One crew member dies, another hospitalized after Alec Baldwin shoots two people on set of his film

October 24, 2021, 04:48 PM

can someone confirm that Mrs. Reed was the Armorer for the whole film and in charge of the weapons when they were out target-shooting, and in charge of the weapons when the negligent discharges happened the day before the fatal shooting?

My understanding of the timeline is:

Cast and crew go out target shooting

1 negligent fire early in week

Stunt double fires 2 negligent discharges the day before the fatal shooting.

Union Crew threatens to leave over safety concerns. Does end up leaving the day of the two negligent discharges.

Negotiated peace, and union crew agrees to return next morning.

Union Crew shows up and starts to unpack gear.

NOn union crew shows up.

The UnionCrew is escorted off the set by security. Including the union armorer.

The Scab crew includes MRS. Reed at this point it is mid-afternoon?

Alec had been practicing, rehearsing the seen for upwards of 1/2 hour 45 min IIRC.

Alex supposedly says "if you make me do this one more time, why don't I shoot you?"

Alex shoots two people with one bullet.

October 24, 2021, 04:49 PM

ulsterman

quote:
Originally posted by Balzé Halzé:
quote:
Originally posted by ulsterman:
The husband of the lady killed is an attorney with Latham & Watkins LLP.

Probably no one here has any idea who Latham & Watkins is, save maybe sdy and wcb.

Yes, this is now turning into a conspiracy theory because Latham & Watkins is a law firm that has relations with the Clintons, Sussman, the whole Russian collusion nonsense, yadda yadda yadda.

But this law firm is huge with thousands of lawyers and dozens of offices. I doubt it has any significance with this shooting whatsoever.

Probably not but when you kill the wife of member of that law firm, things aren't probably going to end well for you (financially).

October 24, 2021, 04:50 PM

Gustofer

quote:
Originally posted by pedropcola:
To the “blame it on the actor” crowd, if I handed a Colt SAA to the average person let alone a gun hating Alec Baldwin, I doubt he could unload it to check. If it was a Colt you have to know how to unload it. It’s not a Ruger, flip open the load gate and pop out rounds even. If I handed a Colt yo most people they couldn’t check it to save their lives. Hell, true story, I rode along with my brother in law when I was in high school. Went to a shots fired call. Turned out wife pulled gun on husband (cheating) and thumb cocked the revolver. After she cooled off and realized she wasn’t going to kill him she didn’t know how to lower hammer so she pointed it at bushes and pulled the trigger. Non gun people don’t know dick about guns.

This isn’t on the actor. If I was 6’4” with handsome good looks, a full head of hair, and an A list actor, I would check the gun myself as would the rest of you ugly gun forum guys. But we aren’t actors and Alec ain’t us. They had lax protocols and poor hiring practices. She will go down and she probably should. (as should others)

Ignorance is no excuse.

October 24, 2021, 04:50 PM

Grayfox54

The point is that if you're an actor who is playing the part of a gunslinger, then you should at least know how to properly handle the gun.
Ignorance is no excuse.
No sympathy for Baldwin at all.

October 24, 2021, 05:00 PM

Mars_Attacks

quote:
Originally posted by pedropcola:
To the “blame it on the actor” crowd, if I handed a Colt SAA to the average person let alone a gun hating Alec Baldwin, I doubt he could unload it to check.

From Wikipedia that you failed to read earlier in the thread:

quote:
"He [Baldwin] compared the screenplay to the 1992 film Unforgiven, and said it was inspired by a true story. When asked about his gun slinging and horse riding skills, he said, "They're always at the ready. I'm an actor of the old school. So if you read my resume – my motorcycle riding, my French, juggling, my horseback riding, my gunplay – is all right at my fingertips at all times."

He claims to be a firearms expert.

He is guilty of pointing a loaded weapon at a woman and killing her with it.

October 24, 2021, 05:03 PM

MikeinNC

DSgrouse, the timeline listed is the way I read it also.

"Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor.” Robert A. Heinlein

“You may beat me, but you will never win.” sigmonkey-2020

“A single round of buckshot to the torso almost always results in an immediate change of behavior.” Chris Baker

October 24, 2021, 05:04 PM

mark60

Maybe several people screwed up but in the end it's on Baldwin. I'd trust anyone on this forum if they handed me a gun and said it was unloaded. I'd trust but I'd still verify for myself.

October 24, 2021, 05:11 PM

DSgrouse

quote:
Originally posted by MikeinNC:
DSgrouse, the timeline listed is the way I read it also.

Baldwin should have checked. The man who handed it to him should have.

Where I have a bit of concern is here:

If Mrs. Reed arrived on set after Baldwin had started rehearsing with the gun. Then, I don't see how blame can be directly put on her.

If she handed the gun to the assistant director saying it was a cold weapon, when she had enough time to properly check, weapons and ammo lockers. Then yes, there can be some blame on her.

If she was in charge the whole time, then yes, there was a major fuck up.

Now if she arrived after Baldwin started rehearsing with the gun then there needs to be a discussion about should she have called stop until she could verify, weapons, blanks, and ammo were all secured separately.

October 24, 2021, 05:28 PM

WaterburyBob

I despise that 'it went off' bullshit they keep spouting.
Baldwin pulled the trigger.

October 24, 2021, 05:47 PM

pedropcola

Well how can I argue with you if you quote Wikipedia. Lol. I read that quote, he claims all kinds of “old school” skills. I doubt every word of it. I bet if you tested him on any of his proclaimed skills he would fail at many of them. Hollywood elite hubris again. It’s part of the mystique. As for the he pointed the gun stuff. Of course he did he’s a fucking trained monkey. Here Mr Baldwin, point it that way and pull on this lever. Great job.

No jury in this country even Texas and Florida would convict him on criminal charges. Actors act. They get handed what is merely a prop to them and perform the scripted act. I can’t stand this guy but until you outlaws guns in Hollywood movies these guys won’t know how to safely handle them.

October 24, 2021, 05:59 PM

Mars_Attacks

He pointed the gun, he pulled the trigger, she died.

100% on him.

From his violent, threatening tweets, it's malice murder to me.

October 24, 2021, 06:04 PM

dsiets

The anti-gun leftists in hollywood profess to be about gun safety. Every Town Alec knows nothing of gun safety. He might know some guns and handled them but that's not the same thing.

October 24, 2021, 06:12 PM

pedropcola

Oh come on. Now these arguments are getting a little silly. His tweets of violence against political opponents literally have nothing to do with this accident. If you can find a tweet saying he wanted to shoot the cinematographer then you would have a point. Also, math. Come on 100%? If he is 100% to blame then what does that leave for the armorer who loaded actual live ammo into a gun, handed it to the actor and told everyone it was safe? 100%, really?

He’s easy to hate. I’m in that camp. He got fucked by the armorer and the assistant director. Two people whose sole job was to ensure the gun was safe. He’s an actor who hits a mark and performs an act upon command. Should he check the gun? I would. I also would bet a thousand bucks that the actor rarely checks the ammo in a gun that is handed to them. Outside of Keanu and Tom Cruise they probably wouldn’t know how. Hell, the armorer admitted she had trouble distinguishing blanks from live ammo. She’s the head armorer for goodness sake.

Malice murder, oh brother.

October 24, 2021, 06:15 PM

P220 Smudge

quote:
Originally posted by mark60:
Maybe several people screwed up but in the end it's on Baldwin. I'd trust anyone on this forum if they handed me a gun and said it was unloaded. I'd trust but I'd still verify for myself.

This is where I’m at with it and I don’t think it’s unreasonable. I think it’s irresponsible to put it all on the armorer, this goes for both the actor who pulled the trigger and the people saying it’s her fault. It’s a chain of errors that ends with the Baldwin pulling the trigger and firing a live round at two people. Whatever happened before that, he pulled the damn trigger, nobody else. Some of the comments I’ve read in this thread simply blow my mind.

October 24, 2021, 06:52 PM

sigmonkey

"LET'S GO, BALDWIN!!!"

October 24, 2021, 06:55 PM

ulsterman

quote:
Originally posted by P220 Smudge:
quote:
Originally posted by mark60:
Maybe several people screwed up but in the end it's on Baldwin. I'd trust anyone on this forum if they handed me a gun and said it was unloaded. I'd trust but I'd still verify for myself.

This is where I’m at with it and I don’t think it’s unreasonable. I think it’s irresponsible to put it all on the armorer, this goes for both the actor who pulled the trigger and the people saying it’s her fault. It’s a chain of errors that ends with the Baldwin pulling the trigger and firing a live round at two people. Whatever happened before that, he pulled the damn trigger, nobody else. Some of the comments I’ve read in this thread simply blow my mind.

Yep.

October 24, 2021, 06:58 PM

jljones

Can’t believe that I’m reading, on a gun forum, that Baldwin isn’t solely at fault.

The train of thought that he is a victim seems to fall hand in hand on how we get gun control pushed on us. You know, guns are so dangerous that it killed a woman and Baldwin isn’t even at fault.......

October 24, 2021, 07:04 PM

DSgrouse

quote:
Originally posted by jljones:
Can’t believe that I’m reading, on a gun forum, that Baldwin isn’t solely at fault.

The train of thought that he is a victim seems to fall hand in hand on how we get gun control pushed on us. You know, guns are so dangerous that it killed a woman and Baldwin isn’t even at fault.......

I wonder what the last 30 years of moral relativism have done to our society.

In the end, Alec, had the gun. He had the ultimate and final responsibility to check it.

We can argue if those who handled it preceding him had their own responsibility. Never the less Alec is in the hot seat and Alec pulled the trigger.

October 24, 2021, 07:05 PM

trapper189

"We had two people accidentally shot on a movie set by a prop gun, we need help immediately," script supervisor Mamie Mitchell.."

See? The gun did it.

October 24, 2021, 07:05 PM

bigdeal

quote:
Originally posted by Lefty Sig:
There are reports that one of the "prop guns" was being used for target practice in the off hours.

In going forward, we can refer to that as complete failure #1. For god sake, if the film crew wanted to play Lone Ranger and plink after hours, give them an AR or 9mm to shoot, you know, something with a round that is totally incompatible with the period firearms used in the movie. If this is true, then the armorer is indeed a complete, inexperienced, buffoon.

quote:
Originally posted by jljones:
Can’t believe that I’m reading, on a gun forum, that Baldwin isn’t solely at fault.

The train of thought that he is a victim seems to fall hand in hand on how we get gun control pushed on us. You know, guns are so dangerous that it killed a woman and Baldwin isn’t even at fault.......

Don't ya think that's a bit of an oversimplification? I absolutely think Baldwin owns 'some' responsibility here. How much? Likely a court will have to establish that. All I've been arguing is that the armorer appears to have completely dropped the ball on her duties, and as such, owns a piece of this as well.