J, it is an expression. Don't be so freak'in Literal for cry'in out loud.

The only people getting screwed are the people screwing themselves by doing business with dealerships that are unreasonable by many who inquire about offerings.

I have never inferred that all dealerships are bad to do business with. But many are imho.

So the informed potential buyer is able to sniff them out and go somewhere else. I personally know of a few of them that are not around anymore because they either did not or would not do business in such away that brought people into their store vs run them off. Never to come back. .Plain and simple.

quote:

Originally posted by V-Tail:
Years ago, when I lived in the Chicago area, there was a BMW motorcycle dealer who had a reputation for having an excellent service shop and hard-headed attitude along with terrible pricing.

He had a red R100RS on the floor, lightly used, that I wanted.

We talked for a while, I told him what I was willing to pay for it, total out-the-door, tax, title, tip, etc. (well maybe not a tip), he refused.

I took out my checkbook, wrote a check for my top all-inclusive price, and handed him the unsigned check. I told him to call me if he wanted me to come back and sign the check, providing that I had not found something else before he called, and I walked out.

He caught up with me outside his store as I was leaving and told me that we had a deal.

That's fantastic! I've walked away on car deals three times and twice got my price after doing so. The first time they let me get all the way back to my car in the pouring rain before calling me back in. The second time, they called me back two days later.

The third time was the best. The dealer called my back the next day and I told him I couldn't come in because I was in my new truck and driving back to Florida from Tennesse. I had flown up that morning and bought a truck for $4,000 less than I was willing to pay the local dealer in Florida.

Cheap plane tickets and the internet are fantastic tools when buying vehicles. My money leaves my wallet on my terms.

quote:

Originally posted by JonDaddy82:

quote:

Originally posted by PHPaul:
JonDaddy, he chose not to pay that much for that bike and put his money back in his pocket. I'm assuming that he decided, based on their asking price, that he wouldn't be able to negotiate it down to a price he'd be willing to pay, so he walked.

How does that make him a bad customer?

Because that would mean he would have taken the time to drive there, engage with a salesperson, get into the dealing...and then not deal. It's like getting ready for sex and then putting your pants back on and leaving thinking she might not put out.

That is the most ridiculous thing I have read in a long time. I own a business too and have been selling very expensive things to people that own ridiculously expensive cars for a long time. They don't have an obligation to buy from me even after we discuss price. I've wasted weeks trying to get a deal done, and it doesn't always happen... It's part of being in sales.

quote:

Originally posted by JonDaddy82:
The toys I help people buy (some people actually need help from a financial standpoint) end up enriching their lives and help them make new friends, and I like that. Makes it worth going to work in the morning when I can take good care of someone and they appreciate it.

This is one of the reasons why people will hang out at a bike shop, but never at a car dealer. There is a social aspect to recreational equipment that doesn't really cross over into buying an appliance.

quote:

Originally posted by old rugged cross:
J, it is an expression. Don't be so freak'in Literal for cry'in out loud.

The only people getting screwed are the people screwing themselves by doing business with dealerships that are unreasonable by many who inquire about offerings.

I have never inferred that all dealerships are bad to do business with. But many are imho.

So the informed potential buyer is able to sniff them out and go somewhere else. I personally know of a few of them that are not around anymore because they either did not or would not do business in such away that brought people into their store vs run them off. Never to come back. .Plain and simple.

Thanks for that. For f sakes :shakes Head:

I always go local first and give them first chance. They won't deal at all, I reach out to other dealers in my area, which is big. All play that hardcore no deal game, I make one call out of state and have the motorcycle crate shipped to my door, bnib. Only hassle is dismantling the crate and having the city pick up the remains. Putting the bike together takes all of 30 minutes. I do the same with cars, lots of people do. Some geographic areas just rape. So I'll fly and drive it back, or have the car shipped. Literally saves thousands of dollars. I'm under no obligation, legally, or otherwise, to spend my own hard earned money locally if they will not negotiate. Hell buying a car or bike out of state is a much better buying experience. Docs go back and forth, and I never leave the house. Weeks later a man in a truck calls me to let me know "I'm 30 minutes out." Delivered to the front of my damn house.

There is a car dealer like that in "West Palm Beach" who is also a "Kia" dealer, that I had bought a vehicle from years ago and wanted another. I walk up to the vehicle I wanted and see another cost of $8,000.00 added to the price of the vehicle. I asked the salesman what it was all about and he said it is for trade in allowance. I asked what the price was for cash and he said the total of both sticker price and the $8,000.00. I then asked him if this was a "just because you can cost",which was the only way it could be as I just bought another vehicle from them a year prior and it did not have the same extra cost. He just kind of looked at me and I walked away. I don't understand the mentality of some of these dealers but it doesn't surprise me. There is a reason they get a bad name.

quote:

Originally posted by cmr076:

quote:

Originally posted by JonDaddy82:

quote:

Originally posted by PHPaul:
JonDaddy, he chose not to pay that much for that bike and put his money back in his pocket. I'm assuming that he decided, based on their asking price, that he wouldn't be able to negotiate it down to a price he'd be willing to pay, so he walked.

How does that make him a bad customer?

Because that would mean he would have taken the time to drive there, engage with a salesperson, get into the dealing...and then not deal. It's like getting ready for sex and then putting your pants back on and leaving thinking she might not put out.

That is the most ridiculous thing I have read in a long time. I own a business too and have been selling very expensive things to people that own ridiculously expensive cars for a long time. They don't have an obligation to buy from me even after we discuss price. I've wasted weeks trying to get a deal done, and it doesn't always happen... It's part of being in sales.

My apologies, I think you misunderstood my post. From what I understood, the OP had a certain amount of money in cash for the unit. It's my understanding that they told him their asking price/total, he was displeased, flashed the cash, and left.

That's being a bad consumer in my book. In my world, if you want to starting dealing or you want a specific deal, then DEAL! Tell the salesperson/sales manager what you want plainly and clearly. If they want you're business and can do the deal, then fantastic, if they can't or won't, then simply move on to the next. I deal with LOTS of people, and my sales are not often made that same day. However often times we'll do a follow up call and the customer will tell us they bought somewhere else. We ask why, and they'll say "because such and such did X price." Naturally our next question would be "did you tell your salesperson about what you wanted to pay or what your budget was?" 9 times out of 10 they say no. Naturally, had they piped up that day we just would have sold the unit right then and there and called it a day. Most people are very poor communicators and don't know how to tell people what they want, despite all of our CIA tactics to extract this information.

quote:

Originally posted by patw:
There is a car dealer like that in "West Palm Beach" who is also a "Kia" dealer, that I had bought a vehicle from years ago and wanted another. I walk up to the vehicle I wanted and see another cost of $8,000.00 added to the price of the vehicle. I asked the salesman what it was all about and he said it is for trade in allowance. I asked what the price was for cash and he said the total of both sticker price and the $8,000.00. I then asked him if this was a "just because you can cost",which was the only way it could be as I just bought another vehicle from them a year prior and it did not have the same extra cost. He just kind of looked at me and I walked away. I don't understand the mentality of some of these dealers but it doesn't surprise me. There is a reason they get a bad name.

Sounds a little stupid on their part. But even these days the amount of uninformed people that walk into certain brand dealerships is still surprising, and dumb customers are a necessity. If they guy before you doesn't get his head torn off on a deal, then it's going to be much tougher to get the great deal that you're after.

Had you bought the KTM, It'd be back in the shop for a bit.
KTM RECALLS 125 AND 390 DUKE

quote:

Originally posted by JonDaddy82:

From what I understood, the OP had a certain amount of money in cash for the unit. It's my understanding that they told him their asking price/total, he was displeased, flashed the cash, and left.

That's being a bad consumer in my book. In my world, if you want to starting dealing or you want a specific deal, then DEAL!

I asked him how much out the door. He gave me a price I considered too high, then I asked if the price was negotiable and he told me "no" (not "how much are you thinking, or maybe if XYZ"). He didn't come back with how much he could negotiate, he just said no the price is not negotiable. I don't live in your world. I tend to take people at their word for intent. If the salesman had wanted a sale and negotiation, there would not have been a firm "no" to my question that ended any further negotiation. Even if he had not meant it, his abruptness with ending my path towards "making a deal" as you call it was over, and I'm not going to chase down every Tom Dick or Harry that works there to see if I could change their minds.

In your world, you apparently think I'm a "bad customer" because I didn't lead off with begging the floor salesman to not fuck me on pricing and then walking when I was told "no, the price was non-negotiable" and that I should then crawl to a manager like you and beg for better pricing. Guess I'll be a bad customer and never give them any business, nor will the 15 +people I told at work the same story.

Such business models may not be illegal, or literally ripping you off, but I generally regard any business model built on obfuscation, unnecessary complications, and any other scheme to increase profits though convoluted bullshit, innumerable add-ons and upcharges, and any other pseudo clever bullshit as highly, highly skeptical and ones I generally avoid on principle, like I would avoid a traveling Carney who looks like a perv.

Just post the damn price, and quit fucking around. Price it fairly, be honest about margins and what costs what and why, and I'll decide based on the facts and merits, not some bologna that's purely intended to fool some, and paint lipstick on a pig for extra profits (extended warranties, and all other fees and schemes included, much of which was cooked up by some dickhead to specifically BE complicated, convoluted, and have a put on air of legitimacy and necessity). Fuck every single bit if that, legal or not.

Profits are fine.

Bullshit is not.

I vote with my wallet.

quote:

Was I right to think this motorcycle dealership was giving me the shaft?

No you are wrong, that is definitely a chain drive.

quote:

Originally posted by Xer0:

quote:

Originally posted by JonDaddy82:

From what I understood, the OP had a certain amount of money in cash for the unit. It's my understanding that they told him their asking price/total, he was displeased, flashed the cash, and left.

That's being a bad consumer in my book. In my world, if you want to starting dealing or you want a specific deal, then DEAL!

I asked him how much out the door. He gave me a price I considered too high, then I asked if the price was negotiable and he told me "no" (not "how much are you thinking, or maybe if XYZ"). He didn't come back with how much he could negotiate, he just said no the price is not negotiable. I don't live in your world. I tend to take people at their word for intent. If the salesman had wanted a sale and negotiation, there would not have been a firm "no" to my question that ended any further negotiation. Even if he had not meant it, his abruptness with ending my path towards "making a deal" as you call it was over, and I'm not going to chase down every Tom Dick or Harry that works there to see if I could change their minds.

In your world, you apparently think I'm a "bad customer" because I didn't lead off with begging the floor salesman to not fuck me on pricing and then walking when I was told "no, the price was non-negotiable" and that I should then crawl to a manager like you and beg for better pricing. Guess I'll be a bad customer and never give them any business, nor will the 15 +people I told at work the same story.

My apologies, I did not know they said a firm "no" to your offer. Then certainly in that case there was nothing you can do, and the salesman is poorly trained in how to work with a customer, or involve a manager that WILL work with a customer. Typically stores with that level of training don't stick around all that long. Again, my apologies, I didn't know that an offer was made and declined. On the brighter side, and FZ6 is a much faster, more comfortable, and more reliable unit, enjoy it!

quote:

Originally posted by straightshooter01:

quote:

Was I right to think this motorcycle dealership was giving me the shaft?

No you are wrong, that is definitely a chain drive.

LOLOLOL!!!!!!!!!!

quote:

fuckyouintheass fees... etc..

The etc in this case would be $99.95 if you wanted them to use

I've now bought more than a 100 new motorcycles (scary). Unless its rare (I've bought a few of those for sure), BUT I would NEVER pay more than MSRP. and in at least 95% of my purchases I've paid way less than that. A KTM street bike is not something to sweat. Call every dealer you are willing to drive to and get the best price. Carry on.