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Member
Picture of downtownv
posted
Do you have any constitutional rights?
I always thought the Constitution was for Citizens.
watching the news, there are illegal alien advocates telling viewers they have constitutional rights.
 
Posts: 9537 | Location: 18 miles long, 6 Miles at Sea | Registered: January 22, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I had the same question, after seeing a video a Catholic organization shared, giving illegals tips on how to interact with ICE.

It appears the use of the word "person" in the Bill of Rights, as opposed to "citizen" is where the argument is made. I don't know what courts have ruled on this matter.
 
Posts: 2811 | Location: Northeast GA | Registered: February 15, 2021Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of Prefontaine
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quote:
Originally posted by downtownv:
Do you have any constitutional rights?
I always thought the Constitution was for Citizens.
watching the news, there are illegal alien advocates telling viewers they have constitutional rights.


From my recollection and I’m not expert..due process only. And in this case I think the due process is to bus or fly their asses out of the country.



What am I doing? I'm talking to an empty telephone
 
Posts: 13464 | Location: Down South | Registered: January 16, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Political Cynic
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even if they are here illegally, if I recall they do have some constitutional rights

not sure which ones though, and their rights may be truncated by the nature of their crime
 
Posts: 54386 | Location: Tucson Arizona | Registered: January 16, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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All the various ways I have input the question into the google machine return the answer that no: you don't have to be a citizen to be protected by aspects of the Bill of Rights. That's google though, which is known to be biased. If someone has access to Grok, that would be a good resource. Also, there should be precedent for something like this. Members smarter than myself should know this stuff, I assume.

It's certainly a relevant and timely topic.

OP might consider changing the subject line, so the thread gets more attention from the right people.
 
Posts: 2811 | Location: Northeast GA | Registered: February 15, 2021Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Little ray
of sunshine
Picture of jhe888
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by downtownv:

I always thought the Constitution was for Citizens.


That is not the law. You may think it should be, but it is not the law in the U.S.

Non-citizens have most of the rights citizens have. Exceptions include voting, and the ability to run for office.

Do you really think non-citizens should not have due process (could be locked up indefinitely without trial, for example), could be enslaved, no free speech rights, no right to be secure from illegal searches, no freedom of religion, just as a few examples?




The fish is mute, expressionless. The fish doesn't think because the fish knows everything.
 
Posts: 53511 | Location: Texas | Registered: February 10, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Do you really think non-citizens should not have due process (could be locked up indefinitely without trial, for example), could be enslaved, no free speech rights, no right to be secure from illegal searches, no freedom of religion, just as a few examples?
Indeed. That wouldn't be very American.
 
Posts: 2811 | Location: Northeast GA | Registered: February 15, 2021Reply With QuoteReport This Post
A Grateful American
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quote:
Originally posted by jhe888:...


^^^
This is what the military taught me as to basic human rights, and then all the things covered in Articles of Geneva Convention.




"the meaning of life, is to give life meaning" Ani Yehudi אני יהודי Le'olam lo shuv לעולם לא שוב!
 
Posts: 45210 | Location: Box 1663 Santa Fe, New Mexico | Registered: December 20, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Optimistic Cynic
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For the most part, the "rights" expressed in the BoR are restrictions on what the Fed. Govt. can do, not expressly outlined rights as we like to think of them today.

There is another concept, that of "human rights," things like being able to protect one's physical person, children, "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness," etc. that are intimately involved with these Govt. prohibitions. I suspect most would agree that all persons, citizens or not, have human rights, and that the Constitution, or any other document, cannot abrogate or expand these.

There is also the inconvenient fact that the Constitution was written to apply to British colonists who certainly were not citizens of the yet-to-be-founded government that it describes. OTOH, many US residents, slaves, Indians, etc. were denied many of these liberties for a considerable period so there is precedent.
 
Posts: 7160 | Location: NoVA | Registered: July 22, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Just because you can,
doesn't mean you should
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From the reports, this first round of detainees are made up of those already convicted, or at least charged, with a crime.
At least some of the due process may have already happened.


___________________________
Avoid buying ChiCom/CCP products whenever possible.
 
Posts: 10228 | Location: NE GA | Registered: August 22, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by jhe888:
quote:
Originally posted by downtownv:

I always thought the Constitution was for Citizens.


That is not the law. You may think it should be, but it is not the law in the U.S.

Non-citizens have most of the rights citizens have. Exceptions include voting, and the ability to run for office.

Do you really think non-citizens should not have due process (could be locked up indefinitely without trial, for example), could be enslaved, no free speech rights, no right to be secure from illegal searches, no freedom of religion, just as a few examples?


The cornerstone of our nation (and arguably western civilization) is that the government does not grant rights, it protects them. Hence the idea that all men are created equal and, by virtue of that creation, endowed with unalienable rights.
 
Posts: 1033 | Location: Tampa | Registered: July 27, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by downtownv:
Do you have any constitutional rights?
I always thought the Constitution was for Citizens.
watching the news, there are illegal alien advocates telling viewers they have constitutional rights.


If you apply that theory, then the concept of natural or God given rights is meaningless. You are saying that the government is the source of rights that can be granted and taken away at will. I don't like that.
 
Posts: 9178 | Location: The Red part of Minnesota | Registered: October 06, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Lawyers, Guns
and Money
Picture of chellim1
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quote:
The cornerstone of our nation (and arguably western civilization) is that the government does not grant rights, it protects them. Hence the idea that all men are created equal and, by virtue of that creation, endowed with unalienable rights.

Yes. Natural rights.
But some rights ARE conferred by government, by virtue of citizenship. These would include voting, or participation in said government.



"Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible."
-- Justice Janice Rogers Brown

"The United States government is the largest criminal enterprise on earth."
-rduckwor
 
Posts: 25616 | Location: St. Louis, MO | Registered: April 03, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of downtownv
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by downtownv:
Do you have any constitutional rights?
I always thought the Constitution was for Citizens.
watching the news, there are illegal alien advocates telling viewers they have constitutional rights.


AND ICE must show a judge-signed warrant... True?

The talking head news also reported that the illegals are afraid to go to the Job pick-up points, church, and schools. They are sheltering in place and not venturing outside of the home. Catholic Charities the largest assistance for them has not seen people in several days.

The MSM is trying everything to assist them in avoiding the ICE dragnet. Ironically, that's not what most taxpaying Americans feel...
 
Posts: 9537 | Location: 18 miles long, 6 Miles at Sea | Registered: January 22, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Thank you
Very little
Picture of HRK
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Amazing how life still mimics movies, even 56 years later the story still relates...



 
Posts: 25420 | Location: Gunshine State | Registered: November 07, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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All the left can yell is “separation of Church and State.” So, it must be OK when groups like Catholic Charities gets Government money for illegal immigration use?

https://www.usaspending.gov/aw...NON_2404TXRCMA_7590/

So much for Church and State…
 
Posts: 227 | Location: Orange County, California | Registered: July 18, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Lawyers, Guns
and Money
Picture of chellim1
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quote:
All the left can yell is “separation of Church and State.” So, it must be OK when groups like Catholic Charities gets Government money for illegal immigration use?

Absolutely not!
As a Catholic, this is horrible. The Lutherans do the same, and I know plenty of Lutherans who think it's horrible too.



"Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible."
-- Justice Janice Rogers Brown

"The United States government is the largest criminal enterprise on earth."
-rduckwor
 
Posts: 25616 | Location: St. Louis, MO | Registered: April 03, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Help! Help!
I'm being repressed!

Picture of Skull Leader
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quote:
AND ICE must show a judge-signed warrant... True?


Actually, no. You can learn more about admin warrants here.

https://www.fletc.gov/ice-admi...removal-warrants-mp3
 
Posts: 11230 | Location: The Magnolia State | Registered: November 20, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
His Royal Hiney
Picture of Rey HRH
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by downtownv:
Do you have any constitutional rights?
I always thought the Constitution was for Citizens.
watching the news, there are illegal alien advocates telling viewers they have constitutional rights.


While citizens have some rights not afforded to non-citizens (right to vote, run for federal office, etc), non-citizens have the same rights as everybody who happens to be on United States soil - right to due process, equal protection, freedom of speech and religion, legal representation, protection against unlawful searches, etc.

That is why it was a big deal that we were able to house prisoners of war from the Middle East in Guantanamo Bay, Cuba. If they were jailed in the U.S., they would have those rights greanted by being physically on U.S. soil. In Gitmo, they were under the Geneva Convention.



"It did not really matter what we expected from life, but rather what life expected from us. We needed to stop asking about the meaning of life, and instead to think of ourselves as those who were being questioned by life – daily and hourly. Our answer must consist not in talk and meditation, but in right action and in right conduct. Life ultimately means taking the responsibility to find the right answer to its problems and to fulfill the tasks which it constantly sets for each individual." Viktor Frankl, Man's Search for Meaning, 1946.
 
Posts: 20649 | Location: The Free State of Arizona - Ditat Deus | Registered: March 24, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Casuistic Thinker and Daoist
Picture of 9mmepiphany
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by downtownv:
Do you have any constitutional rights?
I always thought the Constitution was for Citizens.
watching the news, there are illegal alien advocates telling viewers they have constitutional rights.

If you think about the Constitution, when it was written and who wrote it, you can see how you're mistaken.

None of the framers of the Constitution were citizens. As a matter of fact they were immigrants...and illegal immigrants at that




No, Daoism isn't a religion



 
Posts: 14357 | Location: northern california | Registered: February 07, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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