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Western OR: "Man shot by cops in Seaside RV park died with his guns holstered, neighbor says" Login/Join 
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posted July 27, 2018 09:31 AM
No details on the "antique guns," presumably black powder which he could legally own despite his felony conviction.

https://www.oregonlive.com/pac...e_rv.html#incart_std

Man shot by cops in Seaside RV park died with his guns holstered, neighbor says

Updated 12:27 AM; Posted 12:20 AM

A Seaside man fatally shot by police earlier this week after authorities say he refused orders to drop two antique guns had the pistols holstered when he was killed, according to the man's neighbor.

Cashus Case, 44, was only wearing jeans and shoes when he was shot Tuesday in the RV park where he's lived for about a year near Avenue P and U.S. 101, said Michaela Wilson.

She said she was talking with Case, who is known in the area as Dino, and her boyfriend just before two Seaside police officers arrived. Case had his two black powder pistols holstered throughout their talk and when she went inside her mobile home to brush her teeth.

Wilson said she was still inside when she heard yelling and couldn't quite make what was being said. She then heard five gunshots.

She said she saw one Seaside police officer holding what appeared to be a rifle, another holding a handgun and Case lying on his back on gravel with his guns still in their holsters.

"It all happened so fast. I heard yelling briefly and then gunshots right after each other," said Wilson, 52. "He wasn't a violent person. He was clean and sober. I kept thinking he would get up, but he never did."

The two officers involved in the shooting have not yet been identified by the Clatsop County officials. Both have been placed on paid administrative leave as an investigation of the shooting continues. Case is one of 12 people who have been killed by police in Oregon this year.

The county district attorney's office said officers were responding to a report around 1:35 p.m. that Case was waving around the two pistols, and witnesses said he was upset because a dog had bitten someone else at the RV park. At least one of the officers later fired at Case when he didn't comply with their orders regarding the pistols, the district attorney's office said.

Wilson said her friend had been attacked by another resident's three dogs about an hour before the officers arrived. It was Case, who lived two mobile homes down, who heard the man's yells for help and punched and kicked the canines to get them away.

Wilson said she took her injured friend to the hospital and returned to the RV park, where Case was upset about the possibility that the dogs could attack children next.

"She better take care of those dogs tonight, or I will," Case said, according to Wilson. She said police responded after the attack and took one of the dogs away. She said she later learned that officers were called a second time by the dogs' owner, who was concerned about the safety of her pets.

Wilson said she didn't know how it escalated to Case being shot.

Case had a young daughter, she said, and worked as a gas station attendant in town. Wilson described him as a generous, loyal and "big ole goofy guy" who loved motorcycles. She said his dream was to one day build and sell custom motorcycles.

He'd been arrested in the past, she said, but he appeared to have turned his life around. His criminal history includes a January 2012 conviction for felony delivery of a controlled substance in Idaho, court records show.

The Clatsop County District Attorney's Office said that conviction barred him from possessing firearms.


"A lot of us have been arrested here and there, but that doesn't make you a bad person," Wilson said. "He wasn't some hardened, drug-crazed criminal. He didn't need to die."


-- Everton Bailey Jr.

ebailey@oregonian.com
503-221-8343; @EvertonBailey
 
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posted July 27, 2018 10:03 AMHide Post
I hope they had a body cam.


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posted July 27, 2018 10:07 AMHide Post
quote:
he refused orders to drop two antique guns had the pistols holstered when he was killed



I once had an officer ask me to unholster and hand him my pistol during an interaction. No thanks.


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Go ahead punk, make my day
posted July 27, 2018 10:16 AMHide Post
quote:
Originally posted by a1abdj:
I once had an officer ask me to unholster and hand him my pistol during an interaction. No thanks.
Agreed.
 
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posted July 27, 2018 01:05 PMHide Post
quote:
I once had an officer ask me to unholster and hand him my pistol during an interaction. No thanks.


gotta wonder which verbal skills proved helpful in surviving this little trick


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posted July 27, 2018 01:38 PMHide Post
I would rather follow the old cowboy movie practice of dropping the belt with holstered weapons. It would seem possible to communicate this intent and move slowly.


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posted July 27, 2018 02:02 PMHide Post
Starting to wonder if my answer is to slowly raise my hands, kneel and just lay down......



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posted July 27, 2018 02:09 PMHide Post
Yeah, I'm not touching a holstered gun in the presence of a frightened LEO. Better to show hands, lie face down arms out and legs crossed.

No way the officers could know, but the ATF doesn't consider black powder weapons dangerous enough for background checks.



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posted July 27, 2018 02:18 PMHide Post
quote:
Originally posted by 4MUL8R:
I would rather follow the old cowboy movie practice of dropping the belt with holstered weapons. It would seem possible to communicate this intent and move slowly.

Yeah, slow as molasses in the winter.
 
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posted July 27, 2018 02:26 PMHide Post
quote:
Originally posted by 4MUL8R:
I would rather follow the old cowboy movie practice of dropping the belt with holstered weapons. It would seem possible to communicate this intent and move slowly.


I don't know how you wear your carry belt, but mine is looped into my jean's belt loops. Simply dropping the belt with holstered gun ain't gonna happen smoothly. In that situation, I'd lay down hands spread out. I'm not even getting up if they tell me to. Come on over and handcuff me, cause I ain't moving.


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posted July 27, 2018 02:47 PMHide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Balzé Halzé:
quote:
Originally posted by 4MUL8R:
I would rather follow the old cowboy movie practice of dropping the belt with holstered weapons. It would seem possible to communicate this intent and move slowly.


I don't know how you wear your carry belt, but mine is looped into my jean's belt loops. Simply dropping the belt with holstered gun ain't gonna happen smoothly. In that situation, I'd lay down hands spread out. I'm not even getting up if they tell me to. Come on over and handcuff me, cause I ain't moving.


Both of your are making assumptions about how he was carrying them. 4MUL8R is assuming it's an actual two gun western rig, and you're assuming it's something that runs through belt loops, and those aren't the same thing at all. We all know how accurate the first news reports are of anything, and even though they used the term "holstered," we simply don't know anything of the sort. Ya'll are the first people in this thread to use the word "belt." For all we know at this point, he could've been Mexican carrying them and the cop that shot him has watched too much TV and thought he was up against Bob Munden reincarnated.

That said, if I get stopped by LEO's while I'm carrying and they order me to "drop my gun," I'm going to kneel down, cross my legs with my hands up and slowly lower myself to the ground with my hands out and not move. They can disarm me and I won't resist. I'm not going out like that poor SOB that got shot in the hotel hallway a few years ago.


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posted July 27, 2018 03:41 PMHide Post
quote:
Originally posted by P220 Smudge:

We all know how accurate the first news reports are of anything ...


In this incident, they left out the part about Case giving the officers a steely-eyed squint, throwing his serape over one shoulder and spitting tobacco juice to the side. Pretty important info.


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posted July 27, 2018 03:47 PMHide Post
quote:
Originally posted by P220 Smudge:
quote:
Originally posted by Balzé Halzé:
quote:
Originally posted by 4MUL8R:
I would rather follow the old cowboy movie practice of dropping the belt with holstered weapons. It would seem possible to communicate this intent and move slowly.


I don't know how you wear your carry belt, but mine is looped into my jean's belt loops. Simply dropping the belt with holstered gun ain't gonna happen smoothly. In that situation, I'd lay down hands spread out. I'm not even getting up if they tell me to. Come on over and handcuff me, cause I ain't moving.


Both of your are making assumptions about how he was carrying them. 4MUL8R is assuming it's an actual two gun western rig, and you're assuming it's something that runs through belt loops, and those aren't the same thing at all. We all know how accurate the first news reports are of anything, and even though they used the term "holstered," we simply don't know anything of the sort. Ya'll are the first people in this thread to use the word "belt." For all we know at this point, he could've been Mexican carrying them and the cop that shot him has watched too much TV and thought he was up against Bob Munden reincarnated.

That said, if I get stopped by LEO's while I'm carrying and they order me to "drop my gun," I'm going to kneel down, cross my legs with my hands up and slowly lower myself to the ground with my hands out and not move. They can disarm me and I won't resist. I'm not going out like that poor SOB that got shot in the hotel hallway a few years ago.


I'm not assuming anything in regards to the OP. Just saying what I would do. I took 4MUL8R's post to be referring to himself as well.


~Alan

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NRA Life Member (Patron)
God, Family, Guns, Country

Men will fight and die to protect women... because women protect everything else. ~Andrew Klavan

 
Posts: 31203 | Location: Elv. 7,000 feet, Utah | Registered: October 29, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Frangas non Flectes
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posted July 27, 2018 05:25 PMHide Post
Fair enough.

I have a hard time believing a homeless man had anything like a two gun rig, let alone holsters, and may have simply had a black powder revolver in each front pants pocket. In that case, what’s he supposed to do?


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Posts: 17911 | Location: Sonoran Desert | Registered: February 10, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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posted July 27, 2018 06:56 PMHide Post
Use of force, including deadly force, by officers these days seems more and more like their first option. Might be realted to insufficient training, substandard hiring standards, and video games where pulling the trigger is always the first option. It seems if you've spent the better part of your childhood pulling the trigger in front of a computer screen, it might require a different kind of training to "undo" that natural reflex with firearms, real or not. Sometimes if the officer is sufficiently spun up, you're gonna get dead no matter what you do, even following his orders exactly. With today's young officers all you can hope is to survive any and all encounters, no matter how mundane. People who get spun up as easily as some of them do, have no business in the LEO profession, none at all. I've seen too many videos of OIS where deadly force was not necessary or advised. Hire the wrong people, get wrong results, guaranteed every time.

Though I'm not saying this is necessarily related to this completely vague and incomplete story.




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Posts: 9163 | Location: Nowhere the constitution is not honored | Registered: February 01, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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posted July 27, 2018 07:00 PMHide Post
I was referring to myself. I will gladly drop trousers belt holsters and all if this will help an officer relax.


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posted July 27, 2018 07:03 PMHide Post
sounds like out and out murder



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posted July 27, 2018 07:38 PMHide Post
We all want to be differential to our LEO members and assume each and every one is only out for the best outcome. From the number of these incidents, its more likely that some percentage don't know how to handle people. Maybe they just wanted a few weeks of "Paid leave" after a hard couple of days of ticket writing. They know that courts and juries just don't want to upset the apple cart. They just look at the dead guys social status (bottom rung), then get nervous and shoot the bastard.

If things played out as the always correct press said, the guy was a dead man when first spotted by the cops. I do hope they have body camera's and they had them turned on. Even if they did, they agenda won't release the pictures unless they support the lies first put out to calm things down. One huge problem is allowing the police agency involved control the release of the photos, if any.


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posted July 27, 2018 08:02 PMHide Post
quote:
Originally posted by 4MUL8R:
I was referring to myself. I will gladly drop trousers belt holsters and all if this will help an officer relax.


This for sure. I much prefer dropping trow and living, to touching my gun around a cop hopped up on adrenaline.



Jesse

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posted July 27, 2018 08:11 PMHide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Skins2881:
quote:
Originally posted by 4MUL8R:
I was referring to myself. I will gladly drop trousers belt holsters and all if this will help an officer relax.


This for sure. I much prefer dropping trow and living, to touching my gun around a cop hopped up on adrenaline.


Copy that, gentlemen. Apologies for reading you wrong.

This is one shoot we really need to see the bodycams on.


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