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goodheart |
As a cardiologist who has long been involved in heart disease prevention, as far as I can see e-cigarettes should be encouraged, not discouraged. Perhaps if there were solid evidence that e-cigs are a "gateway drug" for teenagers to smoke real cigarettes, it might change my mind, but I believe the current anti-vaping hysteria is virtue-signaling by leftists who need to control our lives. What say you?
_________________________ “Remember, remember the fifth of November!" | ||
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Thank you Very little |
That quote needs some punctuation help, ie some paragraphs, whew! | |||
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No, not like Bill Clinton |
Don't think the gubmint is getting any tax dollars or regulating it, yet. Surprised they haven't. I used an e-cig set up to quit about six years ago, used it for about a year. It made it very easy to do so. | |||
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goodheart |
That's the kind of thing I like to hear: an effective aid to quitting smoking, which is far more dangerous (if indeed the e-cig is dangerous at all). BTW I re-did the quote, I agree was impossible read. _________________________ “Remember, remember the fifth of November!" | |||
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Irksome Whirling Dervish |
In a medical conversation context having to do with asbestos, I had a good chat with a pulomonary oncologist about vaping, the dangers and so on. He himself smokes. His thoughts from a couple of years ago are that the vaping industry is largely unregulated and the quality and purity of the base liquids and additives isn't always known, if at all. He was concerned with cheaper base chemicals coming from China which isn't known for good quality control on consumable items. His second concern was the lack of long term studies on vaping but that's only because it hasn't been around long enough to follow and study like tobacco but he also said he couldn't imagine there not being negative effects from propylene glycol that's been heated to turn it into a transport medium. Propylene glycol is found in many things including antifreeze but I don't think any of the other uses involve heating it up to 500F before inhaling it. | |||
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W07VH5 |
I'm all for it. I don't smoke, never tried it, but my dad and brother both have health issues from smoking that will most likely be fatal. I am against the blueberry scented vapor. Bleh, smells like vomit. | |||
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Member |
Numerous members of my family are gone from smoking related disease. Smoking and tobacco use in general is stupidity. Vaping seems equally stupid. And it also appears pretentious too. If vaping serves as a means for someone to stop smoking, I guess there is some benefit to it. End of Earth: 2 Miles Upper Peninsula: 4 Miles | |||
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Member |
Whenever I see someone exhaling a big cloud of vapor I get as far away as possible. I have NO IDEA WTF it is they are inhaling. I can however clearly remember when doctors and the media were informing the public that smoking cigarettes was good for you. SO there is that... JMO! | |||
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Mensch |
I stopped reading when I saw this. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ "Yidn, shreibt un fershreibt" "The Nazis entered this war under the rather childish delusion that they were going to bomb everyone else, and nobody was going to bomb them. At Rotterdam, London, Warsaw and half a hundred other places, they put their rather naive theory into operation. They sowed the wind, and now they are going to reap the whirlwind." -Bomber Harris | |||
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Member |
It's a positively stupid habit, but I don't want the government restricting anything more than they already do. | |||
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Member |
I'm a cigarette smoker, and yes I know it is clearly bad for your health, but different than vaping. When the cigarette is finished, there is a time period where you don't light another.....a clear start and stop. Vapors- I see these people toke on their vape virtually almost non stop all day long....it's not like a cigarette where they toke on it over 5 minutes and don't touch it again for an hour. They seem to toke on it every minute, expelling huge clouds of smoke (much more so than cigarettes). Your lungs aren't meant to digest water vapor all day long and whatever chemicals and flavorings are in the vape without regulation and many from China. I don't think they're any safer than cigarettes. As a quitting mechanism- they're not for 9 out of 10 people. 9 out of 10 people just switch to vaping, vape non stop ingesting copious amounts of nicotine, more so than when they smoked. Then as soon as it breaks or runs out of battery whenever that may be.....a month, 6 months down the road etc. They buy a pack of cigarettes and are now smoking twice as many per day. Now, I am no doctor. | |||
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Wait, what? |
Helping someone quit inhaling carcinogenic particulates from burning tobacco is good I suppose, but between the sketchy quality control possibilities and continued addiction, I'm generally against it. Also, I never could piss the amount of money away that smokers do. “Remember to get vaccinated or a vaccinated person might get sick from a virus they got vaccinated against because you’re not vaccinated.” - author unknown | |||
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The Unmanned Writer |
Don't forget those who are actually using marijuana as the substance which is being huffed. Besides, the residual smell just plain reeks. Life moves pretty fast. If you don't stop and look around once in a while, you could miss it. "If dogs don't go to Heaven, I want to go where they go" Will Rogers The definition of the words we used, carry a meaning of their own... | |||
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Baroque Bloke |
Re: smoking and coronary heart disease: www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/6116905 Publication: Lancet. 1981 Oct 10;2(8250):775-7 Title: Serum cotinine levels in pipe smokers: evidence against nicotine as cause of coronary heart disease Authors: Wald NJ, Idle M, Boreham J, Bailey A. Abstract: Serum levels of cotinine (a principal metabolite of nicotine) were studied in men who did not smoke (28), and in men who smoked cigarettes only (150), cigars only (70), and pipes only (56). The mean cotinine level for pipe smokers was 389 ng/ml, significantly higher than the mean level for cigarette and cigar smokers (306 and 121 ng/ml, respectively); no cotinine was detected in the serum from any of the non-smokers. Large prospective studies have shown that pipe smokers have no material excess risk of coronary heart disease but cigarette smokers do, so that our observations indicate that nicotine is unlikely to be the major cause of the excess coronary heart disease mortality in cigarette smokers. Medical College of St. Bartholomew's Hospital Dept. of Environmental and Preventative Medicine (England). http://europepmc.org/abstract/...C1gDwSUkGDWbd48c1t.0 This URL has full text, not just the abstract, but a subscription to ScienceDirect is required. Serious about crackers | |||
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Member |
Propylene glycol is used in cosmetics and on some foodstuff, I believe. It has been studied and has been deemed to be non-toxic. Either way, it is not a carcinogen like tobacco smoke, so I see no reason to disincitivise e-cig if it is reducing smoking. Perhaps the Doc is coming from the idea that all chemicals must be harmful somehow, a common, pervasive, but incorrect, belief. Demand not that events should happen as you wish; but wish them to happen as they do happen, and you will go on well. -Epictetus | |||
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Member |
____________________________________________________ The butcher with the sharpest knife has the warmest heart. | |||
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Irksome Whirling Dervish |
His point acknowledged that the chemical has many uses that are safe and non-toxic but instead opined that there are no long term studies where the chemical is vaporized and breathed in the vaping environment. If you have some studies showing long term heated vapor exposure into the lungs I'm sure he'd be interested. | |||
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Lead slingin' Parrot Head |
A timely topic as I was just having a conversation with a coworker who vapes. He has been doing it since earlier this year and has tapered the nicotine level down, but I don't think he has any intention of completely eliminating his nicotine intake. He has completely quit smoking however and says he has no desire to smoke, even when around other smokers, and actually says the smell of tobacco smoke actually makes him nauseous now. I had gathered a little of this, but apparently vaping has become a bit of a fad and those who do it do it for different reasons. While many do it to quit smoking, apparently some do it to produce as big a cloud of vapor as possible, while others, such as my co-worker, apparently are "chasing the taste" and constantly trying different flavors. Apparently the E cigs can be bought ready to vape, or you can buy kits, and several of the serious vapers are customizing their builds, some to increase/decrease the nicotine intake, some more cloud, and some more flavor. I have no interest in vaping and think it looks silly, and I don't much care for the smell of it or being enveloped in a cloud of vapor...but, if it helps someone quit smoking as it has apparently done for my co-worker, then I'm ok with someone else doing it. | |||
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Member |
No, can't say I have any studies off hand. I know the CDC issued a big report on it, but I don't know if they specifically looked at heated and injested PG through inhalation. I know I've breathed plenty of the stuff from smoke machines at parties. If being heated and vaporized was causing ill effects, you'd think people in the theater business would be showing the effects. Also, it seems like being infused with PG in an IV would be more detrimental than inhalation, since PG is used in many IV drugs. Is there some reason that the Doc feels that heating the propylene glycol changes it into a more toxic or carcinogenic substance? I've never seen any research suggesting that. Not disputing it, just saying I don't know. Demand not that events should happen as you wish; but wish them to happen as they do happen, and you will go on well. -Epictetus | |||
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Member |
If it helps you quit smoking then great but to act like inhaling any chemical other than oxygen isn't good for your health is kidding yourself. Vaping is fairly new so the dangers aren't fully understood yet. There's already talk of popcorn lung and many other future problems. It's just a matter of time before the dangers will come to light. | |||
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