SIGforum
Total engine failure in a Cessna
March 06, 2022, 06:19 PM
MikeinNCTotal engine failure in a Cessna
I think he’s gonna need more than one tube of JB Weld to fix that block.
"Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor.” Robert A. Heinlein
“You may beat me, but you will never win.” sigmonkey-2020
“A single round of buckshot to the torso almost always results in an immediate change of behavior.” Chris Baker March 06, 2022, 06:26 PM
Skins2881quote:
Originally posted by tigereye313:
quote:
Originally posted by honestlou:
I don't know much about flying, but couldn't the tower have helped him out with more precise control of his descent? It looked like he barely made the runway, which was fine, but he didn't need the whole runway, so wouldn't he have been better off with a little more margin for error? Could the tower not see his altitude and rate of descent and tell him where and when to turn?
With engine out there is a specific airspeed for each specific model that gives you the best glide ratio and you trim for that speed. As far as the landing it looked like he put it right on the numbers to me. It would have been difficult to have done much better.
Knowing nothing about airplanes, how does the pilot know what speed and approach angle allows him to have lift as he approaches the runway? I assume too fast, hard to land, too slow and you go nose first into tarmac?
Jesse
Sic Semper Tyrannis March 06, 2022, 06:39 PM
trapper189Where would you like me to park it?
That's essentially what he was asking as he was coasting down the runway. A real life Iceman.
March 06, 2022, 06:41 PM
kkinaquote:
Originally posted by Mars_Attacks:
The engine had almost no time on it and the rebuilder left a part off the crankshaft so it failed catastrophically when a counterweight came off.
How'd you get this, M_A? The Youtube notes say no word yet on cause of failure.
March 06, 2022, 06:46 PM
tigereye313quote:
Originally posted by Skins2881:
Knowing nothing about airplanes, how does the pilot know what speed and approach angle allows him to have lift as he approaches the runway? I assume too fast, hard to land, too slow and you go nose first into tarmac?
With the engine out you've lost the forward component of thrust. Without that component there is a specific angle of attack that provides optimal lift to provide the most horizontal distance with the least amount of altitude lost. It is best to trim the elevator to maintain that angle of attack to eke out every bit of horizontal distance you can. Too fast (nose below optimal) and you're losing altitude faster. Too slow (nose above optimal) and you risk continuing to decelerate and approach stalling speed. Once this is established it becomes an exercise in maneuvering the plane to the intended approach at a manageable altitude to ideally fly a downwind, base and final leg as normally as possible.
If you end up on final with too much altitude you can make s-turns to bleed the excess before touchdown if necessary or perform a slip. Once you are at a low enough altitude to begin the flare (controlled stall above the runway) the rest of landing proceeds as though the engine is at idle.
March 06, 2022, 06:46 PM
229DAKquote:
Originally posted by Skins2881:
Knowing nothing about airplanes, how does the pilot know what speed and approach angle allows him to have lift as he approaches the runway?
Experience. Practice for emergencies. Know your airplane and its limitations.
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March 06, 2022, 06:52 PM
armedmdAmazing job by the pilot in the video. I’m not a pilot but have thought about taking lessons and getting my license. I’ve learned a little about different planes and know some have an emergency parachute. I don’t think the plane in the video has that option available but would this be a scenario to use the emergency parachute or would the preferred approach be to do as the pilot in the video did and land the plane. I’m sure there are a lot of variables to consider. Just curious for input from the pilots.
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March 06, 2022, 07:04 PM
nhracecraft^^^It's ALWAYS preferable to land the plane...
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March 06, 2022, 07:08 PM
darthfusterMust have been the 7th fetzer valve. They can patch that up with some 3in1 oil, ball bearings and some gauze.
You’re a lying dog-faced pony soldier March 06, 2022, 07:18 PM
Mars_Attacksquote:
Originally posted by kkina:
quote:
Originally posted by Mars_Attacks:
The engine had almost no time on it and the rebuilder left a part off the crankshaft so it failed catastrophically when a counterweight came off.
How'd you get this, M_A? The Youtube notes say no word yet on cause of failure.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xISZ04DZK1A
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March 06, 2022, 07:19 PM
tigereye313quote:
Originally posted by armedmd:
Amazing job by the pilot in the video. I’m not a pilot but have thought about taking lessons and getting my license. I’ve learned a little about different planes and know some have an emergency parachute. I don’t think the plane in the video has that option available but would this be a scenario to use the emergency parachute or would the preferred approach be to do as the pilot in the video did and land the plane. I’m sure there are a lot of variables to consider. Just curious for input from the pilots.
This feller was really lucky there was another airport straight ahead with a choice of runways and light winds. It was an ideal scenario for a power off landing and he did a great job.
If I were presented with his scenario I'd like to think I would go ahead and land the plane. If I were faced with a poor choice of landing sites or strong/gusty winds the parachute might be more attractive if the plane were equipped.
I did see a video of a Cirrus (parachute equipped) that was trying to complete an emergency landing, stalled on base to final and entered a flat spin crashing in a parking lot. I suppose a lot of it has to do with experience, time in the aircraft, and good management of speed and altitude.
March 06, 2022, 07:22 PM
kkinaquote:
Originally posted by darthfuster:
Must have been the 7th fetzer valve. They can patch that up with some 3in1 oil, ball bearings and some gauze.
Don't forget the anti-freeze.
March 06, 2022, 07:52 PM
OzarkwoodsLet me guess, he won’t be sending the mechanic a gift card for Christmas this year!
ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
March 06, 2022, 08:06 PM
V-TailI found that a few instructional flights in a glider can do wonders for a pilot's proficiency in power-off landings.
הרחפת שלי מלאה בצלופחים March 06, 2022, 08:09 PM
tigereye313quote:
Originally posted by V-Tail:
I found that a few instructional flights in a glider can do wonders for a pilot's proficiency in power-off landings.
I would love to get a glider rating.
Guess I would have to return to flying first...
March 06, 2022, 09:44 PM
HGWTJWHReminds me of seeing Bob Hoover at an air show. He took off and did some stunts. Then shut off the engines and did a couple more. Landed and rolled back to the spot he started from.
March 06, 2022, 09:44 PM
VictimNoMoreA job well done. Very fortunate to have a nice runway 7 miles off his nose.
It’s all about energy management, as has been said.
Armedmd- I fly out of the Huntington-Charleston area, if you need any info and want to pursue this further, my email is in my profile.
March 06, 2022, 10:02 PM
911Boss“How far can this thing fly without an engine?”
“All the way to the scene of the crash…”(Apologies to Ron White
)
What part of "...Shall not be infringed" don't you understand???
March 06, 2022, 10:06 PM
MikeinNCquote:
Originally posted by kkina:
quote:
Originally posted by darthfuster:
Must have been the 7th fetzer valve. They can patch that up with some 3in1 oil, ball bearings and some gauze.
Don't forget the anti-freeze.
It’s all ball bearings nowadays.
"Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor.” Robert A. Heinlein
“You may beat me, but you will never win.” sigmonkey-2020
“A single round of buckshot to the torso almost always results in an immediate change of behavior.” Chris Baker March 06, 2022, 11:09 PM
sns3guppyThe airplane does not require an engine to fly. Just to go up, and then one can still go up, if one manages the airplane, properly.
Every student pilot is expected to be able to glide to a landing. I would never let a student solo or recommend a student for any certificate or rating, if unable to do so. It's taught from the first flight lesson.
Best glide speed is typically the same speed, or close to the same speed, that one normally climbs in a light airplane, and at which one approaches to land.
The airplane is just as controllable in a glide as in powered flight. Typically one is better off arriving a little high, when without power and gliding to a forced landing, because one can slip the airplane, applying extra drag to control the descent, and then stop slipping when desired and back on the correct glide path. One can't really create thrust, but one can temporarily create drag.
A student pilot is expected to be able to demonstrate a power off landing to a specific point on the runway. Likewise, any instructor worth his or her salt will work to get the student comfortable with off-field landings, and selecting the proper surface. Basic airmanship, in a light single engine airplane, is always keeping a viable surface within gliding distance. It's part of managing a flight.
It's never a matter of if the engine will fail. Only a matter of when.