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After Topping Ford, Tesla's Stock Value Overtakes GM Login/Join 
Mired in the
Fog of Lucidity
posted
OK, here's one for the market gurus. How is this possible? Is this simply a case that Tesla is just the best car company ever (mild sarcasm), or rather is there a better case to be made about the absolute irrationality of the market? I'm betting on the latter. Investors must be simply orgasmic over Tesla.


http://www.foxbusiness.com/mar...ue-overtakes-gm.html



http://www.cnbc.com/2017/04/04...igh-stock-price.html


http://www.nasdaq.com/symbol/tsla/stock-chart
 
Posts: 4850 | Registered: February 10, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
I believe in the
principle of
Due Process
Picture of JALLEN
posted Hide Post
What could go wrong? It seldom has earnings, is selling for ~10 times book value and a forward P/E ratio of 115.

There must be a lot of potential!




Luckily, I have enough willpower to control the driving ambition that rages within me.

When you had the votes, we did things your way. Now, we have the votes and you will be doing things our way. This lesson in political reality from Lyndon B. Johnson

"Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible." - Justice Janice Rogers Brown
 
Posts: 48369 | Location: Texas hill country | Registered: July 04, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Mired in the
Fog of Lucidity
posted Hide Post
quote:
There must be a lot of potential!




God, I guess! It's reminiscent of the dot com valuations/bubble from the late 90's.

I wonder if Buffett is a shareholder?
 
Posts: 4850 | Registered: February 10, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Cruising the
Highway to Hell
Picture of 95flhr
posted Hide Post
I don't get the current stock prices or valuation at all. It seems pretty irrational to me for a toy.
Any car that only has a range of 200-300 miles and takes hours to refuel, is a toy and not a serious transportation option in my life.




“Government exists to protect us from each other. Where government has gone beyond its limits is in deciding to protect us from ourselves.”
― Ronald Reagan

Retired old fart
 
Posts: 6541 | Location: Near the Beaverdam in VA | Registered: February 13, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of 2BobTanner
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Ford sold over 6 million vehicles last year; Tesla sold less 75,000 last year.

Tesla is an electronics company which makes batteries and sells cars as a side business.


---------------------
DJT-45/47 MAGA !!!!!

"Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it." — Mark Twain

“Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard.” — H. L. Mencken
 
Posts: 2825 | Location: Falls of the Ohio River, Kain-tuk-e | Registered: January 13, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of grumpy1
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The Amazon of auto manufacturers. Some day profits will be HUGE. HUGE, I tell you. Get in on the ground floor!
 
Posts: 9910 | Location: Northern Illinois | Registered: March 20, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Partial dichotomy
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by 95flhr:
I don't get the current stock prices or valuation at all. It seems pretty irrational to me for a toy.
Any car that only has a range of 200-300 miles and takes hours to refuel, is a toy and not a serious transportation option in my life.


If driven carefully, it can exceed that mileage and it can be charged more quickly, depending on the charging stations. I'm not a Tesla fan boy, but have driven one and know someone who has a management position within the company. They really are a fantastic car, but wonder how the company will move ahead from this point. The only chance they have is marketing their new, less expensive model and get serious interest in it.




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Posts: 39431 | Location: SC Lowcountry/Cape Cod | Registered: November 22, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
10mm is The
Boom of Doom
Picture of Fenris
posted Hide Post
Elon Musk is a super genius and will prove all the nay sayers to be blind idiots. Musk says Tesla will be expanding operations into the highly profitable snake oil and unicorn fart markets.




God Bless and Protect the Once and Future President, Donald John Trump.
 
Posts: 17593 | Location: Northern Virginia | Registered: November 08, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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posted Hide Post
We are very backward in the Yoop. I have yet to see one here.


End of Earth: 2 Miles
Upper Peninsula: 4 Miles
 
Posts: 16476 | Location: Marquette MI | Registered: July 08, 2014Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Cruising the
Highway to Hell
Picture of 95flhr
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by 6guns:
quote:
Originally posted by 95flhr:
I don't get the current stock prices or valuation at all. It seems pretty irrational to me for a toy.
Any car that only has a range of 200-300 miles and takes hours to refuel, is a toy and not a serious transportation option in my life.



If driven carefully, it can exceed that mileage and it can be charged more quickly, depending on the charging stations. I'm not a Tesla fan boy, but have driven one and know someone who has a management position within the company. They really are a fantastic car, but wonder how the company will move ahead from this point. The only chance they have is marketing their new, less expensive model and get serious interest in it.


According to their website, I think I read at the rapid charge station you get 52 miles of charge per hour of charging. That is not a quick charge at all in my mind.




“Government exists to protect us from each other. Where government has gone beyond its limits is in deciding to protect us from ourselves.”
― Ronald Reagan

Retired old fart
 
Posts: 6541 | Location: Near the Beaverdam in VA | Registered: February 13, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Big Stack
posted Hide Post
Ford's the past, Tesla's the future. At least that's what the market thinks. The market is a leading indicator. The value is based on the prediction of future earnings, not current earnings.

I see them all the time.

quote:
Originally posted by YooperSigs:
We are very backward in the Yoop. I have yet to see one here.
 
Posts: 21240 | Registered: November 05, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Partial dichotomy
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by 95flhr:
quote:
Originally posted by 6guns:
quote:
Originally posted by 95flhr:
I don't get the current stock prices or valuation at all. It seems pretty irrational to me for a toy.
Any car that only has a range of 200-300 miles and takes hours to refuel, is a toy and not a serious transportation option in my life.



If driven carefully, it can exceed that mileage and it can be charged more quickly, depending on the charging stations. I'm not a Tesla fan boy, but have driven one and know someone who has a management position within the company. They really are a fantastic car, but wonder how the company will move ahead from this point. The only chance they have is marketing their new, less expensive model and get serious interest in it.


According to their website, I think I read at the rapid charge station you get 52 miles of charge per hour of charging. That is not a quick charge at all in my mind.


That's from a typical home charger. If you read a bit further down on that same page you'll see this:

On the Road
Supercharging
Stay charged while you’re on the road using the Tesla Supercharger network. Placed along well travelled highways, a Supercharger provides up to 170 miles of range in as little as 30 minutes




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Posts: 39431 | Location: SC Lowcountry/Cape Cod | Registered: November 22, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
10mm is The
Boom of Doom
Picture of Fenris
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by 6guns:
Stay charged while you’re on the road using the Tesla Supercharger network. Placed along well travelled highways, a Supercharger provides up to 170 miles of range in as little as 30 minutes

I get impatient at the gas pump after 3 minutes, and that gets me 600 miles.




God Bless and Protect the Once and Future President, Donald John Trump.
 
Posts: 17593 | Location: Northern Virginia | Registered: November 08, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
come and take it
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by 2BobTanner:
Ford sold over 6 million vehicles last year; Tesla sold less 75,000 last year.

Tesla is an electronics company which makes batteries and sells cars as a side business.


It is crazy to think Tesla could be valued more than GM or Ford. One of the biggest factors is Tesla does not have the burden of owing a hundred thousand or more retired employees a pension and healthcare benefits.

It all seems crazy, but then again I bought a few shares and I am up over 45% in the last year, and my latest project assigned at work was to install an electric vehicle charging station.




I have a few SIGs.
 
Posts: 1971 | Location: Texan north of the Red River | Registered: November 05, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
Picture of TigerDore
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Sigmanic:

God, I guess! It's reminiscent of the dot com valuations/bubble from the late 90's.

Almost every decade has had an irrational bubble among a certain group of stocks. You'd think the professional stock brokers would learn.



.
 
Posts: 9075 | Registered: September 26, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
I believe in the
principle of
Due Process
Picture of JALLEN
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by BBMW:
Ford's the past, Tesla's the future. At least that's what the market thinks. The market is a leading indicator. The value is based on the prediction of future earnings, not current earnings.

I see them all the time.

quote:
Originally posted by YooperSigs:
We are very backward in the Yoop. I have yet to see one here.


By comparison, Ford is selling for 6-7x forward P/E ratio and about 1.5 times book value, relatively decent earnings, and $6.91 per share in cash. The $143 billion in debt is disquieting, but the 15% return on equity is encouraging.

The debt rules it out for me.




Luckily, I have enough willpower to control the driving ambition that rages within me.

When you had the votes, we did things your way. Now, we have the votes and you will be doing things our way. This lesson in political reality from Lyndon B. Johnson

"Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible." - Justice Janice Rogers Brown
 
Posts: 48369 | Location: Texas hill country | Registered: July 04, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
SIG's 'n Surefires
Picture of M-11
posted Hide Post
quote:
Tesla is an electronics company which makes batteries and sells cars wheeled battery covers as a side business.



"Common sense is wisdom with its sleeves rolled up." -Kyle Farnsworth
"Freedom of Speech does not guarantee freedom from consequences." -Mike Rowe
"Democracies aren't overthrown, they're given away." -George Lucas
 
Posts: 6880 | Location: IL, due south of the Arch | Registered: April 20, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Thank you
Very little
Picture of HRK
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They have learned, you pop out a tech stock, push it hard to the tech crowd, they all jump on and buy, billionaires buying billionaires stocks, pumping up the price.

Been going on for ages.

Tesla is a tech darling makes a very cool e-car, but charging is still an issue for lengthy trips, around town it's another status symbol, MB, Porsche, BMW, Tesla, see me in my cool car.

Most of Teslas cars IIRC correctly sell at a loss without the government e-credits for sales of electric cars. Dump that subsidy and Tesla is very unprofitable on car sales.

JMO if you can buy a tesla at $100K plus you don't need a tax credit to do it...
 
Posts: 24547 | Location: Gunshine State | Registered: November 07, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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posted Hide Post
Topping Ford stock was not too hard.

Ford stock has been in the toilet for years thanks
to a couple Ford CEOs. Ford stock at one time was going up and down about $10 a few times a week like a yoyo. It seems that some top executives were buying stock after a negative announcement by Ford at a bargain price. They then would sell it when a promising announcement was later made. I know some guys who also did this profiting from it as well.
Finally Ford found a court that would allow them to merge the company with a dummy company, thus allowing Ford to call in the current stock certificates and issue new stock. You did not have to take the new stock, you could take a buyout from Ford and pay tax on your stock.
They had a date established that whatever the stock was selling for on that date is what they would give you. They should have done an average price of over the month leading up to that date.
So they basically make some announcement and the price falls on that date some $20 a share and they get it cheap. Most would not just sell out and took the new stock...as priced by Ford at $30/share. It has not been at 30 since the day they traded it for the old shares. A Real slick deal. At one time that stock dropped to a buck a share. I think $16/share has been a good price over the years since then. I know guys who lost 1/4 million dollars on that slick deal.
Since then the smart investors have stayed away from Ford stock. The owners have preferred stock.
Another thing that hurt Ford stock is when the CEO who was from England, bought Jaguar, Land Rover and Aston Martin, I believe.
The other bad deal was when they had the Firestone tire debacle when the tires were blowing out. Ford replaces free of charge all the Firestone tires that were sold on vehicles, no matter the tread wear or miles on them, free of charge. People were buying old used Firestone tires off Fords in junk yards and getting brand new tires for them. Firestone should have paid for that, but since the marriage connection, Ford stockholders took the huge hit.


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Posts: 2794 | Location: Ohio | Registered: December 18, 2014Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of Seotaji
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by 6guns:
quote:
Originally posted by 95flhr:
I don't get the current stock prices or valuation at all. It seems pretty irrational to me for a toy.
Any car that only has a range of 200-300 miles and takes hours to refuel, is a toy and not a serious transportation option in my life.


If driven carefully, it can exceed that mileage and it can be charged more quickly, depending on the charging stations.


Depending on the size of the battery, it will take 40 mins to an hour to charge at a super charger station. I guess you better like hanging out. Maybe take up smoking. Smile
 
Posts: 6917 | Registered: February 19, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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