You have probably seen the news accounts of the Black big rig driver who refused to pull over for a missing mud flap. I am not raising the issue of the local cop releasing the dog after the driver exited his vehicle and raised his hands. What I am curious about is something the driver said when one of the officers asked why he didn't pull over. He responded that he thought he was going to be shot by the officers. There is absolutely no way the driver was going to get away driving that big rig. None. He had to have known that. Yet he still chose to flee from a routine stop. You can say he is stupid, but I actually got the impression he was serious. Of course I could be wrong.

Everybody with an ounce of sense is going to know the world of hurt that would come down on any officer who shoots an unarmed Black man. The officer can expect to see his picture on CNN. A grand jury review. And a ton of other stuff that's going to come crashing down on the officer. I can't imagine that virtually any officer would want this for himself and would do everything they can to see that doesn't happen.

I'm not referring to a suspect fleeing from a serious crime. I'm referring to someone fleeing from a routine small potatoes stop. How often do suspects choose to flee rather than comply with a routine stop? And when they are caught, do they claim they were afraid they would be shot? Are they genuinely afraid? Or is it bull shit?

Around here, they flee because they know we can’t chase them for small potatoes. Sometimes we get lucky and catch them later. I’d say we usually don’t, unless the helicopter is up or the officer gets a good plate and can ID them.

As far as fearing being gunned down? Horseshit. They don’t want to play by the house rules. And often they beat the house. Even when they get caught. It’s a crazy world.

Any excuse to act like a bad guy.
Or coached by their momma / lawyer.

It boils down to seriously bad decision making based upon lies, myths, hate, politics, the possibility of winning the ghetto lottery, etc etc etc.

I wouldn't doubt most have seen the Chris Rock public service announcement to blacks. The main message is don't do stupid schtuff.

I've worked 2 jurisdictions in my 28.5 years on the street, and I've never chased anyone who was afraid I was going to shoot them - they didn't want to get a ticket and/or didn't want to go to jail for one reason or another.

If over 90% of that culture continue to vote leftward, believing they are bettering themselves and their communities, well...that's who we're dealing with here. Sadly, ignorance is promoted AND rewarded. Also, sadly, the hope of winning the ghetto lottery is strong.

In my career, none of them were afraid that we(the cops) would shoot them.

They ran because they knew they had warrants. Or didn’t have a license(something you’d get a ticket for and be on your way)

Or they ran because running had led to them getting away in the past.

Policies were changing before I retired in 17, due to the department becoming woke. Soon it was on the street that all they had to do was not stop and we (city) wouldn’t chase. It was implemented slowly, initially there was a policy that only officers who had completed the NCSHP driving course could chase. Then they quit sending people to the class. Then a year later or so, er Al word was handed down not to chase. Then policy in writing changed.

Glad I moved away to Texas-cause from what I hear the city has gone to hell. Last time I was there I didn’t see one police car-anywhere. Apparently they just respond to calls for service and aren’t proactive anymore.

It befuddles my brain to try and figure it out... even with the wrongly in my opinion perceived view that all cops are racist looking to shoot a black man... in most of these cases they know who you are and so running or trying to get away is not going to end well. I had the very good opportunity 45 years ago the one time I was arrested to get away, there was no way that fat sheriffs deputy was going to catch me that night if I decided to take off. I was smart enough even at that age to know if I did it was not going to end well.. they knew who I was and where the hell was I going to go and hide for how long?

Oh and one thing always pops up in my mind when ever I see or hear the term... " he was unarmed". just exactly when did they determine he was unarmed? There is no way to know if someone is or isn't armed... and there are some of us who can draw from concealed and put two rounds to center mass in less than 2 seconds. And I'm actually slow. I'd bet there are people who can do it so fast, the draw and fire, it would not even be caught on video.

No.
It’s simply the buzz word excuse to use especially now that they know everything (for the most part) is on body camera. They think and often do get a sympathetic prosecutor or jury and at least get rid of the fleeing charge.
It’s complete nonsense and they use it when they flee on foot as well.

I am not a law enforcement officer however, this kind of reminds me of the "I cant breath " people start screaming as soon as an officer starts the arrest process.

I watched a news report where people were screaming this while they were standing as the police officer was putting the hand cuffs on them as tho they think the officer is going to just let them go.

quote:

Originally posted by ftttu:
It boils down to seriously bad decision making based upon lies, myths, hate, politics, the possibility of winning the ghetto lottery, etc etc etc.

That just about sums it up .

My closest friend was a MSP Trooper for 20 years. He made the following statement to me once.

"Once you have someone in custody, often at first contact, the verbiage that drips out the hole under their nose has one purpose... to cast doubt on anything I am doing, or try and get them a better chance of getting off or a reduced judgement in court."

Followed by...

"Remember, the criminal justice system has nothing to do with protecting the citizens from criminals, it is all about protecting the criminals from the police"

If you run, you should get the beating of your life. You know you’ve got it comin’.

no, they fear jail.

I suspect the reason given for running began as an excuse and became an urban rumor that too many believe. The crooks knew it was a lie. The average citizen should have known it was a lie.

My experience is that many live in a different world than you or I. A criminal world. I once arrested a dude for a business burglary and was struck by how matter of fact he was. Even after a very risky pursuit and crash. I ran his history and it showed a long string of arrests and jail time. He was closed mouth but polite and cooperative once the cuffs were on. On the way to jail, I asked him if he ever got tired of being arrested. Here was his response:
"No I dont. Its what I do. I am a criminal. You are a cop and you do what you do. I am the same".
And this mindset crosses all racial lines.

quote:

Originally posted by YooperSigs:
My experience is that many live in a different world than you or I. A criminal world. I once arrested a dude for a business burglary and was struck by how matter of fact he was. Even after a very risky pursuit and crash. I ran his history and it showed a long string of arrests and jail time. He was closed mouth but polite and cooperative once the cuffs were on. On the way to jail, I asked him if he ever got tired of being arrested. Here was his response:
"No I dont. Its what I do. I am a criminal. You are a cop and you do what you do. I am the same".
And this mindset crosses all racial lines.

He was/is a professional criminal, and perhaps a different breed than many. While you can't respect his criminality, you can sort of appreciate his matter-of-fact acceptance of the world he has chosen to live in. At least he is honest with himself and us about his choices.

That reminds me of the restaurant scene in Heat between DeNiro and Pacino.....

quote:

Originally posted by HRK:
That reminds me of the restaurant scene in Heat between DeNiro and Pacino.....

That's a discussion between two professional.

Most regular street criminals haven't given what they do enough thought to work out a set of ethics

During my 28 year career, I'm interacted with both and the differences are immediately apparent

No. It's a ruse and an excuse to try to beat charges. 99.9% of the time if there is a use of force, it is the citizen that decided if force will be used by resisting or attempting to flea. You don't beat charges on the side of the road, you beat them in court.

The very small minority of officers that are looking to give a beat down usually get run out of the profession rather quickly, either through administrative sanctions or by fellow officers suggesting they seek life elsewhere.

There is another, thankfully thin slice, of the pie chart who constantly escalate things because they're unsure of their abilities, have had shit training or are just plain afraid. They're the "fear biters" of LE.

quote:

Originally posted by 9mmepiphany:

quote:

Originally posted by HRK:
That reminds me of the restaurant scene in Heat between DeNiro and Pacino.....

That's a discussion between two professional.

Most regular street criminals haven't given what they do enough thought to work out a set of ethics

During my 28 year career, I'm interacted with both and the differences are immediately apparent

Which is what Yoopersigs post eluded to, more about, professional criminal and professional LEO.

No doubt there are multitudes of criminals a you describe....

quote:

Originally posted by Fed161:
Everybody with an ounce of sense is going to know the world of hurt that would come down on any officer who shoots an unarmed Black man.

Yet most of the shootings of black AND white suspects, unarmed in the end, these guys have been non-compliant in the arrest process, doing stupid shit with their hands; reaching behind their back when told repeatedly not to. Or running away and reaching into their pocket or waistband. Etc. Etc. Non-compliance is the common thread for these shootings, and yes, it is a vicious cycle of bad behavior. IMO, in young black culture, taking orders from authority figures is something they despise and cannot deal with well.