding our own borders is “ludicrous.”

Tell me why, Allen.

Locate the cartel leaders and in one fell swoop take out as many we can. Locate their lab where they make the drugs and blow them up. Figure out what bankers assist the cartels and electronically loot the cartel money. Explain to Sheinbaum that the politicians who are owned by the cartels aare next.

quote:

Originally posted by jljones:

quote:

Originally posted by chellim1:
How many innocent people would have to die?

Ermaaghaaadd scary emotional words.

How many of our citizens have to die before libs figure out that not using force hasn’t worked. How many Americans have died at the hands of Mexico and Mexicos corrupt policies?

If a “sovereign nation” is complicit in the widespread murder of another’s citizens, does a reasonable person then worry about how many people will perish making it stop? Certainly not. If Russia, China, Iran or North Korea were killing 20 Americans a day, would you be wringing your hands about their Sovereignty? Mexico is likely killing 5 or 10 times that amount each and every day. It’s not different than the Israel Hamas war. You can’t nice words yourself to victory with a third world state

Mexico is a terrorist state. Let’s get on with saving American lives already.

Well, by all means then...
If it's no different than the Israel Hamas war, where no "two-state solution" is possible, then let's get on with it.
Let's go "Annex" Mexico!

Half of them are already on some sort of welfare anyway, while sending "remittances" back to Mexico. We could solve several problems at once. Besides, they'd stop bitching about calling it the Gulf of America.

Read "Narcoland: The Mexican Drug Lords And Their Godfathers". It lays it all out. It names names. The head of the federal anti-kidnapping team was also a leader of the largest kidnapping group. The generals in charge of anti cartel ops were feeding info to their cartel masters. We need a wall the length of the border with lights and towers and cameras. We need drones and guys in jeeps with rifles.

quote:

Originally posted by slosig:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by goose5:
Got a problem with your neighbor. Fix it on your side of the fence. Don't know if the lady is on the take, but we wouldn't allow Mexican investigations on our soil without our permission. If cartels are invading the United States catch them and drop them.

If you wish to "fix it for me" please do so outside the quote feature. Your requote attributed to me is not accurate.

quote:

Originally posted by P220

The Chinese and Russians love this sentiment. Half this forum was engaged in a feverish circle jerk over Ukrainians blowing up Russians just a few short years ago, but when it comes to the prospect of shoring up our biggest vulnerability to our biggest global rivals, the notion of expanding our own borders is “ludicrous.”

Tell me why, Allen.

1) You really think Mexico would say "Hell yeah, we'll be states 51-82!"?
2) Assuming/Predicting they don't say that, how would we force that to happen? What was the old SAC motto, "When Diplomacy Fails"?
3) Assuming we have to resort to military action, how exactly do you think that would play out? I'm thinking Viet Nam with tacos.

And for the record, I don't think we should have been fucking around with the Russians in Ukraine either. That shitshow was of "our" own making, but if you think we've sunk too much treasure there, I'd wager it'd look like chump change compared to invading/occupying/pacifying Mexico.

How about we build a secure border/wall, revamp our immigration procedures, let Border Patrol, ICE, etc do their jobs, and maybe let the SOCOM kids loose on the cartels.

quote:

Originally posted by goose5:
If you wish to "fix it for me" please do so outside the quote feature. Your requote attributed to me is not accurate.

My apologies, and thank you for pointing that out. I believe I’ve fixed it, and I appreciate you pointing out the error. Thanks.