Two different people are exposed to a horrific, traumatic situation. One person is deeply troubled after. The other wonders about lunch. The intelligence levels are similar with both individuals. Both have similar life experience. What makes them different? Is the different dealings with internal stress hereditary or environmental? What makes the difference?

Both survive the horrific event. One is troubled by it. The other is not affected by it.

Thoughts?

They may appear to have similar life experience, but everyone learns something different. Nobody goes to the same war even if they're in the same unit.

I would say it may well have both influences. And even identical twins who live together their formative years eventually have different experiences, or at least different perceptions of shared ones. Expectations of others can also have an influence.

flashguy

quote:

What makes the difference?

I believe the most simplistic response ("we are not clones of each other regardless of similarities") is as accurate as I can verbalize.

Answer to your question requires indevidual nuanced complexities to 'be equal' while observation demonstrates such is simply not a functional reality. Shared training, education & personal beliefs may suggest clusters of similarities.

Genetics and environmental experiences. There are differences among siblings. From a clinical viewpoint we do not understand why some soldiers develop Post Traumatic Stress Disorder while others do not. There is no way we can inoculate against this sort of thing. The rate of PTSD is much higher in Gulf War Veterans than previous conflicts. I think we have all met stone cold killers. They do exist, and some even enjoy the experience of taking a human life.

I think both, but more towards they were born with it.

Some people have a bit more sociopath characteristics.

To answer the OP's question, I think it's partially hereditary, but it's also weighing the outcome of the choices and choosing to take the path that leads to a better life.

I've shared this story a few times during my 15 years at Sigforum.

I met Bob shortly after moving to SoCal. Bob was the teacher for an adult Sunday School class, and about the 3rd week I attended he shared with the class that his only brother had committed suicide that week.

Then, Bob started sharing about his childhood. His Dad was frequently unemployed, abused alcohol, abused drugs, and in his late 30s committed suicide.

On Bob's brother's 18th birthday, his Dad caught him and his friends smoking weed. Instead of acting like a normal parent and punishing his brother, his Dad said if you think weed is great you should try heroin and proceeded to teach his brother how to shoot up heroin.

Bob's brother grew up to be frequently unemployed, abuse alcohol, and abuse drugs. He told Bob several times over the years, "considering our father, how could I turn out any other way?" When he committed suicide, he was approximately the same age as his Dad was when he committed suicide.

Bob shared a little about how different he was from his brother. The last words that Bob said that Sunday school class stuck with me, "considering my father, how could I turn out any other way?"

As I got to know Bob over my 3 years in SoCal, I learned that he excelled in school, excelled in sports, earned a PhD, became a respected professor at a conservative university, became a leader in his church, married a great gal, etc. He seemed to repeatedly make the conscious and subconscious decision to take the opposite path his father would take.

I'm adopted and first met my full blooded bio sibs after 45 years. Never knew them or who they were and vice versa. I was raised in one part of the country and they in an opposite place. Upper middle class with post graduate v. lower middle class with college. It's the classic environmental, nature and nurtue argument.

The first time we all met there were striking and noticeable similarities in how we did things, joked and thought. In the following years it was obvious to use that nature played a much larger role than nurture.

quote:

Originally posted by Nismo:
Some people have a bit more sociopath characteristics.

Interesting. I didn't expect to see sociopath. What makes you say that versus somebody that gets stuck in one of the early stages of processing a tramatic situation and doesn't move past it?

I was once a fan of B.F. Skinner (all behavior is learned). We've learned a lot about how the brain works since the turn of the century that it's kind of embarrassing. We know a lot more is about hardwiring now than we once thought. I'm in LE peer support and I've seen some of that spectrum. Some folks are just blessed with an exceptional rationale and not overly burdened by anxiety.

The hereditary aspect must be very strong - but it can get inputs not just from parents.
As an example, my niece is nothing like her mum (my sister), but with regards to character, she's so similar to me its spooky.
It's not like I was a huge influence on her growing up - she just gravitates to the same things which I do. Then again, she's very artistic and creative - and she certainly doesn't get that from my me or my sis - that's all from my dad.

I've wondered this same question.

My aunts and uncles along with my mom mostly had 2 children each. Very different parenting styles, lifestyles, childhood experiences and we are all completely different than our respective siblings.

I will note however that just because it appears someone is handling a situation a certain way and "is not affected by it" may not mean that is true at all. They may not even realize how much they are being affected by it.

I think it boils down to a mixture of everything.

- How you are naturally wired (hereditary perhaps but not always)
- The way you learned to deal with things from your upbringing and mimicking those around you
- The lesson you learn in adult life and incorporate into what you already know
- Your current situation dictates how much a new event can affect you

There are so many variables that I am not smart enough to notice or even recall.

I believe we are born a blank slate upon which we are written.

From my own perspective...

When I first joined the Marines, I would volunteer for any risky thing I could find... I was a total adrenaline junkie! Australian repelling? Yes! Point man making entry? Yes! Being shot at but missed? Could've been closer.

After getting married to my missing piece, that changed in a big way. Those things weren't fun anymore, because I now knew what I could've missed, or what I'd have left behind.

My PTSD didn't come from the events themselves, but the situation I was in when the event happened.

 
I believe both affect us. I look just like my late Father, and seem to have also inherited his limited OCD. Otherwise, I am different in many ways, which I attribute to environment.
 
Haven't there been studies on identical twins separated at birth, who turned out very different, except for appearance and other physical characteristics?

I think it is interesting and probably related as to how people react to emergency situations. Some people freeze, some people panic, others get busy helping; all to varying degrees of course.

Lived experience(s) is the difference.
Not all of it. But, a lot of it.

As stated by many thus far, it’s either or both.

There are countless examples that demonstrate how humans differ in their reactions to anything because of innate differences and/or life experiences.

One of the most extreme examples of indoctrination’s being able to affect conduct that I read about was the book Ordinary Men: Reserve Police Battalion 101 and the Final Solution in Poland by Christopher Browning. That book documented how a diverse group of German policemen became capable of murdering countless men, women, and children. As the title indicates, they were “ordinary” in most ways, and if there were any sociopaths in the group there would have been no more than in any similar number. And because they were somewhat older, they had not been subject to the same Nazi indoctrination as, for example, the members of the Hitler Youth, nor would they have been as susceptible to such propaganda.

Or consider the actions of the Japanese army in World War II. Its atrocities were not all committed by mentally ill men.

On the other hand, we know that some people are capable of avoiding the psychological effects of traumatic or highly stressful events without any special training or conditioning. I often think about my own reaction to the first significant criminal case I was involved with investigating. Some men are raised with a strong “Be a man!” admonition, but that’s not true of everyone who shows no emotional response to events that affect others much differently.

There can be no question that brains are “hard wired” far differently among humans (and other animals). If there can be differences in things like musical talent or the ability to play chess well, it’s no surprise that we can differ in our responses to traumatic events.

quote:

Originally posted by jljones:
Two different people are exposed to a horrific, traumatic situation. One person is deeply troubled after. The other wonders about lunch. The intelligence levels are similar with both individuals. Both have similar life experience. What makes them different? Is the different dealings with internal stress hereditary or environmental? What makes the difference?

Both survive the horrific event. One is troubled by it. The other is not affected by it.

Thoughts?

Not sure if it’s hereditary or environmental. Take my sister and me. Same genetics. Raised in the same house. Great family, super wholesome upbringing. Our mom was a best friend to both of us. When I was 22, and my sister was 28, our mom died. It wasn’t like a car wreck, where she was just gone. She had some surgeries to fix a fused spine from the 50’s (polio survivor). Anyways, there were complications with one of the surgeries, and she kept going back to the hospital for a few days here and there. Long and short, her lungs gave out and she died.

While this was a pretty traumatic event for everyone, I did as my mom had asked. I live each day for her. Her exact words (written) “You’re not the one dying, I am. You go and live your life to the best everyday.”

So while I took a week off of work, I went back. I worked, I found a better job, six months later I moved to Dallas, etc. I lived my life.

My sister completely shut down. She couldn’t cope with it, and still can’t. She ended up quitting the great job she had. She has a college degree, and has worked probably 20 jobs in the last 25 years. There was a period where she didn’t work at all. She completely changed and it happened when our mom died.

I think some people are just different. My sister is a great person, but the day my mom died, a huge part of my sister died as well.

of course -- history has shown this to be the case

plus humans are incredibly adaptable

we can be trained to 'tolerate' quite extreme conditions - environmental / psychological, etc

if you have enough kids it will likely play out: two might be the same... but if you have 3, 4 or 5 or 6... one or two will likely be quite different from a temperament standpoint... even though raised by the same parents / environment (my experience anyway...)

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