What a moron. No self respecting West Virginian would ever go to California!

quote:

Originally posted by Flashlightboy:....A CCW for a banger is cover and it gives them legitimacy to carry. Same with a driver's license. LAPD has enough problems with gangs without a national reciprocity issue.

But you deny CCW for effectively everyone, to target a handful of gang members. I am not sure that makes society any safer.

quote:

Originally posted by armedmd:
What a moron. No self respecting West Virginian would ever go to California!

And the flip side to that is why doesn't WV recognize my CA CCW? I've had training up the kazoo, taken classes on CCW laws and done pretty much far more than the minimum to obtain a CCW and yet more than half the states don't recognize my CCW. Why is that if those other states, touting their gun friendliness, won't do that?

What is the local or state interest that is being served by WV not recognizing my permit? See, it's a two way street on the issue.

quote:

Originally posted by Flashlightboy:

What I'm saying isn't popular here but the reality here is different than where a lot of you live.

It isn't popular because it's absolutely retarded.

quote:

Originally posted by Scoutmaster:

quote:

Originally posted by Flashlightboy:....A CCW for a banger is cover and it gives them legitimacy to carry. Same with a driver's license. LAPD has enough problems with gangs without a national reciprocity issue.

But you deny CCW for effectively everyone, to target a handful of gang members. I am not sure that makes society any safer.

You're confusing reciprocity with obtaining a CCW permit. A CA issued permit is good anywhere in the state except for some named places so it's not a CCW denial issue. My CCW is just as valid in LA as it is where I live as is everyone else's who has one from any county.

quote:

Originally posted by Flashlightboy:

quote:

Originally posted by armedmd:
What a moron. No self respecting West Virginian would ever go to California!

And the flip side to that is why doesn't WV recognize my CA CCW? I've had training up the kazoo, taken classes on CCW laws and done pretty much far more than the minimum to obtain a CCW and yet more than half the states don't recognize my CCW. Why is that if those other states, touting their gun friendliness, won't do that?

What is the local or state interest that is being served by WV not recognizing my permit? See, it's a two way street on the issue.

Because why should other states pander to your commie state if California has no intention of honoring their citizens' permits?

Blame your legislator for those states not recognizing your permit.

quote:

Originally posted by Balzé Halzé:

quote:

Originally posted by Flashlightboy:

What I'm saying isn't popular here but the reality here is different than where a lot of you live.

It isn't popular because it's absolutely retarded.

I love UT and the people but Cedar City or Ogden or anywhere else isn't LA and you'd be off the rails to say any large UT city faces the same problems as LA.

Charlie Beck smells like a bureaucrat. There usually self righteous hypocrites & generally full of shit...

quote:

Originally posted by Balzé Halzé:

quote:

Originally posted by Flashlightboy:

quote:

Originally posted by armedmd:
What a moron. No self respecting West Virginian would ever go to California!

And the flip side to that is why doesn't WV recognize my CA CCW? I've had training up the kazoo, taken classes on CCW laws and done pretty much far more than the minimum to obtain a CCW and yet more than half the states don't recognize my CCW. Why is that if those other states, touting their gun friendliness, won't do that?

What is the local or state interest that is being served by WV not recognizing my permit? See, it's a two way street on the issue.

Because why should other states pander to your commie state if California has no intention of honoring their citizens' permits?

Blame your legislator for those states not recognizing your permit.

I want to make sure I write this down correctly.

You're saying that WV will not recognize CA for political reasons only? Seems to me that WV, if it really was for CCW issuance, would see that people from CA have a very high level of training and demonstrated competency before they were issued their permits and recognize mine.

CA is run by loons and there's no question about that but it also seems that there's no bona fide reason for WV not to recognize CA other than it just doesn't like CA.

quote:

Originally posted by Flashlightboy:

quote:

Originally posted by braillediver:
To think gangbangers get Concealed Carry permits is the stupidest thing I ever heard.

If you've never been fingerprinted for a crime you don't voluntarily give the police a unique identifier- your fingerprint.

You're making a very wrong assumption that all gangbangers have been fingerprinted. Where do understand that to be true? Is that some sort of universal truth where you're from?

Flashlightboy, I've read all your posts. I find your viewpoint totally absurd. As another poster stated: anyone can rationalize tyranny, I demand my rights.

People who are intent on breaking the law will break the law, and that possibility should not prevent me from protecting myself and my family. If LA has made terrible choices and allowed itself to be overrun with gangs, why exactly should that justify me making myself vulnerable to those gangs? And if it's so chatotic, why should I trust the judgement of the LEOs who currently oversee this chaos and can't seem to fix it? Sounds like you guys are trapped in a circle of poor logic leading to bad conclusions, and are unwilling to try other solutions but still hoping for an improved situation. Your points are not falling on deaf ears, they are simply unconvincing.

quote:

Originally posted by arabiancowboy:

quote:

Originally posted by Flashlightboy:

quote:

Originally posted by braillediver:
To think gangbangers get Concealed Carry permits is the stupidest thing I ever heard.

If you've never been fingerprinted for a crime you don't voluntarily give the police a unique identifier- your fingerprint.

You're making a very wrong assumption that all gangbangers have been fingerprinted. Where do understand that to be true? Is that some sort of universal truth where you're from?

Flashlightboy, I've read all your posts. I find your viewpoint totally absurd. As another poster stated: anyone can rationalize tyranny, I demand my rights.

People who are intent on breaking the law will break the law, and that possibility should not prevent me from protecting myself and my family. If LA has made terrible choices and allowed itself to be overrun with gangs, why exactly should that justify me making myself vulnerable to those gangs? And if it's so chatotic, why should I trust the judgement of the LEOs who currently oversee this chaos and can't seem to fix it? Sounds like you guys are trapped in a circle of poor logic leading to bad conclusions, and are unwilling to try other solutions but still hoping for an improved situation. Your points are not falling on deaf ears, they are simply unconvincing.

I can accept that I'm not convincing anyone of anything that's fine. Truly is but I'm not absurd in reciting the mentality that goes on here. Beck does a lot of stupid shit that makes no sense, especially with illegal immigrants so I don't see him as any kind of saint.

See the point of yours that I'm totally on point with is that local LEO in the LAPD can't get their act together and part of that is political with the various factions on the city council, supervisors board and the police citizen review board and when those three groups starting thinking hard, well, let's just say they don't.

But you're not the problem coming to LA with your CCW. I'm not nor is anyone else wearing the white hat. While here you're not pulling your gun because responsible CCW owners don't do that sort of thing so you're presence with a carry gun doesn't alter the landscape but it's the bangers and so on that are the problem as they've always been and will continue to be in the current political environment.

Beck is a weinie of sorts but here he doesn't have a better solution to offer up other than opposition to reciprocity because of the problems he'll deal with long after you've left the state.

quote:

Originally posted by Flashlightboy:

CA is run by loons and there's no question about that but it also seems that there's no bona fide reason for WV not to recognize CA other than it just doesn't like CA.

There's a very good reason in fact. Because the lawmakers in WV were elected to represent the people of WV, not the people in CA. If the people in CA want other States to recognize their permit, they should give something in return. Namely, CA should recognize any State that her citizens want to carry in. Fair is fair. There's absolutely no benefit otherwise for West Virginia to recognize California. I mean, who do you people think you are anyway?

And frankly, I couldn't care less about your "very high level of training" that CA deems necessary to grant a permit. Makes me sick. In fact, that's even more of a reason for WV and other states to deny CA permits. It's an affront to the second amendment, and I would hope every free loving State would reject such nonsense.

quote:

Originally posted by Pipe Smoker:

quote:

Originally posted by a1abdj:
You can obtain permits from some states without ever setting foot in those states.

When Missouri passed their CCW laws, a lawmaker I knew told me that he was confident court battles would delay the issuance of permits. He was right. He suggested that I obtain an out of state permit seeing that the law would recognize those. This would allow me to carry until I could obtain my Missouri permit.

I applied for and received a permit from Florida. Last time I was physically in Florida I was still in diapers.

I'd like to know more about that, please! I have a long-expired FL CCW permit. Your post makes me wonder if I can get it renewed, even though I'm a CA resident now. What documents did you have to submit?

An Arizona non-resident CWP would be your easiest route. One page application, a copy of your expired Florida permit (to satisfy their training requirements), and fingerprints. Arizona's CWP is recognized by just about every "free" state. Although, non- residents licenses are not recognized in Colorado, South Carolina, or Florida.

Thank you, texassierra. And you, too, JALLEN, and others.

So, if some form of national reciprocity became law, California would be about like Arizona is now? People could run around with a pistol in their pocket if they chose to do so? And the police would be powerless to do anything about it?
Perhaps we in Arizona are already experiencing Apocalypse and don't realize it

quote:

Originally posted by Balzé Halzé:

quote:

Originally posted by Flashlightboy:

CA is run by loons and there's no question about that but it also seems that there's no bona fide reason for WV not to recognize CA other than it just doesn't like CA.

There's a very good reason in fact. Because the lawmakers in WV were elected to represent the people of WV, not the people in CA. If the people in CA want other States to recognize their permit, they should give something in return. Namely, CA should recognize any State that her citizens want to carry in. Fair is fair. There's absolutely no benefit otherwise for West Virginia to recognize California. I mean, who do you people think you are anyway?

And frankly, I couldn't care less about your "very high level of training" that CA deems necessary to grant a permit. Makes me sick. In fact, that's even more of a reason for WV and other states to deny CA permits. It's an affront to the second amendment, and I would hope every free loving State would reject such nonsense.

I think you misunderstood on the training. CCW training in CA is barely above joke level. I think it's inadequate but better than nothing although not much more.

What I meant was that outside of any CCW classes, I've completed others that exceed minimum CCW standards. If CA CCW, for instance, required static shooting at various yards with a 70% hit in the COM, I've gone far beyond that with various classes and scenarios with other LEO in team exercises and so on. My use of the phrase high level of training was only meant to say that I try to better my skills and take classes to learn and build my abilities.

quote:

Originally posted by Flashlightboy:....You're confusing reciprocity with obtaining a CCW permit. A CA issued permit is good anywhere in the state except for some named places so it's not a CCW denial issue. My CCW is just as valid in LA as it is where I live as is everyone else's who has one from any county.

I live in the Bay Area. Our county officials have made it quite clear (based on various court rulings) they will accept CCW applications. And they will process them sometime this century. I know of only one person who actually got a CCW in the Bay Area (who is not a politician, bureaucrat, or celebrity). Seems a few years ago he was the key witness against some violent felons who went to prison, and publicly promised to get even with him.

WV will gladly recognize any state that in turn will represent our permits which is why we have reciprocity with 30+ states. The olive branch is always extended. Unfortunately your "loon" leaders chose to deny reciprocity and our officials did not see reason to offer you a benefit with nothing in return for our citizens. I'm not a realtor but I'm happy to send you some info about the Mountain State. Montani Semper Liberi

quote:

Originally posted by Scoutmaster:

quote:

Originally posted by Flashlightboy:....You're confusing reciprocity with obtaining a CCW permit. A CA issued permit is good anywhere in the state except for some named places so it's not a CCW denial issue. My CCW is just as valid in LA as it is where I live as is everyone else's who has one from any county.

I live in the Bay Area. Our county officials have made it quite clear (based on various court rulings) they will accept CCW applications. And they will process them sometime this century. I know of only one person who actually got a CCW in the Bay Area (who is not a politician, bureaucrat, or celebrity). Seems a few years ago he was the key witness against some violent felons who went to prison, and publicly promised to get even with him.

The SF area, parts of Santa Clara County, LA and Sacramento are famous for having the procedure on paper but in reality, slow walking the process to make permits unavailable. Fortunately, the majority of other counties aren't hamstrung like that.

I wish we had a state standard so people can clearly understand the process and criteria but Sacramento is worthy of no thought of doing the right thing. The key problem, as you know, is that CA is one of only a couple of states that doesn't have the right to bear arms in their state consitution and hell would freeze over before something like ever happened here.

interesting facts about the crime rate for CCW people:
""Combining the data for Florida and Texas data, we find that permit holders are convicted of misdemeanors and felonies at less than a sixth the rate for police officers," Lott writes. "Among police, firearms violations occur at a rate of 16.5 per 100,000 officers. Among permit holders in Florida and Texas, the rate is only 2.4 per 100,000.10 That is just 1/7th of the rate for police officers. But there's no need to focus on Texas and Florida — the data are similar in other states.""
http://www.dailywire.com/news/...st-law-aaron-bandler

Maybe the chief is worried about looking bad when compared to concealed carriers?