quote:

Originally posted by arcwelder76:

quote:

Originally posted by PowerSurge:

quote:

Originally posted by arcwelder76:

quote:

Originally posted by PowerSurge:
Integrity isn’t earned, but you can sure as shit lose it in a heartbeat.

Would you care to explain why you think integrity isn't earned?

By definition:

in·teg·ri·ty
/inˈteɡrədē/
Learn to pronounce
noun
1.
the quality of being honest and having strong moral principles; moral uprightness.


You’re confusing integrity with trust:

trust
n. Firm belief in the integrity, ability, or character of a person or thing; confidence or reliance.

No, I'm not. You haven't explained why you believe integrity isn't earned.

Trust can be earned, not integrity. I don’t need to explain it because it’s been defined for us. Not going to debate it with you.

arcwelder76,

I am confused by your stances. You seem very self assured to the point of righteousness in you belief of what integrity entails. Folks come in here and give you opinions that are not refutations or contradictions of your statement, but merely opinions that dovetail in a general direction. And yet, you come back and refute their opinions. We can agree on the definition of integrity, but the rest of how we get it, how we expend it, or how we can rebuild it is subjective. ¿… qué pasa?

quote:

Originally posted by PowerSurge:
Trust can be earned, not integrity. I don’t need to explain it because it’s been defined for us. Not going to debate it with you.

Integrity is something someone has, earns, through their actions towards others and the world at large. You can trust someone, and they can have your trust, can you integrity them? Wouldn't you say that someone who is trustworthy has integrity? If integrity can't be earned, how do people gain or lose it?

What's the point of having a discussion if things are "spelled out" in the "dictionary?" I dunno. Why bother participating in a "discussion board."

quote:

Originally posted by Sigolicious:
arcwelder76,

I am confused by your stances. You seem very self assured to the point of righteousness in you belief of what integrity entails. Folks come in here and give you opinions that are not refutations or contradictions of your statement, but merely opinions that dovetail in a general direction. And yet, you come back and refute their opinions. We can agree on the definition of integrity, but the rest of how we get it, how we expend it, or how we can rebuild it is subjective. ¿… qué pasa?

Well, I wanted to talk about integrity, personal responsibility, and the world today. That's what I'm doing. It may seem like a simple dictionary definition, but what I'm after is the changing nature of how people behave in the world. Getting challenged and challenging back used to be called discussion or debate.

Do the right thing. If everyone would just be guided by that, we'd all be better off. I mean the principle, not the film. It's a good movie, but Spike Lee kind of irritates me.

quote:

Originally posted by arcwelder76:

quote:

Originally posted by Sigolicious:
arcwelder76,

I am confused by your stances. You seem very self assured to the point of righteousness in you belief of what integrity entails. Folks come in here and give you opinions that are not refutations or contradictions of your statement, but merely opinions that dovetail in a general direction. And yet, you come back and refute their opinions. We can agree on the definition of integrity, but the rest of how we get it, how we expend it, or how we can rebuild it is subjective. ¿… qué pasa?

Well, I wanted to talk about integrity, personal responsibility, and the world today. That's what I'm doing. It may seem like a simple dictionary definition, but what I'm after is the changing nature of how people behave in the world. Getting challenged and challenging back used to be called discussion or debate.

Do the right thing. If everyone would just be guided by that, we'd all be better off. I mean the principle, not the film. It's a good movie, but Spike Lee kind of irritates me.

I see the desire for discussion, but some of your responses seemed to draw a line that closed off the avenue for that challenge part of discussion. I dunno, maybe it's the world we live in, the internets, and I have become sensitized into not wanting to overstep bounds and cause a ruckus. It's hard to tell in the now how some typed out words will be received.

Back to your regularly scheduled discussion.

quote:

If integrity can't be earned, how do people gain or lose it?

I believe 'integrity' is a quality one possesses thru behavior and convictions; recognition of such is recognized by others as a quality of the the behavior/etc.

I believe 'recognition' of integrity can be earned, as an application/accolade of other parties. 'Integrity' is a quality integral with a subject's individual behavior. It can be gained or lost by behavior. One is either brave or not brave in certain conditions. Recognition of that behavior is applied from others noting that behavior. Neither is assigned and spooned into the individual by other parties. It is the individual who has to perform either quality of behavior to be recognized.

Integrity is the courage to do what’s right even when it is not convenient or no one else is looking. I don't think you earn that. You can learn that. One's reputation for integrity can earn respect. You can earn a reputation for having integrity but not earn integrity itself.

I think integrity can be refined.

I earned the respect of others by doing the right thing. That sounds about right.

By doing the right thing, even when no one was looking, I earned my integrity. Well, that makes no sense.

Integrity is a personal choice.
Integrity leads to being trusted by others.

Do you trust Mitt or Lindsey?

You earn trust.

You have integrity.

Next.

I think that integrity is the attempt at a moral conviction to do the right thing.

There's not always a clear cut, black and white, right thing. Sometimes, it is the lesser of evils. But, our personal integrity pushes each of us to make the best choice out of the choices given. It is often not the perfect choice, due to the perfect choice just not existing. I only say that due to reading "do the right thing when no one is looking" as being the standard, and know many people who made a choice with integrity, although the choice was impure.

And I think that character leads to earning respect.

quote:

Originally posted by arcwelder76:

Do the right thing. If everyone would just be guided by that, we'd all be better off. I mean the principle, not the film. It's a good movie, but Spike Lee kind of irritates me.

This.
I'll add that it's hard for most people and I agree that it's not just Millenials.
The right thing in your personal life and the right thing in your work life.
I don't care if you cook burgers at McDonald's or you own a multi million dollar company, do the right thing.
Respect goes with trust and integrity. Basically IMO, all 3 are connected to each other. How can you trust if you have no respect?
I inherited my business. My grandfather started it when he left Greece for America in the 1940's. Passed on to my father who is semi retired and winters in Florida. Passed on to me and my 2 younger brothers.
I try my hardest to do the right thing at work because it's my business. I also try in my personal life. Does that give me integrity?
It's a tricky word and means different things to different people. Some don't or won't care, some wear it as a badge. Some do it because they know someone is watching and judging. They do the right thing out of a type of fear. Others do it because that's how they were raised. They don't want accolades, a pat on the back or anything. They just do it.
Good discussion Arc.

quote:

Originally posted by RHINOWSO:
You earn trust.

You have integrity.

Next.

What, no meme?

quote:

You earn trust.

You have integrity.

nailed it

quote:

Originally posted by jljones:
I think that integrity is the attempt at a moral conviction to do the right thing.

There's not always a clear cut, black and white, right thing. Sometimes, it is the lesser of evils. But, our personal integrity pushes each of us to make the best choice out of the choices given. It is often not the perfect choice, due to the perfect choice just not existing. I only say that due to reading "do the right thing when no one is looking" as being the standard, and know many people who made a choice with integrity, although the choice was impure.

And I think that character leads to earning respect.

I think that there are a lot of pieces to this puzzle and Jerry has some of them. Sometimes one finds themself in a shit salad sandwich of a situation: Someone is going to get screwed and you “get” (have?) to choose who is the unlucky winner. What is your first thought? “How do I protect myself?” or “What is fair/right?” The answer to that question says a lot about the integrity of a person. Do you worry more about the harm/disadvantage/loss to you, or the harm you may cause to others? We all know folks for whom the true answer would be former to either question and (hopefully) folks for whom the true answer would be the latter. Even folks who think more about others and what is right may sometimes make the wrong decision and hurt the wrong person, but it is out of an honest mistake, not out of greedy self interest.