I'm a huge WW2 nerd, and one of the things I love about studying the war is that no matter how much I think I know already, there's always some new detail to discover.

For example, in doing some reading today on the British airborne component of Operation Market-Garden (of "A Bridge Too Far" fame), I learned something new: There were actually a handful of Americans fighting alongside the Brits at Arnhem.

It turns out that among the approximately 10,300 Brits that made up the 1st British Airborne Division at Arnhem, there were 10 Americans as well: Lieutenant Geddes, Lieutenant Johnson, Sergeant Jones, Corporal Dale Thatcher, Paul S. Benton, Gino Berardino, Albert A. Dunn, Robert Evans, James Leu, and Milton Ostern.

These were members of the USAAF 306th Fighter Control Squadron, split into two teams of 5 men each. These teams were meant to act as air support liasons between the USAAF fighter/bombers of the 2nd Tactical Air Force and the British paratroopers on the ground. These men wore American uniforms, but reportedly removed their American patches.

They were attached to the British 1st Airborne Division HQ, and arrived in 4 Waco gliders as part of the first wave of landings on September 17th. Each team was outfitted with one standard Jeep and one "Veep", a Jeep with an installed SCR-193 VHF radio system.



Unfortunately, they ran into problems immediately upon arrival. It appears that the radio sets had been delivered with the wrong crystals, and were unable to be tuned to the correct frequencies. The men reportedly only just acquired the Veeps a short time before they were loaded onto gliders and departed for Holland, so they did not have time to check their equipment. Due to these technical issues they were not able to make any effective contact with their radio sets once they landed. In addition, the lumbering Veeps made tempting targets. Even if the radios had been functional, both Veeps were knocked out by German mortar or artillery fire within the first day or so.

The Americans fought on for 8 days, with most of them being wounded, until they ran out of food and ammunition. 9 of the men were forced to surrender on the morning of September 26th. Only one of them - Lieutenant Johnson - was able to escape Arnhem alongside scattered remnants of the British paratrooper units and make his way safely back to allied lines.

quote:

but reportedly removed their American patches.

I would love to know their reasoning behind this.

Operation Market Garden. Wasn't that one of Montgomery's not so brilliant plans?

quote:

Originally posted by Skull Leader:

quote:

but reportedly removed their American patches.

I would love to know their reasoning behind this.

You don't want to be the shiny fish when surrounded by barracuda.

But wouldn't that make them spies if captured by the Germans?

quote:

Originally posted by sjtill:
But wouldn't that make them spies if captured by the Germans?

They were still in uniform. Taking off patches, such as unit ones was common practice if possibility of capture was high.

As long. As they were in uniform they are not spies. They would have to be in civilian clothes to be shot as spies.

Wonder how they faired afture capture?

quote:

Originally posted by jsbcody:

quote:

Originally posted by sjtill:
But wouldn't that make them spies if captured by the Germans?

They were still in uniform. Taking off patches, such as unit ones was common practice if possibility of capture was high.

The patches probably ID'ed them as belonging to the ground to air commo unit, and that would have led to a more thorough interrogation after capture.

quote:

Originally posted by ArLEOret:
Wonder how they faired afture capture?

At least two, Corporal Thatcher and Sergeant Jones, are known to have survived captivity.

You can read a bit more about Corporal Thatcher here: http://www.pegasusarchive.org/pow/dale_thatcher.htm

quote:

Originally posted by GWbiker:
Operation Market Garden. Wasn't that one of Montgomery's not so brilliant plans?

One of them, yes.

That's a point that the movie doesn't cover. That is one of my favorites. Bunch of back then not to well known stars but later very well known. Just to name two; Sean Connery and Robert Redford and then there was the one who played the Polish General.

quote:

Originally posted by SIG 229R:
and then there was the one who played the Polish General.

Gene Hackman played General Stanisław Sosabowski.

quote:

Originally posted by SIG 229R:
That's a point that the movie doesn't cover. That is one of my favorites. Bunch of back then not to well known stars but later very well known. Just to name two; Sean Connery and Robert Redford and then there was the one who played the Polish General.

IMO, there were WAY too many stars which detracted from the plot. Robert Redford! Elliott Gould! Gene Hackman! Ryan O'Neill!

Sean Connery was fine, Anthony Hopkins (not real famous back then) was great, the rest of the cameo stars could have replaced with other actors and IMO would have made for a better movie.

Cool. Great info-

Just finished reading 'All The Way To Berlin' by James Magellas.

https://www.amazon.com/All-Way...Europe/dp/0891418369

Have you ever read it? He was in the 82nd ABN and jumped into Market Garden (discussed in detail...) He really has nothing good to say about Monty's armor in Holland. Great book.

The scene - where the 82nd guys were paddling across the river in those crappy collapsible boats - he was there in the first 'wave' of boats getting shot to hell by German MGs and 20mm guns.

He killed a lot of Germans personally and is not ashamed to say he was good at it and took pride in it. His feats are confirmed by 504th PIR Regimental and 82nd Division records and his decorations: Purple Heart, Bronze Star, Silver Star and DSC. Absolute beast.

I was in the 504th in the 90s so I love reading about ABN ops.

-------------------------------------------

In an episode of band of brothers Captain Nixon is portrayed as coming back from a jump, presumably market garden, where he is the only member of his airplane to survive. I believe that was the beginning of the his desent into drinking which ultimately gets him demoted.

quote:

Originally posted by Shaql:
In an episode of band of brothers Captain Nixon is portrayed as coming back from a jump, presumably market garden, where he is the only member of his airplane to survive. I believe that was the beginning of the his desent into drinking which ultimately gets him demoted.

No, they jumped on Market Garden, but not on the same DZ / target - they jumped near Eindhoven, while the Brits jumped deeper into Arnhem.

It was one of the later American jumps that Nixon took part of, but not the rest of the unit.

Here is the info about Nixon's 3rd combat jump -

"On March 24, 1945, Nixon was assigned by Major General Maxwell Taylor, the Commanding General (CG) of the 101st, to be an observer with Major General William Miley's 17th Airborne Division during Operation Varsity, the airborne crossing of the river Rhine. Nixon's plane took a direct hit and only he and three others got out. He is also one of very few men in the 101st to earn three Combat Jump Stars on his Jump Wings.

The movie happens to be on tonight, on MGM-HD. I spotted a young John Ratzenberger in the scenes before the river crossing.

There's a really cool museum there, worth seeing if you're in the area.

quote:

Originally posted by Sig209:
Cool. Great info-

Just finished reading 'All The Way To Berlin' by James Magellas.

https://www.amazon.com/All-Way...Europe/dp/0891418369

Have you ever read it? He was in the 82nd ABN and jumped into Market Garden (discussed in detail...) He really has nothing good to say about Monty's armor in Holland. Great book.

The scene - where the 82nd guys were paddling across the river in those crappy collapsible boats - he was there in the first 'wave' of boats getting shot to hell by German MGs and 20mm guns.

He killed a lot of Germans personally and is not ashamed to say he was good at it and took pride in it. His feats are confirmed by 504th PIR Regimental and 82nd Division records and his decorations: Purple Heart, Bronze Star, Silver Star and DSC. Absolute beast.

I was in the 504th in the 90s so I love reading about ABN ops.


-------------------------------------------

I met him once and talked to him for quite a while. I was traveling TAD and was in DFW airport waiting for my next flight. He had a stand set up and was selling his book, there wasn't anyone around so he struck up a conversation.

We talked for maybe 45 minutes to an hour about current events and his experiences in WW2. I bought his book and he signed it for me along with a nice comment.

I was kind of bummed I had to leave and catch my flight, I could have talked to him the rest of the day.

Oh, I really enjoyed reading the book also.