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Two german cops shot on traffic stop
I wonder what the motive will turn out to be? R.I.P. | ||
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| I can't tell if I'm tired, or just lazy  |
Not enough information to even hazard a wild guess at this point. _____________________________ "The problems we face today exist because the people who work for a living are outnumbered by those who vote for a living." "Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety" Benjamin Franklin | |||
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Only the strong survive |
Looks like they were poachers. 41 | |||
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Shall Not Be Infringed |
Suspicious vehicle, dead game...Poaching? You'd think they'd have radioed the plate of the vehicle to dispatch prior getting out and approaching the 'suspicious vehicle'. That's kinda' LE 101, so I assume they're not sharing that info with the public just yet. I wonder if there's a 'migrant enclave' in the vicinity... ____________________________________________________________ If Some is Good, and More is Better.....then Too Much, is Just Enough !! Trump 2024....Make America Great Again! "May Almighty God bless the United States of America" - parabellum 7/26/20 Live Free or Die! | |||
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Fighting the good fight |
One of the suspects is reportedly "known to the police because of a hit-and-run incident. The man was said to possess a weapons permit." https://www.dw.com/en/germany-...ffic-stop/a-60606761
That was my first though too, but it could be anything at this point.
Yep. What is known by the police is very different from what is known by the media. When the BBC says "there is no description of the attackers, the vehicle, or the direction they fled", that just means no description that the BBC has been made aware of. | |||
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| Official forum SIG Pro enthusiast  |
Does Germany have many cameras on their roads/highways? I hope they catch the parasites who did that. What is the most severe punishment they could face in Germany? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ The price of liberty and even of common humanity is eternal vigilance | |||
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| Member |
It has been a while since I was in Europe. But when I was there on Uncle Sugars dime, we were told absolutely do not mess with the German cops. Dont be surprised if the people responsible for this get ventilated. End of Earth: 2 Miles Upper Peninsula: 4 Miles | |||
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| SIGforum's Berlin Correspondent  |
https://m.dw.com/en/germany-po...-shooting/a-60614395 This happened next to the electoral district of my previous boss. Investigations were reportedly aided considerably by the ID card of the older suspect, a game trader, being found at the scene. The apparent poaching background partially explains the ready use of firearms, though going from unlicensed killing of animals to murdering police officers is a rather sharp escalation. The male officer reportedly got off some rounds of his own; the main suspect's car was found with some bullet holes, though it's not clear from which gun. His female colleague was still an apprentice. While this is rare in Germany, it's not unheard of. In 1991, two brothers lured a cruiser to a remote parking area near Holzminden, Lower Saxony with a fake call about a game accident and killed both officers with a G3 stolen from an army barracks; the motive was a general hate of cops. In 2007, two officers were shot while they had a lunch break in their car in Heilbronn, Baden-Württemberg. A female officer died while her male colleague survived with a headshot, but no memory of events. In 2011 their duty guns were found with the two dead members of the National Socialist Underground terror cell which had also murdered nine immigrant shopkeepers and committed a xenophobic bomb attack. It's assumed that the two officers were targets of opportunity. | |||
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| Get my pies outta the oven!  |
Same here. I was told they had the power to get blood from you on the spot if you refused a breathalyzer if pulled over for drunk driving. And they often toted MP5's or Uzis. | |||
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| Back, and to the left  |
I was thinking the same. That idiom, generalized was 'Don't fuck with the Polizei', and everyone I ever spoke to seemed to put it exactly that way. I have wondered in recent years just how they have been affected by the new, kinder, gentler policing trends in western society.  | |||
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| Too old to run, too mean to quit! |
My brother in law married the daughter of a fairly high ranking officer in the Hessen State Police. I had more than a few very interesting discussions with him. And, just for those who have never been there, it was never wise to hassle the polizei or refuse to follow their orders. Elk There has never been an occasion where a people gave up their weapons in the interest of peace that didn't end in their massacre. (Louis L'Amour) "To compel a man to furnish contributions of money for the propagation of opinions which he disbelieves and abhors, is sinful and tyrannical. " -Thomas Jefferson "America is great because she is good. If America ceases to be good, America will cease to be great." Alexis de Tocqueville FBHO!!! The Idaho Elk Hunter | |||
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| Freethinker |
Even without the recovered ID, my first question was how the murderers thought they would get away with something like that. In the US any such stop/contact would involve the police notifying their dispatch with vehicle information, to include license plate. Any idea if that’s the norm in Germany? “I can’t give you brains, but I can give you a diploma.” — The Wizard of Oz This life is a drill. It is only a drill. If it had been a real life, you would have been given instructions about where to go and what to do. | |||
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| Member |
I cant say how the Germans conduct a traffic stop but the Italian Carabinieri used to snag me like this: A blue and white Alfa-Romeo with tiny rotating blue light would bust up on my six, get my tag number and then pass me and pull ahead. Once out front, they would then block the street. They ran two man cars and did cover / contact with the cover man holding a Beretta or HK MP5 at the ready while business was conducted. End of Earth: 2 Miles Upper Peninsula: 4 Miles | |||
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Member |
If there was a little more ventilating there might be fewer incidents of this kind. Just saying. | |||
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| Muzzle flash aficionado  |
I was stationed ar Ramstein AB in Germany in the late 1970s, and back then all the cops carried MP5s. They'd levy a fine for traffic violations and you paid them directly. They had no sense of humor. flashguy Texan by choice, not accident of birth | |||
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Member |
My wife spent nearly 2 years of her life (over 35 trips) working in Italy. Even though she never needed a car, she traveled extensively by train sightseeing on weekends. The first thing her Italian co-workers told her was the carabinieri were the last people you should fuck with.  Harshest Dream, Reality | |||
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| Member |
Way back in the way back I was in Northern Germany. There was a big Futbol match. Hooligans were waling to the stadium. I forgot who was playing, but there was a massive Polizei presence. They were in riot gear and ready for anything. I saw one of them and said something like "Looks like there may be trouble tonight." He looked at me shook his head "No," patted his night stick and said the German version of "There will be no trouble at all..." Don't mess with them. | |||
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| SIGforum's Berlin Correspondent |
I suspect that like people frequently will in such situations, they didn't think at all. Or unless there's more to the story than we know, they would have made the mental calculation that up to five years of prison for poaching isn't worth covering up with the risk of a life sentence for aggravated murder (in practice, anywhere between 16 and 60 years). I'm pretty sure the plates got called in before the control proper started, too. The classic MP5 is widely being replaced as the standard patrol gun by various rifles due to evolving threats like school shootings, terrorist attacks etc.; only last week a student of Uni Heidelberg with a prior history of schizophrenia went into a lecture hall with a shotgun and a lever-action rifle he reportedly bought in Austria, and shot four, one of whom died, before killing himself. The G36K/C is now in use with federal agencies and the state of Saxony-Anhalt, the HK416 with 11" barrel (G38) in Hesse, the SIG MCX in Berlin, Rhineland-Palatinate and Schleswig-Holstein, the Haenel CR223 in Saxony, and the SCAR-L in Bavaria; Brandenburg and Baden-Württemberg have introduced the MP7. | |||
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| Freethinker |
That happens in the US all the time, but because of the rarity of such crimes in places like Germany, it’s easy(ier) to forget that people are people everywhere. “I can’t give you brains, but I can give you a diploma.” — The Wizard of Oz This life is a drill. It is only a drill. If it had been a real life, you would have been given instructions about where to go and what to do. | |||
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| SIGforum's Berlin Correspondent |
Well it turns out the main suspect, named as Andreas S., has a bit of history. Though he was never convicted, he has been under investigation for poaching and trying to run over a witness with a car in 2017 (but hunting buddies gave him an alibi), delaying to file for insolvency of his game trade in 2020, not paying social insurance for staff at the bakery he also ran, etc. He did lose his gun permit and hunting license at some point; though that obviously didn't detain him, since a number of long guns were found at his place. He isn't talking; his co-suspect has admitted to poaching, but denies to have been involved with the murder. Still, both a shotgun and a hunting rifle were used against the female and male officer respectively, both with headshots. The former seems to have died instantly while the other took four rounds, but managed to empty his entire pistol magazine in return; in RLP, this would have been a Walther P99. No word on whether either of the suspects were hit rather than just their vehicle. The officers were both in uniform and wearing body armor, but were in an unmarked car as part of a different search when they encountered the van they radioed was full of dead game. They had the sense to request backup before starting the control, but responders didn't arrive on the scene until ten minutes later. | |||
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