quote:

Originally posted by 6guns:
bionic, you live in Missouri, how can you advise?

6guns, not personal, and not a jab at you, but please let's stop this line of thought.

If you're not from Virginia you can't have an opinion?

We're all Americans, are we not? If this is happening to my fellow Americans, I can sympathize and feel your pain. And I can and will advise you not to comply.

You may not think it matters, but I assure you it does. What do you think the rest of American gun owners think about supporting you if you refuse to comply? If there's mass video and media of law enforcement ripping rifles from the hands of the citizenry, how do you think we will respond to that?

And the reverse is also true. If you lay down and turn in all your stuff, how do you think we will respond to that? What level of support can you possibly expect?

What has been said by Rhino, Para, and others is how I feel. I will not comply. Plain and simple. And I do sympathize. I don't have the money for lawyers either. And I do have a wife and kids to think about. And I do enjoy my life.

But I don't value my situation, my station, nor my life above my liberty. My grandfather didn't fly belly-gunner in a B-24 over Europe to watch me give away my guns to a slimy floor-flushing politician. My father-in-law didn't slog through Vietnam and make it back home to watch me turn in my rifle.

What would your ancestor's say? Could you look them in the eye? I said every man must decide at times to do what is lawful or what is moral. The two are not always in alignment.

As for myself, I will not comply.

That’s damn right!

This country is heading for war. Shit like this is just throwing gas on a fire.

In another thread Parabellum asked for ideas for the next MAGA hat. I think it ought to read: Live Free or Die 2020. Bright red.

And we wondered how an entire country like Australia could just hand over their firearms.

I obviously don't live in Virginia, but that list of new control bills nevertheless felt like a punch in the gut because the possibility of that coming to my front yard is that much more real now. Or feels like it anyway.

So yes. Do not comply. You must not comply. All gun owners must stand firm on that.

quote:

Originally posted by Andyb:

quote:

Originally posted by Skins2881:

quote:

Originally posted by bionic218:
FFS, Rhino nailed it back on page two. Stop with all the hand-wringing bullcrap. Do. Not. Comply.

It really is that simple. The best defense against a terrible law is mass public refusal to comply.

A man must do what is lawful and what is moral. When those two paths conflict, a man must make a decision.

Make your decision.

I don't have $30,000-millions to defend myself. I'll sell my AR and mags or move. I'd love to resist, but my responsibility is to my family first. Call me a wimp or whatever you will.

I like to think about hiding my stuff then fighting to SCOTUS if the secret police show up to my house, I just can't afford it. This is exactly how they win I know, but I'm not going to risk my ability to own guns or put my family at financial risk.

What's a guy to do?

Not a jab at you directly, but this attitude is exactly what will happen with the majority of gun owners and what the commie bastards are counting on. At some point we won't be able to pass it down the line to the next guy.

Moving or non compliance are really the only options to me...and at some point we won't be able to move out of the bullshit.

OK to say when you live in OK. Hell I would have said same thing 12 months ago. I live in a state where they elected a racist blackflace or possibly KKK member governor who also dawns blackface for danceoff competitions. His Lt. Governor is an 'acredibly accused rapist.' He believes in killing babies after birth if they fail to kill it properly prior to birth. Then there is the AG. Fuck my life.

I'm fighting an uphill battle with all the cards stacked against me. Family comes first for me, I would walk across fire for my wife and our progeny, that comes before any moral stand for me.

As I said this is how they win, what is an average joe to do? I'd like to sound badass and say come and take em, but in reality I am not in a position to properly defend myself in a court of law, which could in the end lead to me not being able to legally not be able to defend my family in my castle by being a convicted felon.

It's either check mate and they won, or stall shit in court until the people can wake up (which is not guaranteed) and vote these asshats out of office.

I'm most seriously concerned for the future of my state and eventually my country. Leftists ruin everything.

ETA - Just today mailed in my renewal for CHP (CCW), I wonder what's going to happen moving forward with that? Luckily I will be getting it in Dec. with five year card, prior to next session.

All this spewing isn't going to do a thing. What is needed is to do whatever is necessary to get these stupid laws in front of the Supreme Court. Because with a good sound approach it's quite possible that SCOTUS could rule this law as unconstitutional.

One path may be to plead that this law is unlawful taxation. IIRC we had a recent ruling in regards to Asset Seizure that this particular practice violates the Constitution's limits on excessive taxes and fines. So, a law that destroys the asset value of a high value firearm should also fall under the protections against excessive taxes and fines. Then there is the destruction of he value of all those magazines that are suddenly illegal.

Another approach is to go Second Amendment. Hey it worked for Washington vs. Heller. So why not Virginia vs. Citizens of Virginia.

Then there is the Discrimination aspect. Per the Constitution it's not permitted to discriminate based on Race, Creed, or Color. Hey, our Creed is Shooting and Firearms.

These are just a few avenues that I cooked up on the spur of the moment. So how about listing all the various ways that we could sue Virginia and try and push that up to SCOTUS.

I'll also note that every Virginia resident who is effected by this law should take the time to Sue the State of Virginia for the economic harm this law causes. Basically have a half million to a million gun owners all file suit on the the day this law passes. Clog the Courts up so badly in the state that not a damned thing can be done.

I would hope EVERY gun owner in the state of Virginia is an NRA member. That goes for every member on a gun forum and every US citizen that owns one gun or many. Right now there is about 5 million (I believe) members in the NRA. There should be over 50 million. AARP for example has around 38 million members and are one of the strongest lobbyists. The NRA could be too. But they need more members.
Fighting these laws in blue states will be tough to do by yourself. And voting certain politicians in or out will be easier said than done. If the majority of people in a given state want Democrats in control, then the “people have spoken”.
An organization like the NRA should be able to influence what gun laws are passed. But right now the NRA is spread very thin with fighting all of these blue states and various gun laws.
I live in WA, and I can’t think of a time when I got a discount on ammo or a pistol or rifel for being a NRA member. This would encourage more people to join and keep their membership and give the NRA millions more to fight draconian gun laws in a given state.

Respectfully, given all the late in-house problems with the NRA, I don't find that to be a solution. At least not right now. I'm about an hour's drive from you. The NRA has been how engaged with us about I594 or I1639? The NRA ILA did exactly what about either? Have you been keeping up? Have you made it to a local gunshop and signed I1094 to repeal I1639?

My point is, we can fight delaying actions locally in some states like Washington, but counting on the NRA to come charging in like a shining white knight on a silver clad steed to rescue us if we only get enough people to enroll in the NRA is, well... just put a Unicorn horn's on the knight's steed to complete the picture. Fantasy.

VA borders Washington, D.C. Norfolk is about 200 miles away.

There was a 2A Rally in D.C. 17 days ago, on a Saturday. There were numerous YT videos and advertising about it. There was a thread over in the Gun Control area, 3 of the 4 responses were by the OP. The one other respondent said the rally was stupid.

Only a couple thousand folks could be bothered to show up

Perhaps VA residents might consider rethinking their participation level in the political process. Simply complaining doesn't achieve much. Neither does saying 'Somebody [else, not me] should X,Y,Z...'

Boss

“Have you made it to a local gunshop and signedI1094 to repeal I1639?”

Yes I have. And I’m a member. Not being a member makes no sense. Relying on others to be members and saving annual dues doesn’t make sense either.
Right now I’m not aware of an alternative to the NRA.

I’m not going to further derail the thread more than I have. The NRA has a raft of problems to deal with before they’re going to be much help to any of us. They’re not sunk, but they’re damaged goods to be sure.

The NRA, as it stands now, will not save any of us. We need to be looking at more and different solutions rather than rely on the NRA. You need to make yourself aware of the alternatives if you haven’t even heard of them yet. Time to get involved and stop simply cutting checks to La Pierre’s Lifestyle of the Rich and Famous.

If New Jersey and Connecticut are telling their respective states to go to hell by their actions, I have to believe Virginia will follow suit. I know I would.

Yes, one can find fault with the NRA, but we’re much better with them than without. I’ve been a life member but recently joined GOA too.

https://thelibertarianrepublic...s-organizations-nra/

So many things come incrementally, just a little at a time. After a while it just becomes accepted, by most.

I’m a member of NRA, GOA, and VCDL, the county GOP, etc... I made calls, knocked on doors, and worked events. The only way we are going to beat this mess is but getting involved. We have to spread the word and get like minded people out to vote.

Everyone who wants to bitch about different organizations, including the NRA needs to get involved. The members are the ones who need to step up and take charge and do something outside of just sending money. Stand up for what you believe in.

The leftists have a hard on for Georgia also.

Stacy gap tooth Abrams made it clear that if she was elected, a draconian communist government would be the first order of business to punish conservative voters. She nearly won.

We were living in Western NY when the SAFE Act was passed during the night. I could not believe that it would stand given the general firearm police state that already existed in NY. (I was wrong).
Then and now they control any handguns with a heavy hand. The process of transferring a legacy handgun into NY is extremely complicated in most counties, and it is also illegal to CCW any pistol not listed on your permit.

What most people did who owned ARs, tactical shotguns and service rifles (pretty much anything more sophisticated than a Topper Deluxe was/is an "assault rifle" under NY's definition) was to move their firearms/magazines across into Pennsylvania.
(And I might note that Chautauqua County was one of the more reasonable counties).

Fortunately Lakewood/Jamestown NY was only 7 or so miles from the PA border and the nearby village of Sugar Grove. Those that could afford it rented rooms from people they trusted and moved their safes there. The better heeled rented/bought small houses in PA and shifted their collections there. Quite a few people (that could) sold their houses and moved.

I was very fortunate in that we moved out of NY in 2013 when they were instituting SAFE Act laws.

Lee County VA becomes 2nd Amendment sanctuary, Sheriff says gun rights will not be infringed

https://wcyb.com/news/local/le...ill-not-be-infringed

LEE COUNTY, Va. — One day after the Lee County Sheriff's Office said they would stand up to state or federal officials that infringed upon gun rights, the Lee County Board of Supervisors voted 4-1 to make the county a Second Amendment sanctuary.

According to Sheriff Gary Parsons, the designation is a statement saying the county is a safe place for gun owners where their rights won't be taken away. The statement also means the county won't support any gun laws that try to take away gun rights.

The resolution was introduced by D.D. Leonard, the district 5 member of the Lee County Board of Supervisors. Leonard says he's worked on the resolution since election day.

"We're trying to come together and join forces to make a statement that we don't want our second amendment rights infringed upon," Leonard says.

On Monday, the Lee County Sheriff's Office made a Facebook post assuring residents that the department will stand up for the Second Amendment and the Constitution.

Lee County Virginia Sheriff's Office
on Monday

I want to assure the citizens of Lee County that me and my officers will stand up to any federal or state agency that attempts to infringe upon our gun rights. We stand for the Constitution and the second amendment. May God bless Lee County and our great nation.

During a phone call with News 5, Sheriff Parsons reiterated the statement, saying the he would not support the seizure of weapons in any way, whether it be financial support or cooperation with state and federal officials. Leonard agreed with Parsons.

"I would like to see all the adjoining counties come together and join us in trying to protect our rights, and especially our second amendment right," said Leonard.

^^^^ Excellent.

^^^^ Even more excellent if he and his officers would forcibly stop State officials from attempting to take legally owned firearms.