quote:

Originally posted by radioman:
Did they ever find those 1300 guns they lost in Mexico?

Those guns were not "lost." Those guns were knowingly transferred to Mexican drug cartel members who BATFE knew were going to illegally smuggle them into Mexico where the guns would be used in acts of violence against Mexican citizens and Mexican politicians.

quote:

Originally posted by BBMW:
Do you hold an FFL?

quote:

Originally posted by SIGnified:
Having been to an auction recently… I expect a knock, and everybody has instructions.


FWIW - There is no way I’m walking to the door with a fully assembled firearm.


I’m interested in what other people think they would do in this situation. I have some special circumstances that trigger an extra level of FFL scrutiny… All the legal - just tier one FFL can’t see me. I’m sure others here can relate.

~Curious

No. (Just a security clearance.)

I agree with the warrant; no tikki, no ride.

quote:

Originally posted by parabellum:
You know how it is- the rules never apply to true believers. The law doesn't matter because it just gets in the way of their righteous cause.

In 2013, I recall very well, Obummer referring to 'troublesome laws'. He also said that we "need to act quickly, while emotions are high". I want to think most people want to make big decisions with logic, not emotion. That their very laws be created and passed with calm, intellectual debates regarding the pros and cons of proposed legislation. For me this exposed their true motivations by shouting openly that the proposed law would never pass unless judgment was clouded by emotion.

I will NEVER forget this.

Never.

I disagree; most people make decisions based on emotion, not logic. That's one of the tools the left uses to gain power. Alinski's "Rules for Radicals" are all based on emotion based techniques.

Current FFL here. Just for reference, I’ve only had one audit/inspection. I was even smaller then and it would have been ridiculously easy to copy my records. The inspector did not. He was very laid back, asked only to see the things he was legally able to ask for. This was Nov 2019, I’m sure things have changed since VP Biden has taken office. I know they are moving to a zero tolerance policy, if they find any error they will try and take your license.

Anyway, just my experience.

quote:

Originally posted by SIGnified:

quote:

Originally posted by BBMW:
Do you hold an FFL?

quote:

Originally posted by SIGnified:
Having been to an auction recently… I expect a knock, and everybody has instructions.


FWIW - There is no way I’m walking to the door with a fully assembled firearm.


I’m interested in what other people think they would do in this situation. I have some special circumstances that trigger an extra level of FFL scrutiny… All the legal - just tier one FFL can’t see me. I’m sure others here can relate.

~Curious

No. (Just a security clearance.)

I agree with the warrant; no tikki, no ride.

I have a FFL, 01/SOT and have been an 07/SOT,.
and I have no idea what you are talking about

quote:

Originally posted by policetruck:
Current FFL here. Just for reference, I’ve only had one audit/inspection. I was even smaller then and it would have been ridiculously easy to copy my records. The inspector did not. He was very laid back, asked only to see the things he was legally able to ask for. This was Nov 2019, I’m sure things have changed since VP Biden has taken office. I know they are moving to a zero tolerance policy, if they find any error they will try and take your license.

Anyway, just my experience.

been thru many, and am probably due for one,

ATF in RVA is a bit laid back,

the IOI's are basically bean counters, (this is not meant as an insult) they look at paperwork, check your inventory for accuracy etc etc,

they take notes on a form and a note pad on any issues you may have, and then go back to the office, compile notes, and come back and go over any issues you may have had,

level of scrutiny changes with each administration, if it is a R,, laid back, if it is a D, more issues,
Clinton and Obama tried to make it difficult for every one, and Clinton in particular took out a lot of kitchen table dealers,,

in the past one or 2 would show up, and since I am a small shop, we schedule a time for the inspection,
the last 2 I got to the shop to find a note on the door saying call me, let's set up on inspection, (I have limited hours)

first they check inventory vs the bound book, make model and most importantly serial number

then look over the 4473's, sometimes all, sometimes just this past year, or the year we are in , just depends on the volume, (I have been asked how many I have in inventory, how many I have sold via 4473 (vs C&R or FFL sales)


never had an issue with any IOI except for one back in the 80's that was a dick, little short fat fukker that thought he was The Man, and IIRC even the other IOI's did not like him,


never had them take pics, have had them take notes,


each IOI has a set of rules the look hard at, and some they gloss over, just like anyone in a corporate office does,


re the tracing center, where the 4473's go , there is a vid on youtube somewhere that shows the boxes stacked up like cord wood, and in storage trailers waiting for whatever there fate is,

one IOI told me years ago that the traces get harder and harder to do each year, unless it is a newly purchased firearm,

practically nothing can be traced pre 68,. and even a gun bought 20 yrs ago, unless it stayed with the original owner or family, is a crapshoot

quote:

Originally posted by Sig2340:

quote:

Originally posted by radioman:
Did they ever find those 1300 guns they lost in Mexico?

Those guns were not "lost." Those guns were knowingly transferred to Mexican drug cartel members who BATFE knew were going to illegally smuggle them into Mexico where the guns would be used in acts of violence against Mexican citizens and Mexican politicians.

exactly. And there was no criminal prosecution of Eric Holder for contempt of congress related to the investigation into the matter.

Fact: People died.

Lyman, yeah I feel I’m due for one too. What do you suspect your average time between inspections is? I was sweating bullets the first time (read some horror stories from Obama era), not too sure I’d be worried anymore.

I once had a sheriff's deputy bang on my door. I answered and they asked me if my Ruger .22 pistol was in my possession as there was a report of a kid with the same model running around the area.
I told them all of my property is accounted for but how in the rolling hills of fuck did they know what I owned.
No data base? Yeah fucking right. There's ALWAYS been a data base.

quote:

Originally posted by lyman:

quote:

Originally posted by SIGnified:

quote:

Originally posted by BBMW:
Do you hold an FFL?

quote:

Originally posted by SIGnified:
Having been to an auction recently… I expect a knock, and everybody has instructions.


FWIW - There is no way I’m walking to the door with a fully assembled firearm.


I’m interested in what other people think they would do in this situation. I have some special circumstances that trigger an extra level of FFL scrutiny… All the legal - just tier one FFL can’t see me. I’m sure others here can relate.

~Curious

No. (Just a security clearance.)

I agree with the warrant; no tikki, no ride.

I have a FFL, 01/SOT and have been an 07/SOT,.
and I have no idea what you are talking about

I’ve been told… Perhaps incorrectly… But I go through this every time I do an FFL…

The first tier review cannot see enough information about me to approve, therefore it gets passed on to the next level/tier.

It used to take/delay another 10 to 20 minutes; now it takes several days. Going through it right now on a stupid little P6. Just had it happen on several rifles.

Since this is your business, I would expect you know more about the process than I do.

quote:

Originally posted by SIGnified:

quote:

Originally posted by lyman:

quote:

Originally posted by SIGnified:

quote:

Originally posted by BBMW:
Do you hold an FFL?

quote:

Originally posted by SIGnified:
Having been to an auction recently… I expect a knock, and everybody has instructions.


FWIW - There is no way I’m walking to the door with a fully assembled firearm.


I’m interested in what other people think they would do in this situation. I have some special circumstances that trigger an extra level of FFL scrutiny… All the legal - just tier one FFL can’t see me. I’m sure others here can relate.

~Curious

No. (Just a security clearance.)

I agree with the warrant; no tikki, no ride.

I have a FFL, 01/SOT and have been an 07/SOT,.
and I have no idea what you are talking about

I’ve been told… Perhaps incorrectly… But I go through this every time I do an FFL…

The first tier review cannot see enough information about me to approve, therefore it gets passed on to the next level/tier.

It used to take/delay another 10 to 20 minutes; now it takes several days. Going through it right now on a stupid little P6. Just had it happen on several rifles.

Since this is your business, I would expect you know more about the process than I do.

Years ago I attended training offered by NICS. The first person to look at the NICS submission has no clearance to look into background info so you are correct there. If they see anything it goes to delay and moves on to the people with clearance so they can dig into the persons background.

I am an FFL and one of my distributors sent out a notice. I have redacted their name and this is only part of it, but it gives an idea of what is going on now. Normally every time I renew my license I expect an audit prior to them issuing it. Not so this year, no audit for some reason. The ATF is only supposed to audit during the business hours listed on the license app, for me that is evening and weekends (times they do not work). They are free to come unannounced during that time but are not supposed to outside that. I am home based so it makes it more difficult for them. Anyway, you can read below and get an idea of what is going with them:


"Dear valued customers,
Over the past few weeks I, along with other members of the XXX team, have had an opportunity to speak candidly with investigators from the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) and several regulatory compliance consultants from our industry. The purpose of our meeting with ATF was to discuss certain aspects of XXX operations, and show our visitors how we conduct business generally. Our meeting with ATF was not an audit, but was instead a chance for us to discuss areas of interest or concern for both ATF and XXX. During the course of the meeting with ATF and discussions with regulatory compliance consultants, we were able to further understand how the current administration’s “Zero Tolerance Policy” is being implemented, and we heard examples of specific dealer activities that were resulting in revocation actions. Information we learned through these discussions may be helpful to some of our dealers so we determined it is worth sharing. I have summarized below some of what we heard in our discussions. Also, because of what we have learned, in the next few days you will receive an invitation to attend a roundtable, to be broadcast on XXX LIVE on July 15, 2022, for our dealers (the “Compliance Roundtable”). The Compliance Roundtable will be a discussion with a panel of firearms industry and legal experts to help you successfully navigate your next ATF audit and continue to do business in a challenging regulatory environment.
Before I get into some of the specifics, I feel compelled to give our dealers a warning and some friendly advice. The Zero Tolerance Policy is being applied retroactively. So, even if you are doing everything correctly now, and you have systems and policies in place to prevent future violations, a past occurrence can trigger a Notice of Revocation. Until this policy is rescinded, if you get caught up in a prolonged inspection or a revocation proceeding, you should not try to “go it alone” ... you should, instead, retain the best legal counsel you can. The playing field is not even, and as with any governmental administration proceeding, the rules at the initial hearing advantage the government. If ATF finds a violation, you may have the best reason in the world for why the violation occurred, but unfortunately, in the current environment, no one cares about your reason. With certain violations, ATF investigators no longer have discretion to look at your circumstances and grant a second chance."

I had my FFL for just under 9 years and didn't get a call for an inspection until this past March. My license was up in May so I told the agent he was welcome to come and inspect but I was closing everything out. He came by about a week later and picked everything up to send off to get microfisched as he put it. I'm mostly glad to be out of it.

I sat in on a “Zoom” meeting put on by Silencer Shop last week. I took this screen grab of errors that will get your FFL revoked right off the bat, although I don’t doubt they a reaching beyond this. I’ve been audited twice in the 8 or 9 years I’ve had an FFL. None until I got the SOT.

I understand and agree we don't want the government to know... but...

when I was growing up, a while back, it was assumed that everyone owned a gun and most folks owned more than one.... So, why has it changed, at least on the internet, that 'we' are supposed to hide that information?

Why not change the current game and 'we' just start publicly posting...

"I own guns and am proud of it."

quote:

Originally posted by Blume9mm:
I understand and agree we don't want the government to know... but...

Why not change the current game and 'we' just start publicly posting...

"I own guns and am proud of it."

Because it’s none of their fucking business, that’s why. Because if you haven’t been paying attention, for decades they’ve been saying that law-abiding citizens have no business owning anything more than a slingshot. They want to put together a list of where all the guns are and who owns them and you’re suggesting we go around saying we’re the people they want to make sure they have on that list so they know which doors to knock on when they’re ready?

I know you love to be a contrarian on everything, but seriously? On this? No, dude.

How about you list all your jewelry and other valuable assets on the Internet so we can all see it. Please provide an address as well so we know where it resides.

I'm easy to find... look me up at my location.. it will take you about 2 minutes to find my house...

Putting aside the obvious that 'they' know we all own guns...

Keep In mind that when the time comes they will not come for the guns first... they will come for YOU...

Thinking about what I have that some out their might want... all they have to do is peruse the classifieds here.....

You didn’t post your inventory …