SIGforum.com Main Page The Lounge Was I right to think this motorcycle dealership was giving me the shaft?
Main Page The Lounge Was I right to think this motorcycle dealership was giving me the shaft?Go | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
Not really from Vienna |
They were counting on you having such a giant boner for the bike that you'd sign on despite the bad deal they were offering on it. Many car dealers do the same thing. Add-ons are major profit centers for the dirty bastards. | |||
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| Member! |
My dumb ass thought I was actually being generous with thinking paying full MSRP and a few hundred more after taxes to support a local business was reasonable as I was basing my offer on the Internet cycletrader.com advertisements in other state dealers that were advertising the 2016 models for $3999.99 new. Unfortunately this is the only local KTM dealer that had the motorcycle. Yes, I was unaware of all the BS fees, but come on, there is an easy advertisement guide called the Internet so I had a price in my mind that seemed generous. As soon as the sales guy said the too-high price is not moveable, I walked. I'm not there to play bargaining games with some asshole saleman. I knew what I wanted, and I was there to hand over what I thought was a very reasonable amount of cash (when compared to what other dealers were asking for online for the same 2016 model) and ride away. Sorry, that I am an old codger that way.. | |||
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Member |
Yes, you were being over charged. Especially, for last year's model. The 2017 model is getting updated so they should be discounting any leftovers. Have you looked around for a used, low mileage Duke? | |||
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| Not really from Vienna |
The other thing I take into consideration is that if I was to purchase from a dealer who tries to pull that kind of chickenshit stuff during a sale, what can I expect from them if a need for warranty or other repairs comes up in the future? I won't do business with that type of dealer. | |||
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| Member! |
Doesn't matter now. I ended up with an excellent used 2005 Yamaha FZ6 with 9500 miles from Craigslist for $2800. While I could have gone to another dealer a few hundred miles away to get the KTM duke a lot cheaper (after the local dealer wanted what I considered far too much), it simply wasn't worth the time and effort simply so I could have my 1st "brand new" vehicle. | |||
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| Oh stewardess, I speak jive.  |
I'll probably never buy another new vehicle or bike again in my life, for these and other reasons. It simply isn't worth the teeny bit of satisfaction a new item might bring ya. | |||
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| Official forum SIG Pro enthusiast  |
All those add on fees, taxes etc and the SUPER FAST depreciation of new motos is why I have yet to buy one brand new. The Duke 390 looks like a fun motorcycle but for that money a used 600-750cc bike is going to offer way more bang for buck. I've been wanting a KTM 690 Enduro R badly but I can't bring myself to drop that kind of $$$ for a extremely nice street legal dirt bike. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ The price of liberty and even of common humanity is eternal vigilance | |||
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Always a good idea when making a major purchase! ------------------------- Proverbs 27:17 - As iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another. | |||
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| Member |
When I was looking at bikes a few years ago I went into a local place called Honda House. I was looking at lower end Honda's around 6-8k. After about 10 mins the sales guy finally got done talking to his lady friend to acknowledge me as a customer. I asked if they had any deals going on. He replied this isnt kmart. We dont have blue light specials. I then walked out and went up the road to another shop and low and behold they have signs on the bikes with discount prices. I would never go back there for a 10 cent part. | |||
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| Member |
Because that would mean he would have taken the time to drive there, engage with a salesperson, get into the dealing...and then not deal. It's like getting ready for sex and then putting your pants back on and leaving thinking she might not put out.
Very much so. Cash is a huge turn off as we get points toward allocation of more new units for finance penetration, points toward our dealer ranking, and a couple of dollars of fiance reserve. Also increases our chance of selling a back end product by about 75%.
Some dealers are just stupid. If the bike stays on the floor, I can't get paid. I'm not a curator at a museum, the metal has to move...and at a profit for me to make my living. Some dealers can't and will not figure that out.
Interesting, we only let A Tech's do new bike PDI's because of the liability to our dealership if the bike was improperly setup and the customer where to crash and injure themselves as a result.
Did you lose a wife or an girlfriend to a salesman or something? I'm looking at a factory invoice right this second and on this particular bike the crate charge (freight) is $390 added to the cost of the unit by the OEM. It's rare that we get to chuckle in this business, it's a pretty thankless job providing people the means to get out on the road and enjoy themselves.
Soooo...why are dealers the dirty bastards, and not say...a Snap-On tool truck? Or a construction company? You do know the average total GP in a vehicle transaction is less than 20%, and there's about 100% in total markup in the construction of a new home? People aren't cursing home builders and general contractors...
So how is asking the customer for the MSRP of a unit plus the associated fee's to put the bike on the road chickenshit stuff? Is a realtor asking for closing fees chickenshit? It's just part of the process my friend, like it or not.
Definitely a lack of training there, the salesman could have handled that MUCH better. IDPA ESP SS | |||
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| Thank you Very little  |
Freight on bikes is an add on to the dealers cost from the factory, it's not a dealer add on to the price. Granted the factory could have some back room deal on discounted freight based on units sold but they still add the freight to the unit cost. Bikes are not completely assembled out of the box, they have to be prepped the bars installed, battery hooked up, fluids, run a pre delivery check that all bolts, nuts etc are tight, you can as a customer call that a cost of doing business and you would be correct the dealer also has the option to charge for it, your job is to either pay it or not, Paperwork fees are a big no for me, I'll walk off a deal on those, that's part of your business, you cannot sell a bike/car without doing the paperwork and it's the dealers cost. You get what you negotiate, not what you deserve... Its not clear how the OP dealt with the negotiations if at all, if the dealer said, full boat or forget it, walking was the thing to do.... I'd bought the same bike down the road and then road it through the dealers parking lot after LOL | |||
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| Green grass and high tides  |
There are good shops and bad ones. Honest ones and less honest one. Plain and simple. The good ones that want to sell product and build relationships make it easy to do business. The ones that want to talk about all the add on cost's, set up fee's, etc. Only sell at msrp etc. Are primarily selling to those that have no money and no business being there. So imho are no good places to do business. Which what many have indicated in this thread. , "Practice like you want to play in the game" | |||
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| Little ray of sunshine  |
Car and motorcycle dealers have a business model. They have a "list" price, which has only a little to do with the actual price. Then they manipulate the list price to make you feel like you are getting a deal, all while charging other small fees, and earning money on other parts of the transaction (like financing and warranties). They may even try to charge more than the list price if they think the demand is there and people will pay it. And you are expected to negotiate. This adds transaction costs for all parties, and causes significant stress for many people. Grocery stores have a different model. Bread costs $2.00. That's it. Bread is different than a car because no one can afford to negotiate over a $2.00 purchase, but that is really the only difference. One is not better than the other. One model is not "trying to rip you off." It is just business. It would only be a rip off if they sold you the car with a broken engine. Otherwise, it is just a business deal. You enter into it freely. They are trying to get a higher price and you are trying to get a lower price. Are you trying to rip them off? What if you tell the salesman that you can't go over $27,500, even if you know that you'll actually pay $29,000? Is that dishonest? There is trickery and pressure tactics on both sides. That is the game. Now, maybe they would make more money if they all adopted the Carmax model and sold motorcycles at a fixed price with no add-ons. Or maybe not. This model seems pretty well established. The fish is mute, expressionless. The fish doesn't think because the fish knows everything. | |||
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There it is LOL.Thanks for doing us a favor!!!What a joke-you are doing it to make a living. I'm alright it's the rest of the world that's all screwed up! | |||
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| Member |
They have the option to ask whatever they want for a given vehicle just as does a car dealership. You have the option to chose something else. They were not giving you the shaft, they were just not willing to negotiate a price you thought was reasonable. I had a somewhat similar situation with a local car dealer. Made a deal on a specific model, color and interior color. They pull it up for final inspection and the interior is another color. At that point they refused to deal any further. Would not set aside the correct car that they had scheduled for delivery in 2 weeks which I would have been fine with as I was not in any hurry. Basically said, take what we have or leave it. I left it and drove 4 hours to buy what I wanted elsewhere. (ended up with a better deal to the tune of about $2000) | |||
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| Member |
Wonderful post. Unfortunately the fixed price business model on new cars didn't pan out all that well, Saturn and Scion both dumped the practice. As much as we try to avoid the "game" and make things simple...the people somehow want to still play it.
Yes, very funny. If I just wanted to make a living, I would work for my county government which is what I did before. If I just wanted to make a living, I would sell cars or heavy equipment, as it's easier. I prefer to sell toys. The toys I help people buy (some people actually need help from a financial standpoint) end up enriching their lives and help them make new friends, and I like that. Makes it worth going to work in the morning when I can take good care of someone and they appreciate it. IDPA ESP SS | |||
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Member |
There are good dealerships, good salesmen. And then there's what we in this neck of the woods call "stealerships". You did good to find an used bike that pleases you at a price you thought fair. I'd never buy any new vehicle for some of the same reasons others have posted. And now go ride the wheels off it...and smile! ___________________________________________________________ Your right to swing your fist stops just short of the other person's nose... | |||
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Member |
I've never paid sticker for any motorcycle ever. I've owned a number of them, always 1000cc or above sportbikes, many of them in high demand. Anyone charging you sticker is screwing you, so over than that is, completely F'ing you. What am I doing? I'm talking to an empty telephone | |||
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אַרְיֵה |
Years ago, when I lived in the Chicago area, there was a BMW motorcycle dealer who had a reputation for having an excellent service shop and hard-headed attitude along with terrible pricing. He had a red R100RS on the floor, lightly used, that I wanted. We talked for a while, I told him what I was willing to pay for it, total out-the-door, tax, title, tip, etc. (well maybe not a tip), he refused. I took out my checkbook, wrote a check for my top all-inclusive price, and handed him the unsigned check. I told him to call me if he wanted me to come back and sign the check, providing that I had not found something else before he called, and I walked out. He caught up with me outside his store as I was leaving and told me that we had a deal. הרחפת שלי מלאה בצלופחים | |||
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| Little ray of sunshine |
How do you figure they are screwing you? Did the dealer come to your house and make you buy the bike at that price at gunpoint? Don't like the price? Don't buy. Easy peasy lemon squeezy. The fish is mute, expressionless. The fish doesn't think because the fish knows everything. | |||
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