This could get long....

I "help" a friend of the family out with technology. He is older (80+) and has ZERO patience. He gets frustrated Very quickly and easily if he thinks things aren't going his way.
Up until just a few years ago, he would just be called an asshole. These days....well, we won't get into that. I feel obligated because he is married into a family that goes back several generations with my own. We are close. That is a thread/story in and of itself.

This man trusts me and is his calmest around me with regards to "computer stuff". I am the buffer between his lack of anger management and tech support.

His old version of Outlook has finally stopped being supported by his email provider. He checks his email between his desktop and occasionally a laptop. He has always had the laptop setup IMAP and the desktop setup POP.
Well, that needs to change since he can't always get to his office. (his health has been going down lately and he will use his laptop in the bedroom or living room). Also, I really have concerns about his mental faculties because all I seem to go out there for these days is account credential stuff. He has quite a bit of stuff set up online and handles most of it reasonable well most of the time. But new accounts and processes; he just can't seem to grasp like he did in the past.
So.... I suggested upgrading to Office365, and setting up his email with IMAP on both devices. That way any changes are reflected no matter which device he uses.
So I made him a MS account, logged into it, and used his debit card to purchase Office365.
I got Office365 downloaded to the desktop, but when I tried to log in on his laptop I got the "Password incorrect" prompt.
Hmmm...
I checked my notes and tried again...same thing.
Well crap.
Lets get the desktop finished up while I think about this...
I go to activate Office....password incorrect.
GRRRR!!!!
did I fatfinger the PW when I put it in the first time? Possibly.

But now, I can't reset the password using the online tools. And according to the one tech support number I was able to find, you can only reset passwords online.

I will admit I have put off dealing with Office365 for this very reason. Plus I just don't agree with the subscription based aspect of it.
I am pretty sure the Debit card transaction went through, but I haven't had him verify that yet. That is my next step. Plus, it sure acted like it went through although I can't get the confirmation email now.

So...am I/we screwed? Is there any way to reset this or back out of the transaction?
The online tools ask all sorts of questions about emails that you have sent, but its a brand new account, there is no traffic on it yet.

I guess we could refute the charges on his debit card and start over. I dunno. But its a mess.
Sometimes I really dislike technology.

And yes, I could have set him up on Thunderbird, but he has used Outlook for years and is used to the interface.

any help is appreciated.
Experiences like this make me wonder how anyone ever falls for the "I am from Microsoft and we noticed problems with your computer" scams.

We switched to office365 at work for everything including email.

somehow i was able to change my password initially, but now there is no option anywhere to change it. half the people still have the default password.

also we're required to use the authenticator app when logging in to email. exept on iphones, no authenticator needed, but android users and practically everyone else that uses a computer, authenticator app required.

our dispatchers all use one email address and everytime someone new logs in from somewhere else, it goes to my phone to authenticate because i set it up the first time.
it's stupid.

Why even bother using an application like Outlook?

Just use web based email and be done with it.

Yep. It’s a mess. It seems that there are certainly several ways to screw the pooch in this process.
And on this one, I feel responsible.

Perhaps I’ll just have him refute the charges (my dislike of debit cards is another thread as well). Then I’ll wade through the process of teaching him Thunderbird or something similar.

This sucks.

quote:

Originally posted by PASig:
Why even bother using an application like Outlook?

Just use web based email and be done with it.

Did you read the part where I mentioned he has used Outlook for years? And that there are some difficulties involved in teaching him new things with regards to technology?

Hit caps lock then type it in ignoring the fact you have caps lock on.

quote:

Originally posted by Oz_Shadow:
Hit caps lock then type it in ignoring the fact you have caps lock on.

Believe it or not, I tried that.

Oh how I long for the days when you just bought software and installed it.
And printer drivers came on a single 3.5” disk.

Tell him whatever you want and set him up with a simple email program. If I were not in business I would get next to Zero emails. What does he use email for anyway?? Can he text, use face time and an Ipad. I use email for business nothing else. BTW I would guess we have some mild cognitive impairment going on as well.

I am thinking you may have set a password for a "Microsoft" account.
Verify by seeing if he can still access his IMAP email on the other device(s).

If that works, then deleted create a new profile on the PC using his "known" email and password.
Once you are able to get email to work, then you can delete the original profile..

If it is an issue with the "admin" account, typically Microsoft sort of "forces/coerces" you to create a :Microsoft" account during setup, and often you can bypass that. However you do need an "admin" account for the online/MS 365 administration of the account, although you can set up multiple email accounts (and in some versions of 365, up to 5 user accounts for other family/friends to use under the subscription).

And while you are setting up accounts, use IMAP for all of them, set up archiving, as well. No real need for a pop and IMAP as that can become more confusing over time for him.

If you need help with this, my email is in my profile, and I'll do what I can to assist.

quote:

Originally posted by ZSMICHAEL:
Tell him whatever you want and set him up with a simple email program. If I were not in business I would get next to Zero emails. What does he use email for anyway?? Can he text, use face time and an Ipad. I use email for business nothing else. BTW I would guess we have some mild cognitive impairment going on as well.

No FaceTime, no iPad. His iPhone is challenge enough. I’ve never delved into his email requirements. It’s always just been “for his business”.
We are talking about someone 30+ years my senior. He grew up with my parents, was in the Marines, and drove truck during the same timespan as my Dad. It takes tact to get forceful with him.

I think my best plan of action is to try to get his $70 back, then set Thunderbird up on both devices. I use thunderbird so I can at least provide some tech support. I’d use the windows mail app, but the desktop is win10 and the laptop is win7. I’d like to keep the interfaces as similar as possible. Just to give a bit more insight; I had to hand write instructions on shutting down the computer.
He can’t seem to follow them. He just leaves them on all the time. And of course windows Resume causes issues. I need to disable all of that.

Sigmonkey;

These are both existing Installs of windows. The windows 10 PC was an upgrade from win7. The laptop has been left at Win7.
So, no .Ms accounts for the OS, it’s all local accounts.

I’ll slog through this, with lots of sighing from him in the background, and lots of handwritten notes on my part.

I’ve had to start putting my name and dates on password changes and such. His kids help him from time to time and that can be as much of a detriment as a help. None of them live close.

Here’s another tidbit…when HE changes a password…he will write down, in cursive. So there is always a question on case of letters, and whether a number is spelled out, or should be “a number”.

Lots of indicators to cause worry from a medical standpoint, beyond the tech issues.

Gotcha.

I do understand the dilemma.

Offer stands, if you need it.

Hudr, you've entered the deep, dark Abyss of MS licensing, MS Online world and password insanity.

Gmail stopped supporting Outlook. I was able to find a workaround - you have to go into gmail via web, enable two factor authentication, and the set up a new device. The web site will generate a code you enter into the outlook password prompt. I’ll see if I can find the article I used.

https://answers.microsoft.com/...e1-a8bb-d5db5cba8b0c

If Att.net is his email provider just change to Gmail. Att became problematic a couple of years ago. I do not have
any problems with Outlook & Gmail. Web based email's work OK unless you have to catagorize & file emails by client as I need to do.

quote:

Originally posted by 2PAK:
Hudr, you've entered the deep, dark Abyss of MS licensing, MS Online world and password insanity.

Exactly. And I thought it was confusing enough 20 years ago when I was trying to “get legal” as IT admin of an Exchange4 server and a couple file/print servers on a 200ish PC network.
It could break your budget to have all your MS Office copies and your Server CALs up to snuff.

quote:

Originally posted by dbgeek:
Gmail stopped supporting Outlook. I was able to find a workaround - you have to go into gmail via web, enable two factor authentication, and the set up a new device.

Same with my older version of Thunderbird. This happened the end of May, I believe. TB is now considered an "insecure app". Go to your Google account, enable 2FA, and then create an app specific password. I did this and the one password works for TB on all three of my Macs.
 
And 2FA becomes no hassle at all when accessing other Google services. Log in once with 2FA on each device, and be sure to check "trust this device". Then you will no longer need to use 2FA on that device for any Google services login.

quote:

Originally posted by Chowser:
We switched to office365 at work for everything including email.

somehow i was able to change my password initially, but now there is no option anywhere to change it. half the people still have the default password.

also we're required to use the authenticator app when logging in to email. exept on iphones, no authenticator needed, but android users and practically everyone else that uses a computer, authenticator app required.

our dispatchers all use one email address and everytime someone new logs in from somewhere else, it goes to my phone to authenticate because i set it up the first time.
it's stupid.

Try Alt-Ctrl-Del and see if change password is an option on the menu that comes up. This is assuming your Office 365 and Windows credentials are the same.

quote:

Originally posted by henryaz:

quote:

Originally posted by dbgeek:
Gmail stopped supporting Outlook.

Same with my older version of Thunderbird.

More accurately: Gmail stopped supporting plain old IMAP/submission email. At least not w/o jumping through hoops.

They'd been locking-out my email client occasionally for a year or two, forcing me to re-confirm I wanted to use those "insecure apps," before I finally got fed up, moved everything out of Gmail I wanted to keep, deleted the rest, and removed the Gmail configs from my computers and mobile devices.

I detest Google for many reasons. This be one of those many reasons.

quote:

did I fatfinger the PW when I put it in the first time? Possibly.

Yeah, that can be a problem.
Especially when you just paid for a subscription.
Otherwise I say to just do another MS account..

Ironically, just had a similar scenario at a client yesterday.
Had a local account password he forgot to his local system and I reset with software.
Not so much for his MS email account.
He couldn't remember the PW on that either for sure.
Tried multiple iterations = no go.
Eventually tried to reset but MS Security said to wait 24 hours - tried to much.
So I started looking through his saved Password Settings in Edge Browser and eventually found the correct one.
Whew, lucked out on that.

So I would say to peruse the saved Password in the browser.
If saved are available in Edge or Chrome as the Control Panel Credential Manager.
I don't advise remembering critical accounts this way but is convenient on regular account of lower security stature.

Maybe you will get lucky or you will have to go through the long-winded approach MS has set up.
I don't like to have to do it but I understand it from a security standpoint.

Good Luck