SIGforum.com    Main Page  Hop To Forum Categories  The Lounge    Biden proposes strict auto emissions rules meant to boost EVs to two-thirds of sales
Go
New
Find
Notify
Tools
Reply
  
Biden proposes strict auto emissions rules meant to boost EVs to two-thirds of sales Login/Join 
goodheart
Picture of sjtill
posted
Washington Examiner link

quote:
The Biden administration proposed strict new auto emissions rules on Wednesday aimed at accelerating the U.S. electric vehicle transition with the goal of having EVs account for up to 67% of all new vehicles sold by 2032.

The proposed standards, which President Joe Biden ordered the Environmental Protection Agency to craft in an August 2021 executive order under the Clean Air Act, will apply to passenger vehicles beginning in model year 2027 and extending through model year 2032.

While the EPA’s proposed rule would not mandate or require automakers to sell a certain number of EVs, it would restrict the total level of emissions generated by each company’s total fleet of sold cars , which is essentially another way of restricting internal combustion engine-powered vehicle sales.

The transportation sector generates the largest share of greenhouse gas emissions in the United States, according to the EPA, accounting for 27% of total greenhouse gas emissions as of 2020.

The guidance from the Biden administration includes four different emissions-limiting options for the EPA to choose from following a public comment period, an effort to allow some degree of flexibility for the EPA in moving to adopt the proposed guidelines.

It is unlikely the regulation will be finalized until next year.

Still, the targets are ambitious. Even the most modest option would require at least 54% of new car sales in the U.S. to be zero-emissions vehicles by 2030, an increase of 4% compared to the administration's existing target, which already seeks to ensure EVs represent 50% of new cars sold by 2030.

By 2032, the new proposed rule would increase that target from between 64% and 67%.

EVs made up just 5.8% of new U.S. vehicle sales in 2022.

The proposal is likely to generate some backlash from the auto industry, which until now has attempted to work with the Biden administration.

The Alliance for Automotive Innovation released a memo ahead of the anticipated guidance last week.

It noted that while automakers are committed to electrifying their fleets and reaching net-zero carbon technology, a "clear-eyed assessment of market readiness is required."

"Even with positive EV sales momentum and product excitement, there are challenges to the electrification transition ahead," it said. "This requires a massive, 100-year change to the U.S. industrial base and the way Americans drive."

The Biden administration's proposal comes after California air regulators voted last year to require 100% zero-emissions vehicle sales by 2035.


Automakers, if they were smart, would start building up a huge inventory of ICE vehicles to sell before the regs go into effect.

I might have been interested in an EV before, but now I'm just going to say "Let's go, Brandon!" and get a gas-guzzling SUV, maybe a pickup too. Fuck 'em.


_________________________
“ What all the wise men promised has not happened, and what all the damned fools said would happen has come to pass.”— Lord Melbourne
 
Posts: 18083 | Location: One hop from Paradise | Registered: July 27, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Gone but Together Again.
Dad & Uncle
Picture of h2oys
posted Hide Post
I'm all for this.

As soon as every politician leads the way by fully converting everything they personally own, with their own personal dollars, and only charges their vehicles at home using their own personal electricity, AND THEN, 10 years later proves to us how much they've saved the world.
 
Posts: 3734 | Location: St. Louis, MO | Registered: November 24, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
They're after my Lucky Charms!
Picture of IrishWind
posted Hide Post
I wonder if those emission standards include the power generators from the local power companies...


Lord, your ocean is so very large and my divos are so very f****d-up
Dirt Sailors Unite!
 
Posts: 25075 | Location: NoVa | Registered: May 06, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
goodheart
Picture of sjtill
posted Hide Post
Looks like most folks think like me:

Most people don't plan to buy an EV soon

BTW John Solomon's Justhenews.com is a good place to go for conservative news without all the clickbait and red meat.


_________________________
“ What all the wise men promised has not happened, and what all the damned fools said would happen has come to pass.”— Lord Melbourne
 
Posts: 18083 | Location: One hop from Paradise | Registered: July 27, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
Picture of Shaql
posted Hide Post
Doubt it. But it won't be too long before you have to buy a "gasoline purchase permit" to purchase gas for your gas-powered car. On top of the gas-powered tax you'll pay for having a non-ev vehicle registered in your state.





Hedley Lamarr: Wait, wait, wait. I'm unarmed.
Bart: Alright, we'll settle this like men, with our fists.
Hedley Lamarr: Sorry, I just remembered . . . I am armed.
 
Posts: 6852 | Location: Atlanta | Registered: April 23, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
An investment in knowledge
pays the best interest
posted Hide Post
The President isn't King. Congress dictates Commerce not the President. This dictate won't go anywhere.
 
Posts: 3362 | Location: Mid-Atlantic | Registered: December 27, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Partial dichotomy
posted Hide Post
We have problems with our grid nowadays, never mind they keep trying to push bullshit "green" power generation. If they get their way, we're screwed!




SIGforum: For all your needs!
Imagine our influence if every gun owner in America was an NRA member! Click the box>>>
 
Posts: 38697 | Location: SC Lowcountry/Cape Cod | Registered: November 22, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Thank you
Very little
Picture of HRK
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Dakor:
The President isn't King. Congress dictates Commerce not the President. This dictate won't go anywhere.


Wouldn't be so sure, this is set by the EPA, all the departments of the federal government are under the white house, so the President can direct the EPA to move forward.

This move is being pushed by the Sierra Club, it's simply a change in the way EV's are credited for higher fuel MPGe which is used to calculate CAFE numbers.

The higher the rating the more credit is given, which allows the company to continue to make and sell ICE vehicles.

Sierra club wants all ICE production stopped, and it's just another way to force building of EV's over ICE.
 
Posts: 23510 | Location: Florida | Registered: November 07, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Coin Sniper
Picture of Rightwire
posted Hide Post
It is amazing how Biden and Obama are using/used executive orders to drive agenda.




Pronoun: His Royal Highness and benevolent Majesty of all he surveys

343 - Never Forget

Its better to be Pavlov's dog than Schrodinger's cat

There are three types of mistakes; Those you learn from, those you suffer from, and those you don't survive.
 
Posts: 37989 | Location: Above the snow line in Michigan | Registered: May 21, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Savor the limelight
posted Hide Post
quote:
The transportation sector generates the largest share of greenhouse gas emissions in the United States, according to the EPA, accounting for 27% of total greenhouse gas emissions as of 2020.

The natural question is how much of this number comes from people driving cars? The EPA says 57% of the 27% is from light-duty vehicles. Link
 
Posts: 10976 | Location: SWFL | Registered: October 10, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
People are not buying EV’s like expected so the government do gooders are going to force us into them. This will basically force manufacturers to save the ICE engines for their working trucks since EV’s will not pull heavy loads any real distances.

What this really means is if you thought cars were expensive now you better buckle your chin strap.


Not a bad business plan to have the government force people to buy your product.
 
Posts: 3929 | Registered: January 25, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
No, not like
Bill Clinton
Picture of BigSwede
posted Hide Post
quote:
People are not buying EV’s like expected



There is a huge pent up demand for them, they can't produce enough or any at all, F150, Silverado, Hummer ETC.. Tell them to make more, genius!



 
Posts: 5338 | Location: GA | Registered: September 23, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
goodheart
Picture of sjtill
posted Hide Post
The legal ability of EPA to regulate greenhouse gas emissions seems to be seriously in question, based on this report from 2022. The Clean Air Act that established EPA was specifically for air pollution, and greenhouse gases are not pollution--certainly not CO2, which is plant food.

I'd like to hear an opinion from someone like John Yoo on the constitutionality of this administrative overreach.

quote:
The U.S. Supreme Court on Thursday dealt a major blow to the Environmental Protection Agency's power to regulate carbon emissions that cause climate change. The decision by the conservative court majority sets the stage for further limitations on the regulatory power of other agencies as well.

By a vote of 6 to 3, the court said that any time an agency does something big and new – in this case addressing climate change – the regulation is presumptively invalid, unless Congress has specifically authorized regulating in this sphere.

"That's a very big deal because they're not going to get it from Congress because Congress is essentially dysfunctional," said Harvard law professor Richard Lazarus, an expert on environmental law. "This could not have come at a worse time" because "the consequences of climate change are increasingly dire and we're running out of time to address it."

As Case Western Reserve professor Jonathan Adler put it, "The Court is definitely sending a signal to regulatory agencies more broadly that they only have the power that Congress delegated to them, and that agencies need to think twice before they try to pour new wine out of old bottles."

In other words, an agency "can't simply retrofit an old statute to create new tools or new mechanisms" to address a problem that is generally within the agency's jurisdiction.

In terms of climate change, Lazarus believes it will have an immediate effect. "Remember when Joe Biden was elected he said we're going to use a whole big government approach to climate change, not just EPA regulation. Well, that whole government approach may now find itself under a cloud of this court's opinion."

The issue before the court was how the EPA can regulate coal-fired power plants, which in this country are the single largest source of carbon emissions that cause climate challenge. The Obama administration set state-by-state carbon limits and encouraged states to rely less on coal and more on alternative energy sources. Even though the program was blocked by the courts, it met its targets 11 years ahead of schedule for the simple reason that it turned out coal was too expensive compared to other power generating sources.

But on Thursday, the Supreme Court turned thumbs down on any such systemic approach. Bringing to life what the court has called "the major questions doctrine," the court said that neither the EPA nor any other agency may adopt rules that are transformational to the economy--unless Congress has specifically authorized such a rule to address a specific problem, like climate change.

Writing for the court majority, Chief Justice John Roberts said that under what the court has recently called the "major questions doctrine," neither the EPA nor any other agency may adopt rules that are "transformational" to the economy — unless Congress has specifically authorized such a transformative rule to address a specific problem, like climate change.

In "certain extraordinary cases, both separation of powers principles and a practical understanding of legislative intent make us 'reluctant to read into ambiguous statutory text' the delegation claimed to be lurking there," Roberts writes. "To convince us otherwise, something more than a merely plausible textual basis for the agency action is necessary. The agency instead must point to 'clear congressional authorization' for the power it claims."

Justice Elena Kagan, in a furious dissent, said essentially that the Court is making up new rules that contradict nearly a century of regulatory law. The text of the Clean Air Act, she said, clearly anticipates that the EPA will have to deal with new problems and uses broad language to allow that. The Court majority, she says, "does not have a clue about how to address climate change...yet it appoints itself, instead of congress or the expert agency...the decision-maker on climate policy. I cannot think of many things more frightening." NPR Link


OK, here's apparently the "legal" basis for this shit. Thank you, Joe Fucking Manchin.

Link: eenews.net
quote:
Each time EPA has tried to regulate vehicle emissions, its efforts have been met with challenges in federal court. The agency’s expected proposal this week to boost electric vehicle deployment is unlikely to be any different.

But this time around, EPA has a new tool in its legal arsenal to defend its attempt to tackle one of the nation’s leading sources of planet-warming emissions — the freshly minted Inflation Reduction Act.

The landmark climate law passed in 2022 is expected to buffer EPA’s anticipated regulation against scrutiny from a federal judiciary where conservative jurists — particularly at the Supreme Court — are increasingly skeptical of agencies seizing power that hasn’t been specifically delegated to them by Congress.


“It’s Congress directly weighing in to provide direct support for zero-emitting vehicles,” said Peter Zalzal, senior counsel at the Environmental Defense Fund, of the Inflation Reduction Act.


_________________________
“ What all the wise men promised has not happened, and what all the damned fools said would happen has come to pass.”— Lord Melbourne
 
Posts: 18083 | Location: One hop from Paradise | Registered: July 27, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Master of one hand
pistol shooting
Picture of Hamden106
posted Hide Post
Looking forward to being the 4th car in line for a 30 minute e-fill.
Not to mention the call to EEE for an emergency can of electrons high in the Rockies.

And a fire extinguisher.....



SIGnature
NRA Benefactor CMP Pistol Distinguished
 
Posts: 6320 | Location: Oregon | Registered: September 01, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
State and local fuel tax revenue will have to come from somewhere. According to the Tax Policy Center, total revenue in 2020 was $52.7 trillion.

Link

Possibly some states may push back on this?


____________
Pace
 
Posts: 652 | Location: in the PA woods | Registered: March 11, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Lawyers, Guns
and Money
Picture of chellim1
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Hamden106:
Looking forward to being the 4th car in line for a 30 minute e-fill.
Not to mention the call to EEE for an emergency can of electrons high in the Rockies.

Big Grin

These environmental wackos are insane!
The Build Back Better bullshit only serves to strengthen China and Russia.



"Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible."
-- Justice Janice Rogers Brown

"The United States government is the largest criminal enterprise on earth."
-rduckwor
 
Posts: 24144 | Location: St. Louis, MO | Registered: April 03, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Drill Here, Drill Now
Picture of tatortodd
posted Hide Post
quote:
The transportation sector generates the largest share of greenhouse gas emissions in the United States, according to the EPA, accounting for 27% of total greenhouse gas emissions as of 2020.
I spend a half day to full day a week on emerging fuels issues, and sit on industry committees. Greenhouse gases is the reason for the emerging fuels push so the first thing I noticed was the use of intentionally misleading GHG statistics. Passenger cars, light duty trucks, medium and heavy duty trucks make up ~55% of transportation emissions (ie 14.9% not 27% of total GHG emissions in US). Taking out the medium and heavy duty trucks lowers it to 10.5%. In other words, Biden admin's justification for foisting EVs on consumers is for 10.5% of total US GHG emissions.

Transportation emissions are "on-road" emissions and there has been no calculation on the increased off-road emissions to mine lithium. So the real reduction in GHG will be less than 10.5%.

BTW, all of the above is from EPA's own publicly available report.



Ego is the anesthesia that deadens the pain of stupidity

DISCLAIMER: These are the author's own personal views and do not represent the views of the author's employer.
 
Posts: 23297 | Location: Northern Suburbs of Houston | Registered: November 14, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
No More
Mr. Nice Guy
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by 6guns:
We have problems with our grid nowadays, never mind they keep trying to push bullshit "green" power generation. If they get their way, we're screwed!


A friend who works in the grid infrastructure equipment industry says there is a supply shortage. The raw materials for things like transformers, wire, and other parts are being diverted to electric vehicle production.

Kind of a Catch-22 situation. Build a bunch more electric cars but the grid needed to charge them cannot be expanded or repaired because they're building lots of electric cars!
 
Posts: 9463 | Location: On the mountain off the grid | Registered: February 25, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
Don't forget we'll need a massive increase in lithium imports to make all those batteries and replacement batteries.

Who has the lithium? China and Afghanistan.
 
Posts: 238 | Registered: March 11, 2017Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
Here are a couple of business ideas for you younger folks.

1. Start a towing company. I see a bright future for them.

2. Start a mobile charging business. Just a Pickup with a diesel powered generator running a fast charger. Just give them enough juice to get to a chrging station. Would love to see the look on the liberal EV owners faces when you pull up with your big loud diesel generator to bail 'em out
 
Posts: 582 | Registered: September 30, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
  Powered by Social Strata  
 

SIGforum.com    Main Page  Hop To Forum Categories  The Lounge    Biden proposes strict auto emissions rules meant to boost EVs to two-thirds of sales

© SIGforum 2024